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Post by ace on Apr 5, 2024 15:21:04 GMT -5
Yes because their three biggest money matches are easier to get to if he wins. Rock vs Cody for the belt. Roman challenging Cody to get them back. Rock vs Roman with or without belts.
They all make more sense if Cody wins.
But I would give just about anything to watch him lose again anyway.
it is hilarious though to look back at how certain so many were that they blew it last year and now Cody’s story is bigger, the company is hotter and this Mania will be the biggest one ever. Obviously some of that is Rock and some of that is Vince being gone. But really look back at Cody last year. Out injured forever, enters 30 to throw out #1 in the Rumble. He earned nothing. People wanted that Cody to win. That Cody isn’t nearly as interesting as this one. Specifically because he struggled.
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Post by Lizuka #BLM on Apr 5, 2024 15:37:37 GMT -5
Yes because their three biggest money matches are easier to get to if he wins. Rock vs Cody for the belt. Roman challenging Cody to get them back. Rock vs Roman with or without belts. They all make more sense if Cody wins. But I would give just about anything to watch him lose again anyway. it is hilarious though to look back at how certain so many were that they blew it last year and now Cody’s story is bigger, the company is hotter and this Mania will be the biggest one ever. Obviously some of that is Rock and some of that is Vince being gone. But really look back at Cody last year. Out injured forever, enters 30 to throw out #1 in the Rumble. He earned nothing. People wanted that Cody to win. That Cody isn’t nearly as interesting as this one. Specifically because he struggled. I mean I'd still even now undo last year's result in a heartbeat, because ultimately I'm still not remotely interested in Roman and it'd make the intervening year in between a much more entertaining pair of television programs. A month worth of a decent storyline after 11 months of Roman only swinging around to have terrible matches no one thought he had a chance in hell of losing isn't worth the tradeoff to me.
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Post by eJm on Apr 5, 2024 15:47:31 GMT -5
Yes because their three biggest money matches are easier to get to if he wins. Rock vs Cody for the belt. Roman challenging Cody to get them back. Rock vs Roman with or without belts. They all make more sense if Cody wins. But I would give just about anything to watch him lose again anyway. it is hilarious though to look back at how certain so many were that they blew it last year and now Cody’s story is bigger, the company is hotter and this Mania will be the biggest one ever. Obviously some of that is Rock and some of that is Vince being gone. But really look back at Cody last year. Out injured forever, enters 30 to throw out #1 in the Rumble. He earned nothing. People wanted that Cody to win. That Cody isn’t nearly as interesting as this one. Specifically because he struggled. I mean I'd still even now undo last year's result in a heartbeat, because ultimately I'm still not remotely interested in Roman and it'd make the intervening year in between a much more entertaining pair of television programs. A month worth of a decent storyline after 11 months of Roman only swinging around to have terrible matches no one thought he had a chance in hell of losing isn't worth the tradeoff to me. Also, you mean to tell me the Cody/Brock series and Roman/Jey would have drawn less money for their respective big PPVs if the title was on one and not the other? Because I find that hard to believe.
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Post by ace on Apr 5, 2024 15:47:48 GMT -5
Yes because their three biggest money matches are easier to get to if he wins. Rock vs Cody for the belt. Roman challenging Cody to get them back. Rock vs Roman with or without belts. They all make more sense if Cody wins. But I would give just about anything to watch him lose again anyway. it is hilarious though to look back at how certain so many were that they blew it last year and now Cody’s story is bigger, the company is hotter and this Mania will be the biggest one ever. Obviously some of that is Rock and some of that is Vince being gone. But really look back at Cody last year. Out injured forever, enters 30 to throw out #1 in the Rumble. He earned nothing. People wanted that Cody to win. That Cody isn’t nearly as interesting as this one. Specifically because he struggled. I mean I'd still even now undo last year's result in a heartbeat, because ultimately I'm still not remotely interested in Roman and it'd make the intervening year in between a much more entertaining pair of television programs. A month worth of a decent storyline after 11 months of Roman only swinging around to have terrible matches no one thought he had a chance in hell of losing isn't worth the tradeoff to me. Then you aren’t actually interested in Cody’s story, the record profits and sold out shows and highest ratings they’ve done as a result. Cody winning last year would have been such the wrong move it is indefensible.
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Post by ace on Apr 5, 2024 15:49:49 GMT -5
I mean I'd still even now undo last year's result in a heartbeat, because ultimately I'm still not remotely interested in Roman and it'd make the intervening year in between a much more entertaining pair of television programs. A month worth of a decent storyline after 11 months of Roman only swinging around to have terrible matches no one thought he had a chance in hell of losing isn't worth the tradeoff to me. Also, you mean to tell me the Cody/Brock series and Roman/Jey would have drawn less money for their respective big PPVs if the title was on one and not the other? Because I find that hard to believe. I’m telling you Cody winning last year would have been a complete momentum halter for him, the Bloodline and the company. Because he wasn’t right for the part. He walked in and had it handed to him. That always ends the same way. With people turning on him, and tuning out as they try to ignore it. He needed to struggle. Stories need middles…not just beginnings and endings. That’s WCW storytelling. There business is up everywhere after making a call people earnestly believed would hurt them. And those people still can’t see they’re wrong.
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Post by eJm on Apr 5, 2024 15:51:58 GMT -5
Also, you mean to tell me the Cody/Brock series and Roman/Jey would have drawn less money for their respective big PPVs if the title was on one and not the other? Because I find that hard to believe. I’m telling you Cody winning last year would have been a complete momentum halter for him, the Bloodline and the company. Because he wasn’t right for the part. He walked in and had it handed to him. That always ends the same way. With people turning on him, and tuning out as they try to ignore it. He needed to struggle. Stories need middles…not just beginnings and endings. That’s WCW storytelling. The middle was him being injured for several months before Hell in a Cell and fighting through it. If he had the match at SummerSlam they were clearly intending for and he won, you’d be absolutely right but that ignores a lot of what got him so over he was selling shirts twice over at the Royal Rumble last year. Like, if I were a accountant at WWE, I’d be pestering them to give him the title like he was the Clone Saga with Marvel.
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Post by Lizuka #BLM on Apr 5, 2024 15:53:01 GMT -5
I mean I'd still even now undo last year's result in a heartbeat, because ultimately I'm still not remotely interested in Roman and it'd make the intervening year in between a much more entertaining pair of television programs. A month worth of a decent storyline after 11 months of Roman only swinging around to have terrible matches no one thought he had a chance in hell of losing isn't worth the tradeoff to me. Then you aren’t actually interested in Cody’s story, the record profits and sold out shows and highest ratings they’ve done as a result. Cody winning last year would have been such the wrong move it is indefensible. Last year would've been a satisfying enough ending to the story for me and no, I absolutely do not care at all about the fact the company's making more money. I care about if I'm enjoying their TV product and when Roman is around as champion I don't. It isn't like some comedy bent or, "Oh I want to see this storyline conclude!" thing, I just think this title reign is total ass cheeks. I'd have been a-okay with him losing it on a house show to Jinder Mahal because at least it'd be over with.
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Chiral
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Post by Chiral on Apr 5, 2024 15:55:27 GMT -5
I don't really get the argument that financial success = Right Correct Creative Storytelling choice
Not only does it feel like it shuts out people who just plain didn't like the story beat (which ofc happens with every story beat ever because opinions and all) but also puts everything going well for WWE on one match finish. Like how much of WWE doing well is down to a downer ending of Mania when it's really a multitude of factors from them having a wave of momentum since Vince first stepped down, all them business business deals like Netflix and such, the Rock coming back, etc. There's something to be said for creative choices and the effect on business ofc but I feel like I see more "things are good right now so Cody HAD to lose last year" than anything else.
Would they really be doing worse if Cody just won the damn thing a year ago and they didn't spin their wheels for a year in a shonen anime filler arc?
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Post by Starshine on Apr 5, 2024 15:59:45 GMT -5
Cody struggled last year cause he lost to Reigns and then… Lesnar? Cause looking at his record last year guy was booked as strong as if he already had the belt.
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Post by Lizuka #BLM on Apr 5, 2024 16:00:51 GMT -5
Cody struggled last year cause he lost to Reigns and then… Lesnar? Cause looking at his record last year guy was booked as strong as if he already had the belt. Yeah, that's kind of the thing, it's not like this story has been gestating for a year. Cody forgot about Roman the second Brock attacked him, momentarily remembered him when they were in the same place on a random SmackDown, then had a moment of, "Oh shit, it's Rumble season, I had a thing to do!" This has absolutely not been a year-long storyline.
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Post by eJm on Apr 5, 2024 16:03:24 GMT -5
Cody struggled last year cause he lost to Reigns and then… Lesnar? Cause looking at his record last year guy was booked as strong as if he already had the belt. To be fair, could have also been a secret “Loser feuds with the Judgment Day for 2/3rds of the year” match which explained all the interference, neither side wanted to be involved with that.
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Post by "Cane Dewey" Johnson on Apr 5, 2024 16:05:58 GMT -5
When did we wrestling fans forget that a wrestler coming back after an extended injury, especially one as graphic as Cody's was, is itself overcoming an adversity that a wrestler has to do, they earn it through doing it, that makes logical sense within the confines of professional wrestling storytelling?
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Post by eJm on Apr 5, 2024 16:09:05 GMT -5
When did we wrestling fans forget that a wrestler coming back after an extended injury, especially one as graphic as Cody's was, is itself overcoming an adversity that a wrestler has to do, they earn it through doing it, that makes logical sense within the confines of professional wrestling storytelling? I’d argue that moment, as ridiculously wrong as it was for him to compete in that state and irresponsible for all those involved to let him go through with it, was the very thing that got him to the ‘Mania main event in the first place. What would have main evented last year if that didn’t happen? Still Cody? Seth? Someone entirely different?
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UN PLOMBIER NIGHTMARE #blm
Grimlock
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Post by UN PLOMBIER NIGHTMARE #blm on Apr 5, 2024 16:12:48 GMT -5
When did we wrestling fans forget that a wrestler coming back after an extended injury, especially one as graphic as Cody's was, is itself overcoming an adversity that a wrestler has to do, they earn it through doing it, that makes logical sense within the confines of professional wrestling storytelling? I’d argue that moment, as ridiculously wrong as it was for him to compete in that state and irresponsible for all those involved to let him go through with it, was the very thing that got him to the ‘Mania main event in the first place. What would have main evented last year if that didn’t happen? Still Cody? Seth? Someone entirely different? i think it is absolutely the moment that got him the ME spot. he shouldn't have done it, it was incredibly awkward and grotesque to watch but I think he is a completely different character and in a very different spot if that didn't go down.
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Post by ChitownKnight on Apr 5, 2024 16:21:21 GMT -5
I don't really get the argument that financial success = Right Correct Creative Storytelling choice Not only does it feel like it shuts out people who just plain didn't like the story beat (which ofc happens with every story beat ever because opinions and all) but also puts everything going well for WWE on one match finish. Like how much of WWE doing well is down to a downer ending of Mania when it's really a multitude of factors from them having a wave of momentum since Vince first stepped down, all them business business deals like Netflix and such, the Rock coming back, etc. There's something to be said for creative choices and the effect on business ofc but I feel like I see more "things are good right now so Cody HAD to lose last year" than anything else. Would they really be doing worse if Cody just won the damn thing a year ago and they didn't spin their wheels for a year in a shonen anime filler arc? Taking the financials aside, I was a guy that was PISSED when Cody lost last year but in hindsight I believe it was the right call. -At Mania 39, Cody had only been with the wwe for a year after creating the competition, and he won the rumble at #30. I think wwe wanted him to EARN the title. And this isn’t just any title reign, this is the longest title reign since the 80s -Jimmy and Jey losing and Roman winning added a reason for Roman to get mad at them and continue to gaslight them until Jey snapped -Mania 40 is a decade anniversary mania and they always like making those big. With Bret, Benoit, and Bryan standing tall in the end and the streak breaking at 30, Cody breaking the biggest title reign since the 80s will surpass all those moments -Now I can agree the last year of Roman’s title reign was kind of a dud after the fued with Jey, but Cody’s uphill battle was kind of interesting. Also him learning a lesson and having people have his back will be a good Endgame scenario -Now if he loses this year…. Then it’s all f***ed lol
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Post by Lizuka #BLM on Apr 5, 2024 16:24:00 GMT -5
Also him learning a lesson and having people have his back will be a good Endgame scenario Except he did that last year. He recognized the threat of the Bloodline, rehabbed Sami and KO's friendship so they would back him up, got help from them... And it meant jack shit.
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Post by eJm on Apr 5, 2024 16:26:38 GMT -5
Also him learning a lesson and having people have his back will be a good Endgame scenario Except he did that last year. He recognized the threat of the Bloodline, rehabbed Sami and KO's friendship so they would back him up, got help from them... And it meant jack shit. Yeah, like (outside of not helping in the actual match for some reason), he was motivating Sami for weeks before his title match against Roman because he was willing to forgive Sami for when he was a part of the Bloodline. That was before the KO stuff.
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Post by EoE: Well There's Your Problem on Apr 5, 2024 16:31:51 GMT -5
To me, WWE got very lucky that Rhodes losing at WM39 DIDN’T do any tangible damage to WWE or Rhodes. Goodness knows WWE have sold fans down the river before like this heaps of times, so what made this instance different? The fact that Rhodes has been kept pretty strong regardless? People just like the act that much?
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Post by Lizuka #BLM on Apr 5, 2024 16:38:42 GMT -5
To me, WWE got very lucky that Rhodes doing at WM39 DIDN’T do any tangible damage to WWE or Rhodes. Goodness knows WWE have sold fans down the river before like this heaps of times, so what made this instance different? The fact that Rhodes has been kept pretty strong regardless? People just like the act that much? I think more than anything it's just him being a generational talent. Anyone else I think would've plummeted in relevance after responding to being told his dead dad never loved him and then losing via copius amounts of cheating with, "Can I have a rematch please? No? Aww, well, that's okay, I understand, you were the better man anyway." They stumbled ass-backwards into something that worked, there's no way they could've reasonably predicted where it is now when they pulled this shit last year.
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Post by ChitownKnight on Apr 5, 2024 16:55:32 GMT -5
Also him learning a lesson and having people have his back will be a good Endgame scenario Except he did that last year. He recognized the threat of the Bloodline, rehabbed Sami and KO's friendship so they would back him up, got help from them... And it meant jack shit. It was still 4 on 3. Roman, Solo, and the USOs vs Cody, KO, and Sami. This year Cody has Jey, Seth, possibly Cena, possibly Austin and maybe others that were screwed over by the Bloodline in the past while Roman has The Rock, Jimmy, Solo, and maybe Drew on his side.
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