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Post by Alice Syndrome on Apr 1, 2023 7:45:57 GMT -5
Imagine looking at Gisele Shaw and saying she's a man. Like, THIS Gisele Shaw.  I made the mistake of looking deep into the replies to replies and saw some guy saying the usual dumb shit transphobe say, and finished it with "ask any straight man if they'd date Gisele Shaw, they'd say no". Which yes, is dumb because a womanhood doesn't come from whether men want to date you, but its also absurd on its face because look at her. He'll claim they can always tell but like, I can guarantee you, apart from a few people she told in confidence, Noone knew until she came out last year. |
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Gunhaver
Bubba Ho-Tep
"Gunhaver! You actually have a gun!"
Posts: 639
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Post by Gunhaver on Apr 1, 2023 8:06:41 GMT -5
No disrespect to anyone here, but some of the things you guys are saying is setting a bad precedent. Yes, in a perfect world, it wouldn't matter if someone has changed their sex. But in this imperfect world, a trans person who doesn't disclose that they are trans is setting themselves up for trouble. Most straight men will see Gisele as a man regardless of how many surgeries Gisele has had. No disrespect, but this is an incredibly bad take. Bigots will be bigots regardless of what their chosen outgroup does; it's one of the reasons some folks aren't public about gender identity. The idea trans people are setting themselves up for trouble by waiting to disclose their identity puts the responsibility for these reactions on them and not the folks harboring baseless hate. And the idea that immediately disclosing gender identity somehow generates less negative attention from bigots is wishful thinking at best and naive at worst. |
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Post by The Barber on Apr 1, 2023 8:11:11 GMT -5
No disrespect to anyone here, but some of the things you guys are saying is setting a bad precedent. Yes, in a perfect world, it wouldn't matter if someone has changed their sex. But in this imperfect world, a trans person who doesn't disclose that they are trans is setting themselves up for trouble. Most straight men will see Gisele as a man regardless of how many surgeries Gisele has had. No disrespect, but this is an incredibly bad take. Bigots will be bigots regardless of what their chosen outgroup does; it's one of the reasons some folks aren't public about gender identity. The idea trans people are setting themselves up for trouble by waiting to disclose their identity puts the responsibility for these reactions on them and not the folks harboring baseless hate. And the idea that immediately disclosing gender identity somehow generates less negative attention from bigots is wishful thinking at best and naive at worst. Then may I ask, what should a man do if he finds out that the person he is with is trans? Just shrug his shoulders? I hate to tell you this, but that won't be most men's reactions. I'm not agreeing with it, but it's the truth. |
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Post by Alice Syndrome on Apr 1, 2023 8:18:59 GMT -5
No disrespect to anyone here, but some of the things you guys are saying is setting a bad precedent. Yes, in a perfect world, it wouldn't matter if someone has changed their sex. But in this imperfect world, a trans person who doesn't disclose that they are trans is setting themselves up for trouble. Most straight men will see Gisele as a man regardless of how many surgeries Gisele has had. No disrespect, but this is an incredibly bad take. Bigots will be bigots regardless of what their chosen outgroup does; it's one of the reasons some folks aren't public about gender identity. The idea trans people are setting themselves up for trouble by waiting to disclose their identity puts the responsibility for these reactions on them and not the folks harboring baseless hate. And the idea that immediately disclosing gender identity somehow generates less negative attention from bigots is wishful thinking at best and naive at worst. You ever notice how to some people, trans people who go stealth are "liars" but if they're open and up front about it they're "shoving their agenda in your face"? |
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Post by This Player Hating Mothman on Apr 1, 2023 8:19:42 GMT -5
No disrespect, but this is an incredibly bad take. Bigots will be bigots regardless of what their chosen outgroup does; it's one of the reasons some folks aren't public about gender identity. The idea trans people are setting themselves up for trouble by waiting to disclose their identity puts the responsibility for these reactions on them and not the folks harboring baseless hate. And the idea that immediately disclosing gender identity somehow generates less negative attention from bigots is wishful thinking at best and naive at worst. Then may I ask, what should a man do if he finds out that the person he is with is trans? Just shrug his shoulders? I hate to tell you this, but that won't be most men's reactions. I'm not agreeing with it, but it's the truth. Okay so putting aside that trans panic defenses are f***ing garbage and awful, Gisele was not having sex with Rick Steiner. Gisele was doing a public signing as a wrestler who people like at a wrestling convention, and he yelled at her at her table while she was doing her job. That's not about sex, that's not about genitals, that's not about any of what you're talking about. That's hatred. That's simple, pure hatred, and honestly with you bringing out the idea of "trans people are deceivers to men in relationships" you're not actually proving much better than ol' Rick is. Just absolutely despicable posting here. |
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Dragonfly
Samurai Cop
...is no Barry Windham.
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Post by Dragonfly on Apr 1, 2023 8:22:58 GMT -5
No disrespect, but this is an incredibly bad take. Bigots will be bigots regardless of what their chosen outgroup does; it's one of the reasons some folks aren't public about gender identity. The idea trans people are setting themselves up for trouble by waiting to disclose their identity puts the responsibility for these reactions on them and not the folks harboring baseless hate. And the idea that immediately disclosing gender identity somehow generates less negative attention from bigots is wishful thinking at best and naive at worst. Then may I ask, what should a man do if he finds out that the person he is with is trans? Just shrug his shoulders? Yes. Yes he should. The end. |
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Post by Muskrat on Apr 1, 2023 8:29:06 GMT -5
Imagine looking at Gisele Shaw and saying she's a man. Like, THIS Gisele Shaw. If she hadn't come out as trans, I would've never have ever guessed that she was. I literally found out she was trans about 10pm last night when I read about this incident online. I was confused AF when I was first reading the article because I had zero clue she was trans |
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Post by This Player Hating Mothman on Apr 1, 2023 8:31:38 GMT -5
I love this weird shit where we have to pretend that straight men don't date and aren't attracted to trans women when I know so many trans women who get lonely straight dudes in their twitter DMs just f***ing drooling over them constantly. If you just don't know any trans people you end up with zero scale of just how attracted to trans women many, many straight men are. Which is all also not getting into the idea of trans women who are attracted to. Other women? Like why the f*** is this woman's dignity being centered around if men would date her as a singular stake-in-the-ground issue for why people in this thread are saying Wrong Things?
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salz4life
Grimlock
Prichard is a guy who gets that his job is to service his boss.
Posts: 13,891
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Post by salz4life on Apr 1, 2023 8:32:17 GMT -5
Imagine looking at Gisele Shaw and saying she's a man. Like, THIS Gisele Shaw. Is she trans? If so, I didn't know. Sucks this had to happen. edit: Should've kept reading first. My bad. |
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Post by lockedontarget on Apr 1, 2023 8:34:43 GMT -5
No disrespect to anyone here, but some of the things you guys are saying is setting a bad precedent. Yes, in a perfect world, it wouldn't matter if someone has changed their sex. But in this imperfect world, a trans person who doesn't disclose that they are trans is setting themselves up for trouble. Most straight men will see Gisele as a man regardless of how many surgeries Gisele has had. lol trans people that fully “disclose” who they are also get massive amounts of abuse. Get lost with this victim-blaming shit. Tans women are women. |
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Post by 1 Free Moon-Down with Burger on Apr 1, 2023 8:36:35 GMT -5
Reading through Rick Steiner’s flow chart.
I think since I don’t like him, I’m gonna have to bite him.
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coleslaw
Don Corleone
Steve Sniffs
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Post by coleslaw on Apr 1, 2023 8:37:55 GMT -5
No disrespect to anyone here, but some of the things you guys are saying is setting a bad precedent. Yes, in a perfect world, it wouldn't matter if someone has changed their sex. But in this imperfect world, a trans person who doesn't disclose that they are trans is setting themselves up for trouble. Most straight men will see Gisele as a man regardless of how many surgeries Gisele has had. I struggle to think of any context where a trans person needs to disclose that they're trans besides talking to their doctor or sexual partners. Other than that, I don't really think it's anybody's business, especially with the increasingly harmful attitude towards trans people in today's society. I think it should be up to the individual if they want to go public with it or not |
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Post by 1 Free Moon-Down with Burger on Apr 1, 2023 8:40:48 GMT -5
No disrespect to anyone here, but some of the things you guys are saying is setting a bad precedent. Yes, in a perfect world, it wouldn't matter if someone has changed their sex. But in this imperfect world, a trans person who doesn't disclose that they are trans is setting themselves up for trouble. Most straight men will see Gisele as a man regardless of how many surgeries Gisele has had. I struggle to think of any context where a trans person needs to disclose that they're trans besides talking to their doctor or sexual partners. Other than that, I don't really think it's anybody's business, especially with the increasingly harmful attitude towards trans people in today's society. I think it should be up to the individual if they want to go public with it or not Yeah, I think like in a relationship or whatever it’s probably best to divulge that information just to get things on the table, like political or religious affiliations or whatever. But outside of that, like. Who cares. |
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Post by The Barber on Apr 1, 2023 8:41:48 GMT -5
No disrespect to anyone here, but some of the things you guys are saying is setting a bad precedent. Yes, in a perfect world, it wouldn't matter if someone has changed their sex. But in this imperfect world, a trans person who doesn't disclose that they are trans is setting themselves up for trouble. Most straight men will see Gisele as a man regardless of how many surgeries Gisele has had. I struggle to think of any context where a trans person needs to disclose that they're trans besides talking to their doctor or sexual partners. Other than that, I don't really think it's anybody's business, especially with the increasingly harmful attitude towards trans people in today's society. I think it should be up to the individual if they want to go public with it or not Like I said earlier, in a perfect world, it wouldn't matter. But, we don't live in a perfect world. It's nice to think this way, but it truly isn't realistic. |
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coleslaw
Don Corleone
Steve Sniffs
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Post by coleslaw on Apr 1, 2023 8:49:03 GMT -5
I struggle to think of any context where a trans person needs to disclose that they're trans besides talking to their doctor or sexual partners. Other than that, I don't really think it's anybody's business, especially with the increasingly harmful attitude towards trans people in today's society. I think it should be up to the individual if they want to go public with it or not Like I said earlier, in a perfect world, it wouldn't matter. But, we don't live in a perfect world. It's nice to think this way, but it truly isn't realistic. Genuinely, I'm not understanding your point here. What's the importance of disclosing that she's trans in this scenario? |
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Post by This Player Hating Mothman on Apr 1, 2023 8:49:09 GMT -5
Not coming out is setting you up for trouble, as opposed to coming out, where Rick Steiner harasses you at a signing. Sorry buddy, that's just the world we live in. Also as an aside men won't have sex with you, just thoguht you should know that very relevant piece of information that absolutely has a place in this discussion.
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Post by The Barber on Apr 1, 2023 8:50:08 GMT -5
No disrespect, but this is an incredibly bad take. Bigots will be bigots regardless of what their chosen outgroup does; it's one of the reasons some folks aren't public about gender identity. The idea trans people are setting themselves up for trouble by waiting to disclose their identity puts the responsibility for these reactions on them and not the folks harboring baseless hate. And the idea that immediately disclosing gender identity somehow generates less negative attention from bigots is wishful thinking at best and naive at worst. You ever notice how to some people, trans people who go stealth are "liars" but if they're open and up front about it they're "shoving their agenda in your face"? They should be open about it and any abuse they may face is horrible. I support anyone who is gay, straight, lesbian, etc. being open about themselves. Then may I ask, what should a man do if he finds out that the person he is with is trans? Just shrug his shoulders? I hate to tell you this, but that won't be most men's reactions. I'm not agreeing with it, but it's the truth. Okay so putting aside that trans panic defenses are f***ing garbage and awful, Gisele was not having sex with Rick Steiner. Gisele was doing a public signing as a wrestler who people like at a wrestling convention, and he yelled at her at her table while she was doing her job. That's not about sex, that's not about genitals, that's not about any of what you're talking about. That's hatred. That's simple, pure hatred, and honestly with you bringing out the idea of "trans people are deceivers to men in relationships" you're not actually proving much better than ol' Rick is. Just absolutely despicable posting here. Like I typed earlier, Rick was in the wrong about what he did. I am not making excuses for it and to assume that I am is a huge misnomer on your part. Questioning the trans movement doesn't make one bigoted (just like everything else on Earth should be questioned). Then may I ask, what should a man do if he finds out that the person he is with is trans? Just shrug his shoulders? Yes. Yes he should. The end.  I love this weird shit where we have to pretend that straight men don't date and aren't attracted to trans women when I know so many trans women who get lonely straight dudes in their twitter DMs just f***ing drooling over them constantly. If you just don't know any trans people you end up with zero scale of just how attracted to trans women many, many straight men are. Which is all also not getting into the idea of trans women who are attracted to. Other women? Like why the f*** is this woman's dignity being centered around if men would date her as a singular stake-in-the-ground issue for why people in this thread are saying Wrong Things? I'd hate to tell you this, but most men don't want to be with a trans woman because they feel that they are still men in their eyes. I talk to many people (both men and women) who feel that way and not just a small minority of people. No disrespect to anyone here, but some of the things you guys are saying is setting a bad precedent. Yes, in a perfect world, it wouldn't matter if someone has changed their sex. But in this imperfect world, a trans person who doesn't disclose that they are trans is setting themselves up for trouble. Most straight men will see Gisele as a man regardless of how many surgeries Gisele has had. lol trans people that fully “disclose” who they are also get massive amounts of abuse. Get lost with this victim-blaming shit. Tans women are women. |
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Zone Was Wrong
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Currently living off the high that AEW brings every Wednesday and Friday
Posts: 15,934
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Post by Zone Was Wrong on Apr 1, 2023 8:54:33 GMT -5
Had to delete a whole bit because I ended up saying f*** so many times it ended up looking a bit messy. In essence, Rick Steiner can go f*** himself with a rusty fork. In a world where trans men and women are murdered in increasing rates, bills are made to constantly f*** them over, and more and more people decide to target them rather than give a shit about real issues in this world, we do no need shit heads like him. And especially f*** this discourse about disclosure and whatnot. It's veiled transphobia in it's essence and it pisses me off.
You know what trans people would like most in this world? To have an average life expectancy for one. Pretty sure what they don't want are dog faced asshole saying abusive shit from across the room at a convention.
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Post by The Zombie Mod The on Apr 1, 2023 8:56:14 GMT -5
locking this for 10 minutes so everyone can take a breather.
thread's re-open play nice, no one wants to miss mania weekend here.
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Gunhaver
Bubba Ho-Tep
"Gunhaver! You actually have a gun!"
Posts: 639
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Post by Gunhaver on Apr 1, 2023 9:23:06 GMT -5
No disrespect, but this is an incredibly bad take. Bigots will be bigots regardless of what their chosen outgroup does; it's one of the reasons some folks aren't public about gender identity. The idea trans people are setting themselves up for trouble by waiting to disclose their identity puts the responsibility for these reactions on them and not the folks harboring baseless hate. And the idea that immediately disclosing gender identity somehow generates less negative attention from bigots is wishful thinking at best and naive at worst. Then may I ask, what should a man do if he finds out that the person he is with is trans? Just shrug his shoulders? I hate to tell you this, but that won't be most men's reactions. I'm not agreeing with it, but it's the truth. Politely decline in a way that doesn't diminish someone else's personhood, maybe? Or more importantly, if he was attracted to this person before, he could ask himself what has actually changed based on the revelation? Figure out why he allows himself to throw up the barrier in the first place? You point to the imperfect world and shrugging your own shoulders in the face of something that you don't agree with because its some sort of alleged majority opinion. But here's the thing: that attitude does dick-all to actually end or even minimize those things. Just rolling with it makes marginalizing outgroups easier. |
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