gl83
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 5,269
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Post by gl83 on May 21, 2024 10:31:22 GMT -5
Here's the problem though. Iyo needed this just as much, as she entered the tournament with basically no credibility left. Even when she was champion, she lost way more than she won (she was the only champion heading into Wrestlemania who had lost more matches than she had won). And the feud that was supposed to elevate her, resulted in only Bayley being elevated. Iyo built up a lot of support in this tournament from the fans, and WWE immediately pissed it all away in order to push Lyra. It's going to be very hard for Iyo to actually rebuild that support again, if she even gets the chance to do so. Because it's very clear she's never actually going to get clean decisive wins over major names on the main roster. Any sort of win she does get against a major name is dirty, or because the person basically banana peeled themselves. This is why Iyo fans are always so pissy and angry. Every time she supposedly gets something, its actually just meant to elevate someone else. And it's also a reason why fans have a hard time getting behind her. It's because her pushes are wildly inconsistent, and usually never really serve to benefit her at the end of the day. She hasn't beaten a major name clean at all since being called up (and being a heel doesn't excuse that, because even heels get big clean wins from time to time). Meanwhile Lyra has beaten both Becky and Iyo, despite not clicking all that much with audiences. Hell, you can watch the match last night, and if it was your first time watching wrestling, you would assume Iyo is the face since that is who the audience was actually behind. And this doesn't actually negate the point that Lyra wasn't that over in NXT either. She got "woo" chants during her entrance but uh like another person in this thread said, her feuds were basically secondary to everything else in the NXT Women's Division, because she herself could never really get over. Tatum and whomever she was feuding with were doing almost all of the work in carrying those feuds. It's also not hard to be cynical that Lyra is only getting pushed this hard because she's so closely tied to Becky as well. I have a feeling if she wasn't tied at all to Becky, and they had never crossed paths, then this probably wouldn't be happening, because she just doesn't have the charisma or personality to be a top woman. It's why I feel like she's gonna be in deep shit if she doesn't step it up soon. It's only been three weeks on the main roster, but she never really found her footing in NXT either. Because it feels like the only reason she got the NXT Women's title is because Becky likely pushed for it behind the scenes. So answer me this, and be completely honest. When is Iyo going to get another meaningful run at the top, where she isn't constantly putting others over, and actually gets some major CLEAN wins over some actual major names? Because with how WWE is booking her, I'm pretty confident the answer is going to be "never". WWE isn't truly invested in her. They ACT like they do, but they aren't. I like Iyo and the rest of Damage Control. But I'm gonna say it. Your anger and frustration over them is exhausting. Reel it in. Like is it that much of a bad thing. Even though Damage Ctrl went 0-2 last night, IYO only lost her match via rollup and neither Dakota nor Kairi were pinned in the fatal 4-way tag match, so all in all probably the best outcome for Damage Ctrl since a win would've meant another "feud" between them and "The Devourer of Worlds" Bianca Belair. |
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gl83
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 5,269
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Post by gl83 on May 21, 2024 10:37:38 GMT -5
She really needs to be a heel because people can't tolerate baby faces who want to play by the rules and do no evil. It's boring. Virtually no baby face has any kind of character this they need either to be an anti hero heel for anyone to start rooting for them. Probably doesn't help that she's winning everything right off the bat and not facing any adversity. Cody had similar traits, but he was able to work since he faced tons of adversity and setbacks that got the fans to rally behind him(i.e. Tearing his Pec and then going on to work the HIAC match regardless; losing to Reigns at WM 39 last year due to the Bloodline screwing him over; the Brock Lesnar feud where Lesnar dissected him; and then everything surrounding The Rock's return where he literally became The Rock's "whipping boy", etc.) |
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Post by BlahBlah on May 21, 2024 10:52:48 GMT -5
Completely independent from anything going on with Iyo, Lyra is just boring. She was boring in NXT and she's boring on the main roster. The recoil to her push isn't only that she beat Iyo last night, it's that she's just not that entertaining in general to be getting this push. Didn't get it in NXT, certainly don't get it now.
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Post by The Heartbreak TWERK on May 21, 2024 11:57:34 GMT -5
What if she starts taking hostages?
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4real
Wade Wilson
Posts: 28,956
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Post by 4real on May 21, 2024 12:33:18 GMT -5
Completely independent from anything going on with Iyo, Lyra is just boring. She was boring in NXT and she's boring on the main roster. The recoil to her push isn't only that she beat Iyo last night, it's that she's just not that entertaining in general to be getting this push. Didn't get it in NXT, certainly don't get it now. I want to like her because she’s Irish but she’s very bland. Think Nia is squashing her in Saudi to get a title shot at Bayley. |
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UN PLOMBIER NIGHTMARE #blm
Wade Wilson
Sponsored by Arizona Green Tea/Peanuts But Only At Baseball Stadiums/Biscuits Cat Adoption Agency
Posts: 27,083 
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Post by UN PLOMBIER NIGHTMARE #blm on May 21, 2024 12:38:33 GMT -5
I'd like her if she was called Lyra Valkyria Chronicles. I still need to get around to 4 |
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UN PLOMBIER NIGHTMARE #blm
Wade Wilson
Sponsored by Arizona Green Tea/Peanuts But Only At Baseball Stadiums/Biscuits Cat Adoption Agency
Posts: 27,083
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Post by UN PLOMBIER NIGHTMARE #blm on May 21, 2024 12:39:08 GMT -5
I like Lyra and I’m more than happy to support her push. I like Iyo too, but prefer both Asuka and Kairi to her and honestly have no further honest interest in her until they stop having every Asian woman on the main roster be a heel and turn her face. You know, what they seemed to be doing when she first won Money in the Bank? Doesn’t matter to me if she doesn’t wrestle like a heel, her character is still a jerk and I don’t want to see that from her anymore. Agreed that Iyo should be a face. isn’t she though? like since mania I haven’t seen her as heel for a second. I think she’s actually supposed to be one. |
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Gawk Rivers
Ozymandius
MAMMA MIA! CRUISERLICIOUS!
GIIIGIIIGIIIGIIIGIGI
Posts: 61,478
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Post by Gawk Rivers on May 21, 2024 12:42:18 GMT -5
YOU'RE A BIRD GIRL
AND YOU'VE FLOWN TOO FAR CAUSE YOU KNOW IT DON'T MATTER ANYWAY
YOU CAN RELY ON BEATING JOSHIS
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kidkamikaze10
Dennis Stamp
Trying to think of a new avatar
Posts: 4,348 
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Post by kidkamikaze10 on May 21, 2024 12:45:02 GMT -5
Lyra is in the same position as pre-The Man Becky Lynch: pushed in a role that doesn't fit her.
Rebecca Knox was a jerk that was also a great technician. Becky Lynch didn't become anywhere close to that character until the heel turn that eventually created The Man.
Valkyrie (Cain) in the indies was a dorky comedy heel who happens to be a workhorse. Lyra hasn't been able to show that side of her yet. It'll probably take a heel turn.
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Post by mistery on May 21, 2024 12:46:44 GMT -5
I'd like her if she was called Lyra Valkyria Chronicles. I still need to get around to 4 4 was fine and way more balanced than 1, but I also liked the characters in 4 significantly less. Still better than Valkyria Chronicles 2 though. 3 had some of the best characters imo. Agreed that Iyo should be a face. isn’t she though? like since mania I haven’t seen her as heel for a second. I think she’s actually supposed to be one. She is not. She is absolutely still a full on heel, although audiences would lead you to think otherwise. |
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gl83
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 5,269
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Post by gl83 on May 21, 2024 12:47:43 GMT -5
Lyra is in the same position as pre-The Man Becky Lynch: pushed in a role that doesn't fit her. Rebecca Knox was a jerk that was also a great technician. Becky Lynch didn't become anywhere close to that character until the heel turn that eventually created The Man. Valkyrie (Cain) in the indies was a dorky comedy heel who happens to be a workhorse. Lyra hasn't been able to show that side of her yet. It'll probably take a heel turn. .......I mean....it has been awhile since someone stabbed Becky Lynch in the back.....girl's gotta do something to keep pace with Bayley...... |
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Post by mistery on May 21, 2024 12:59:42 GMT -5
Lyra is in the same position as pre-The Man Becky Lynch: pushed in a role that doesn't fit her. Rebecca Knox was a jerk that was also a great technician. Becky Lynch didn't become anywhere close to that character until the heel turn that eventually created The Man. Valkyrie (Cain) in the indies was a dorky comedy heel who happens to be a workhorse. Lyra hasn't been able to show that side of her yet. It'll probably take a heel turn. I would honestly argue pre "The Man" Becky Lynch also had way more crowd support leading to her heel turn, something I can't see WWE replicating (at least successfully) with Lyra. Because I remember a whole lotta people getting real mad when Becky lost to Charlotte at Summerslam. But then the heel turn pushed her over the top with audiences, and Nia breaking her face open, leading to the Becky we all know today. I cannot see WWE managing to pull off that same stuff with Lyra at all. Because she's significantly less charismatic, and she's pretty obviously being pushed straight to the top, with women like Iyo being used only to put her over. Honestly it feels more like Iyo is closer to being the one getting the "The Man" treatment from fans. Because her in ring style is incredibly flashy. And I have a feeling WWE is vastly overestimating how many people are actually going to care if Lyra loses to Nia. That's not to slight Lyra who is a very good in ring performer, but she's basically someone who is being pushed as a main eventer when in reality she feels more like a lower midcard babyface at best. It doesn't help that she was regularly outshined by pretty much every other woman on NXT either, personality wise. |
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UN PLOMBIER NIGHTMARE #blm
Wade Wilson
Sponsored by Arizona Green Tea/Peanuts But Only At Baseball Stadiums/Biscuits Cat Adoption Agency
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Post by UN PLOMBIER NIGHTMARE #blm on May 21, 2024 13:04:33 GMT -5
I still need to get around to 4 4 was fine and way more balanced than 1, but I also liked the characters in 4 significantly less. Still better than Valkyria Chronicles 2 though. 3 had some of the best characters imo. isn’t she though? like since mania I haven’t seen her as heel for a second. I think she’s actually supposed to be one. She is not. She is absolutely still a full on heel, although audiences would lead you to think otherwise. I'll have to get around to it then cause I've liked all the other games a lot! Weird. Maybe they'll use this to push her towards being a face cause she does just scream face that'll do anything to win. we shall see |
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asuka007
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 24,334
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Post by asuka007 on May 21, 2024 13:39:53 GMT -5
Lyra needs more character beyond just “Becky’s little buddy who also likes birds.” It’s not that people won’t accept pure babyfaces (hello Cody).
But she is a very bland character who is being pushed to the top immediately. It’s hard to make that work.
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lionheart21
Patti Mayonnaise
Once did a thing...
Posts: 31,763
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Post by lionheart21 on May 21, 2024 15:38:08 GMT -5
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asuka007
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 24,334
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Post by asuka007 on May 21, 2024 16:55:41 GMT -5
She really needs to be a heel because people can't tolerate baby faces who want to play by the rules and do no evil. It's boring. Virtually no baby face has any kind of character this they need either to be an anti hero heel for anyone to start rooting for them. Probably doesn't help that she's winning everything right off the bat and not facing any adversity. Cody had similar traits, but he was able to work since he faced tons of adversity and setbacks that got the fans to rally behind him(i.e. Tearing his Pec and then going on to work the HIAC match regardless; losing to Reigns at WM 39 last year due to the Bloodline screwing him over; the Brock Lesnar feud where Lesnar dissected him; and then everything surrounding The Rock's return where he literally became The Rock's "whipping boy", etc.) It’s very telling that Tiffany, who’s whole character is basically “arrogant rich girl who is also a prodigy” feels like SHE has suffered more adversity on the Main Roster than babyface Lyra has. |
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Post by Duke Cameron on May 21, 2024 18:03:23 GMT -5
She really needs to be a heel because people can't tolerate baby faces who want to play by the rules and do no evil. It's boring. Virtually no baby face has any kind of character this they need either to be an anti hero heel for anyone to start rooting for them. I like true blue baby faces. |
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Post by The Rick Jericho on May 21, 2024 19:52:18 GMT -5
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Post by polarbearpete on May 22, 2024 9:13:57 GMT -5
Probably doesn't help that she's winning everything right off the bat and not facing any adversity. Cody had similar traits, but he was able to work since he faced tons of adversity and setbacks that got the fans to rally behind him(i.e. Tearing his Pec and then going on to work the HIAC match regardless; losing to Reigns at WM 39 last year due to the Bloodline screwing him over; the Brock Lesnar feud where Lesnar dissected him; and then everything surrounding The Rock's return where he literally became The Rock's "whipping boy", etc.) It’s very telling that Tiffany, who’s whole character is basically “arrogant rich girl who is also a prodigy” feels like SHE has suffered more adversity on the Main Roster than babyface Lyra has. Tiffany’s been there for months. Lyra literally just started 3 episodes of Raw ago. |
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Post by clc on May 22, 2024 9:30:36 GMT -5
Lyra needs more character beyond just “Becky’s little buddy who also likes birds.” It’s not that people won’t accept pure babyfaces (hello Cody). But she is a very bland character who is being pushed to the top immediately. It’s hard to make that work. Lyra: So, what would you like to talk about? There seems to be an absence of a certain ornithological piece. A head line regarding the mass awareness of a certain avian variety. Have you not heard? It was my understanding that everyone had heard... |
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