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Post by Error on Sept 21, 2024 13:01:38 GMT -5
There’s a bunch of people in this very thread that are acting like they are saying guaranteed contracts shouldn’t be a thing, which is not the point they were making at all. He's saying guaranteed contracts means young wrestlers don't want to work as hard to prove their worth for the future, with zero evidence of that. So you want him to call out the people he works with or worked with publicly? There is clearly evidence of that from various reports, I named two examples and with guys like Arn and Regal calling it an issue.
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Post by lockedontarget on Sept 21, 2024 13:02:52 GMT -5
See this is what I’m talking about when I say bad faith interpretations.
He’s not saying the contracts are the problem and they shouldn’t exist.
He’s saying that some people take them for granted and don’t understand that the next contract isn’t guaranteed.
Is it couched in some eye-rolling “kids these days” rhetoric? For sure. But, like, he’s absolutely not saying people shouldn’t have guaranteed contracts.
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Post by Citizen Snips on Sept 21, 2024 13:16:13 GMT -5
I’d like to take back the 47 times I’ve called Dax Harwood a dork in this thread (13 additional times in unrelated threads). He’s just a standup guy who may love wrestling just a little too much but that’s no reason for him for him to endure our relentless obsession with his lack of social grace.
This board is getting tough to like again, man.
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Post by Final Countdown Jones on Sept 21, 2024 13:51:53 GMT -5
He's saying guaranteed contracts means young wrestlers don't want to work as hard to prove their worth for the future, with zero evidence of that. So you want him to call out the people he works with or worked with publicly? There is clearly evidence of that from various reports, I named two examples and with guys like Arn and Regal calling it an issue. "I work with a guy who has kind of a crappy attitude" wouldn't evidence of his point anyway; people have been dickheads in wrestling long before there was guaranteed money. Sammy getting a reliable number on his paycheck every week isn't why he's like that, he's an immature dickhead so he's like that. Steveson was apparently head in the clouds off wanting to go do the Olympics instead and wasn't taking wrestling seriously, something that plenty of crossover football and college wrestling guys did in the '90s when they weren't getting definite money for it. There's really nothing backing up that this is 'evidence' that contracts specifically are having this impact. Conversely, Hulk Hogan famously began doing a lot less in the ring when he was a top guy and had that top guy money rolling in than he did when he was grinding in Japan. He was still paid by the gate, sure, but he got his position secure and stopped doing as much.
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Post by darbus alan on Sept 21, 2024 13:56:43 GMT -5
Dax is a bit "old man yelling at clouds", but there's nowhere where he's saying guaranteed contracts are bad. He's saying too many wrestlers who get their first bag can take it for granted and think the gravy train never stops. But there comes a time where it DOES stop and if you get too complacent it ends. And then you're f***ed.
And there's countless examples of not just wrestlers but other professional athletes being bad with their money and taking the life for granted. Especially in the NFL where you're one bad day away from a career ending injury.
Really comes off like people just want to ignore the nuance of what he's saying and latched onto the juicy quote without context.
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Post by A Platypus Rave is Correct on Sept 21, 2024 18:33:30 GMT -5
Dax is a bit "old man yelling at clouds", but there's nowhere where he's saying guaranteed contracts are bad. He's saying too many wrestlers who get their first bag can take it for granted and think the gravy train never stops. But there comes a time where it DOES stop and if you get too complacent it ends. And then you're f***ed. And there's countless examples of not just wrestlers but other professional athletes being bad with their money and taking the life for granted. Especially in the NFL where you're one bad day away from a career ending injury. Really comes off like people just want to ignore the nuance of what he's saying and latched onto the juicy quote without context. Yeah, but that happened when there wasn't guaranteed money too... Hogan coasted for years on his appearance deals. Ric flair is also the counter to that first point he was another that had both millions in PPA and guaranteed contracts... and he's broke now. That's not an argument against contracts, nor is it an argument against "the younger generation" if you are predisposed to do the bare minimum you are going to do the bare minimum, if you think that the money's never going to stop you're going to act like the money is never gonna stop.
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Post by The Heartbreak TWERK on Sept 21, 2024 19:13:17 GMT -5
Dax is a bit "old man yelling at clouds", but there's nowhere where he's saying guaranteed contracts are bad. He's saying too many wrestlers who get their first bag can take it for granted and think the gravy train never stops. But there comes a time where it DOES stop and if you get too complacent it ends. And then you're f***ed. And there's countless examples of not just wrestlers but other professional athletes being bad with their money and taking the life for granted. Especially in the NFL where you're one bad day away from a career ending injury. Really comes off like people just want to ignore the nuance of what he's saying and latched onto the juicy quote without context. I don't remember inviting sensiblie and rational posts!
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A Little Doo Doo
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Post by A Little Doo Doo on Sept 22, 2024 3:39:04 GMT -5
It's true that I've gotten lazy and complacent since FAN gave me my guaranteed deal, though.
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Post by "Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay on Sept 23, 2024 7:57:51 GMT -5
People don't have the incentive to work hard anymore because they're getting paid enough is such a boomer and rich guy take that it crosses into parody. Is this satire? Yeah. It's such a bullshit take on a broad basis, removed from wrestling 'Nobody wants to upsell the Coffee Club membership any more because we're giving them guaranteed contracts' what the f*** are we doing here It's particularly stupid about wrestling, or any creative pursuit. The industry is not made up entirely of retired football players who are here to make money any more because their knee blew out during the playoffs or some shit any more. This is an art form. People across the world are killing themselves for nothing in high school gyms to get the opportunity to be squashed in 60 seconds on TV by people like FTR People have been saying the younger generation is lazy for as long as there has been recorded history.
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Dub H
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Post by Dub H on Sept 23, 2024 9:43:40 GMT -5
I think I kinda get what he's saying and I don't think it's as crazy as he sounds. It's that guys work to get that first deal and then stop. That they don't realize that contact will end and they aren't guaranteed a second or third and he's not wrong. We hear about people not taking stuff seriously or ignoring the agents or vets which will end up costing them down the line. Look at the issues with Sammy or going to WWE, Gable Steveson. Sammy has been in trouble numerous times because he gets careless or doesn't listen to the higher ups. Steveson, ignoring his off the field issues, was criticized for not putting in the work in the ring out studying and when his deal came up WWE let him go and he's got nothing now. There are countless people who want that spot so you have do things to earn the next deal. Not listening to other people has nothign to do with guaranteed contracts. If we count the people WITH guaranteed contracts that clawed their way to the top,it already puts a hole in this logic
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Futureraven: Beelzebruv
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Post by Futureraven: Beelzebruv on Sept 23, 2024 9:57:55 GMT -5
I think I kinda get what he's saying and I don't think it's as crazy as he sounds. It's that guys work to get that first deal and then stop. That they don't realize that contact will end and they aren't guaranteed a second or third and he's not wrong. We hear about people not taking stuff seriously or ignoring the agents or vets which will end up costing them down the line. Look at the issues with Sammy or going to WWE, Gable Steveson. Sammy has been in trouble numerous times because he gets careless or doesn't listen to the higher ups. Steveson, ignoring his off the field issues, was criticized for not putting in the work in the ring out studying and when his deal came up WWE let him go and he's got nothing now. There are countless people who want that spot so you have do things to earn the next deal. Not listening to other people has nothign to do with guaranteed contracts. If we count the people WITH guaranteed contracts that clawed their way to the top,it already puts a hole in this logic Yeah, if you're on a guaranteed contract, well, you work hard so the NEXT one will be bigger if that's your nature. If you don't, you'll be found out and out of the company soon enough. There's always been your Van Hammers, your Bagwells etc. who coast by, your Warriors who get everything then it all goes away, that's just people.
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Post by Dub H on Sept 23, 2024 10:58:17 GMT -5
People don't have the incentive to work hard anymore because they're getting paid enough is such a boomer and rich guy take that it crosses into parody. Is this satire? Yeah. It's such a bullshit take on a broad basis, removed from wrestling 'Nobody wants to upsell the Coffee Club membership any more because we're giving them guaranteed contracts' what the f*** are we doing here It's particularly stupid about wrestling, or any creative pursuit. The industry is not made up entirely of retired football players who are here to make money any more because their knee blew out during the playoffs or some shit any more. This is an art form. People across the world are killing themselves for nothing in high school gyms to get the opportunity to be squashed in 60 seconds on TV by people like FTR People have been saying the younger generation is lazy for as long as there has been recorded history. There is ancient greek texts complaining on how the younger generation is complacent The moral of the story is, we should go back to the ancient ways of our people,since every generation clearly got lazier
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Post by Soultastic on Sept 23, 2024 11:19:29 GMT -5
Yeah. It's such a bullshit take on a broad basis, removed from wrestling 'Nobody wants to upsell the Coffee Club membership any more because we're giving them guaranteed contracts' what the f*** are we doing here It's particularly stupid about wrestling, or any creative pursuit. The industry is not made up entirely of retired football players who are here to make money any more because their knee blew out during the playoffs or some shit any more. This is an art form. People across the world are killing themselves for nothing in high school gyms to get the opportunity to be squashed in 60 seconds on TV by people like FTR People have been saying the younger generation is lazy for as long as there has been recorded history. There is ancient greek texts complaining on how the younger generation is complacent The moral of the story is, we should go back to the ancient ways of our people,since every generation clearly got lazier Now I want FTR's gimmick to be "RETURN TO MONKEY".
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