adamclark52
El Dandy
I'm one with the Force; the Force is with me
Posts: 8,139 
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Post by adamclark52 on Mar 12, 2008 18:45:45 GMT -5
I was just watching the "final Nitro" segment Flair DVD that came out a few years ago, and in it Flair said he was "the 14 time world heavyweight champion". WTF? I thought he was the 16 time champion? What's going on here? When did he win two more titles since then?
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Post by The Wrestling Rambler on Mar 12, 2008 18:47:31 GMT -5
NWA doesn't recognise 2 of his titles. WWE does.
I think
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comahan
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 17,899
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Post by comahan on Mar 12, 2008 18:49:30 GMT -5
They were probably just talking about his WCW/NWA reigns. Add in the two WWF title reigns, and thats 16.
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Post by Just "Dan" is Fine, Thank You on Mar 12, 2008 18:58:40 GMT -5
I was just watching the "final Nitro" segment Flair DVD that came out a few years ago, and in it Flair said he was "the 14 time world heavyweight champion". WTF? I thought he was the 16 time champion? What's going on here? When did he win two more titles since then? He's held many more, actually. |
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Matt Dunn
Hank Scorpio
It was inevitable.
Posts: 5,596
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Post by Matt Dunn on Mar 12, 2008 19:01:07 GMT -5
I was just watching the "final Nitro" segment Flair DVD that came out a few years ago, and in it Flair said he was "the 14 time world heavyweight champion". WTF? I thought he was the 16 time champion? What's going on here? When did he win two more titles since then? He's held many more, actually. The way they tally the number of belts is ridiculous. Like, some overlap as one (NWA/WCW) and I think there might be one or more unrecognized title reigns involving Antonio Inoki. |
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Post by Shockmaster's Son on Mar 12, 2008 19:02:31 GMT -5
I was just watching the "final Nitro" segment Flair DVD that came out a few years ago, and in it Flair said he was "the 14 time world heavyweight champion". WTF? I thought he was the 16 time champion? What's going on here? When did he win two more titles since then? He's held many more, actually. He's right. Flair himself has said the number of titles is actually closer to 23 or so. But 16 is the number WWE has settled on. |
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Post by Just "Dan" is Fine, Thank You on Mar 12, 2008 19:05:12 GMT -5
Also, Hulk Hogan was granted 2 AWA title reigns a year or two ago.
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the4whoare1
Bubba Ho-Tep
Eat Sleep Conquer Repeat!!!!
Posts: 621
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Post by the4whoare1 on Mar 12, 2008 20:10:49 GMT -5
they recognized andre as world champ too finally??. didnt they??.
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Post by Robbymac on Mar 12, 2008 20:15:15 GMT -5
they recognized andre as world champ too finally??. didnt they??. Andre has always been credited with his one title reign. |
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Post by Mongo & Pepe: Back in Black on Mar 12, 2008 20:38:25 GMT -5
I was just watching the "final Nitro" segment Flair DVD that came out a few years ago, and in it Flair said he was "the 14 time world heavyweight champion". WTF? I thought he was the 16 time champion? What's going on here? When did he win two more titles since then? WCW simply didn't recognize his WWF title reigns. |
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Post by "St. Louis Viper" Buck Summers on Mar 12, 2008 20:51:40 GMT -5
Flair is a 25 time world champion, WWE ackoledge's 16 of them.
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Post by Hensley on Mar 12, 2008 21:39:01 GMT -5
The real number's over 20, I'm sure.
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Post by Robbymac on Mar 12, 2008 22:55:58 GMT -5
Here's a list of all of the disputed and undisputed reigns
1. def Dusty Rhodes (9/17/81-Kansas City, MO) NWA
2. presented title after belt was vacated by The Midnight Rider (2/9/82-Tampa, FL) NWA
3. def Jack Veneno (9/7/82-Santo Domingo, Domincan Republic) NWA
4. def. Carlos Colon (1/23/83-San Juan, PR) NWA
5. def. Victor Jovica (2/11/83-Manati, PR) NWA
6. def. Harley Race (11/24/83-Greensboro, NC) NWA
7. def. Harley Race (3/23/84-Kallang, Singapore) NWA
8. def. Kerry Von Erich (5/24/84-Yokosuka, Japan) NWA
9. def. Dusty Rhodes (8/9/86-St. Louis, MO) NWA
10. def. Ronnie Garvin (11/26/87-Chicago, IL) NWA
11. def. Ricky Steamboat (5/7/89-Nashville, TN) NWA
12. def. Sting (1/11/91-East Rutherford, NJ) NWA/WCW
13. def Tatsumi Fujinami (5/19/91-St. Petersberg, FL) NWA
14. won Royal Rumble for Vacant Title (1/19/92-Albany, NY) WWF
15. def. Randy Savage (9/1/92-Hershey, PA) WWF
16. def. Barry Windham (7/18/93-Biloxi, MS) NWA
17. def. Vader (12/27/93-Charlotte, NC) WCW
18. def. Ricky Steamboat (4/21/94-Atlanta, GA) WCW
19. def. Randy Savage (12/27/95-Nashville, TN) WCW
20. def. Randy Savage (2/11/96-St. Petersberg, FL) WCW
21. def. Hulk Hogan (3/14/99-Louisville, KY) WCW
22. def. Jeff Jarrett (5/15/00-Biloxi, MS) WCW
23. def. Kevin Nash (5/29/00-Salt Lake City, UT) WCW
WWE does not recognize 2, 3, 4, 5, and 18. There are 2 others that they don't recognize, but I'm not positive which ones. My best guess would be 7 and 16.
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Post by Mister Yummy on Mar 13, 2008 3:02:48 GMT -5
You're forgetting his WCW International World Title reigns. Also, you're number 2 doesn't count. His opponent refused the title, hence Flair never lost it. Additionally, My records don't show the Victor Jovica loss and regain. Perhaps I'll have to change my count to 24. Here, from a recent post of mine, is my tabulation of Ric Flair's 23 World Heavyweight Title reigns. I'm not sure where the WWE gets 16 reigns for Ric Flair. I count several more than that. Let's go through them. His first reign was from 9-17-1981 to ?-?-1982 2nd from ?-?-1982 to 1-6-83 3rd from 1-10-83 to 6-10-83. The NWA doesn't recognise the first 2 losses, and consideres these all one reign. 4th from 11-24-83 to 3-21-84 5th from 3-23-84 to 5-6-84 6th from 5-24-84 to 7-26-86 7th from 8-9-86 to 9-25-87 8th from 11-26-87 to 2-20-89 9th from 5-7-89 to 7-7-90 10th from 1-11-91 to 3-21-91 11th from 5-19-91 to 9-8-91 Ric Flair also became the first WCW World Heavyweight Champion on 1-11-91, holding it until 7-1-91 for his 12th world title. He held this concurrently with 2 of his NWA title reigns, so some may consider them all 1 reign. Ric Flair won the WWF World Heavyweight Championship on 1-19-92 andh eld it until 4-5-92 for his 13th world title. 14th 9-1-92 to 10-12-92(WWF) 15th 7-18-93 to 9-?-93(NWA) Ric Flair became the first WCW International World Heavyweight Champion upon WCW's departure from the NWA in September 1993, holding it until 9-19-93, for his 16th world title. 17th 12-27-93 to 4-21-94(WCW) 18th 4-21-94 to 7-17-94 19th 12-27-95 to 1-22-96 20th 2-11-96 to 4-22-96 21st 3-14-99 to 4-11-99 22nd 5-15-2000 to 5-22-2000 23rd 5-29-2000 So, if you don't count the 2 NWA Disavowed reigns, you're down to 21. If you don't count the 2 WCW International reigns, you get 19. Discount the 2 NWA Reigns concurrent with the first WCW Reign, and you're down to 17. I have no idea which other reign they drop. |
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Post by Robbymac on Mar 13, 2008 7:12:19 GMT -5
You're forgetting his WCW International World Title reigns. Also, you're number 2 doesn't count. His opponent refused the title, hence Flair never lost it. Additionally, My records don't show the Victor Jovica loss and regain. Perhaps I'll have to change my count to 24. Here, from a recent post of mine, is my tabulation of Ric Flair's 23 World Heavyweight Title reigns. I'm not sure where the WWE gets 16 reigns for Ric Flair. I count several more than that. Let's go through them. His first reign was from 9-17-1981 to ?-?-1982 2nd from ?-?-1982 to 1-6-83 3rd from 1-10-83 to 6-10-83. The NWA doesn't recognise the first 2 losses, and consideres these all one reign. 4th from 11-24-83 to 3-21-84 5th from 3-23-84 to 5-6-84 6th from 5-24-84 to 7-26-86 7th from 8-9-86 to 9-25-87 8th from 11-26-87 to 2-20-89 9th from 5-7-89 to 7-7-90 10th from 1-11-91 to 3-21-91 11th from 5-19-91 to 9-8-91 Ric Flair also became the first WCW World Heavyweight Champion on 1-11-91, holding it until 7-1-91 for his 12th world title. He held this concurrently with 2 of his NWA title reigns, so some may consider them all 1 reign. Ric Flair won the WWF World Heavyweight Championship on 1-19-92 andh eld it until 4-5-92 for his 13th world title. 14th 9-1-92 to 10-12-92(WWF) 15th 7-18-93 to 9-?-93(NWA) Ric Flair became the first WCW International World Heavyweight Champion upon WCW's departure from the NWA in September 1993, holding it until 9-19-93, for his 16th world title. 17th 12-27-93 to 4-21-94(WCW) 18th 4-21-94 to 7-17-94 19th 12-27-95 to 1-22-96 20th 2-11-96 to 4-22-96 21st 3-14-99 to 4-11-99 22nd 5-15-2000 to 5-22-2000 23rd 5-29-2000 So, if you don't count the 2 NWA Disavowed reigns, you're down to 21. If you don't count the 2 WCW International reigns, you get 19. Discount the 2 NWA Reigns concurrent with the first WCW Reign, and you're down to 17. I have no idea which other reign they drop. I think the other reign they drop is when he traded the belt with Race from 3-21-83 to 3-23-83. Either this or the Ricky Steamboat thing in 94. For the record I wouldn't count number 2 either, but it was on the list so at least someone considers it, making it disputed. |
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Post by paulonorcatto on Mar 13, 2008 7:22:34 GMT -5
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Post by Robbymac on Mar 13, 2008 10:35:01 GMT -5
He could have as many as 8 WCW titles. Flair and Steamboat match ended in a double pin in 94 and the belt was held up. If you consider Flair winning the rematch on WCW Saturday Night then thats one more. Also if you consider him being the first WCW Champ in '91 you'll get to 8 (7 if you don't count the Steamboat change) I would not consider either of his international titles as seperate reigns as the first was just a continuation of his NWA championship, and his second was unifying it with the WCW Championship. Some would also question the validity of calling the WCW International World Title a "World Title" To me its about as valid as the current incarnation of the ECW Title. If this thread proves anything its that no one has any clue how many times Flair has won the title. |
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Post by Mister Yummy on Mar 13, 2008 15:10:22 GMT -5
The WCW International World Title got over on the leftover prestige of the NWA Title. I've talked to people who consider it the true liniage of said title, even. It's as much a world title as the WCW World Title is.
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Post by Robbymac on Mar 13, 2008 15:48:38 GMT -5
The WCW International World Title got over on the leftover prestige of the NWA Title. I've talked to people who consider it the true liniage of said title, even. It's as much a world title as the WCW World Title is. I just have trouble with one company promoting two World Titles (WWE excluded due to the brand split) |
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Post by paulonorcatto on Mar 13, 2008 18:27:27 GMT -5
oh i think ive got it. they count the 10 official nwa title reigns. everyone has to agree with that at least...
and the 2 wwf reigns.
now what i think is that they omit the first wcw reisgn, becuase he was already the nwa champion and they omit the steamboat incident, where the title was held up. which gets you to 16.
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