greeby
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 7,088
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Post by greeby on May 20, 2008 12:56:03 GMT -5
The other entries are Tito Ortiz, James Mitchell and the entire TNA roster
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Post by SBYM (Heel Turn) on May 20, 2008 13:00:41 GMT -5
Beth Phoenix destroying jobbers won't get her interest from the crowd, regardless of how well she goes about doing so, people just don't give a crap about jobbers being squashed, at all.
And I guess his take on Orton is close enough, no real disagreements there.
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The OP
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
changed his name
Posts: 15,785
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Post by The OP on May 20, 2008 13:04:45 GMT -5
I've said it before, but the only money match I see for Beth Phoenix is against Awesome Kong, and it won't happen.
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Jay Peas 42
El Dandy
Totally flips out ALL the time.
Is looking forward to a Nation of Domination Kwannza Special.
Posts: 8,329
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Post by Jay Peas 42 on May 20, 2008 13:06:28 GMT -5
Beth Phoenix destroying jobbers won't get her interest from the crowd, regardless of how well she goes about doing so, people just don't give a crap about jobbers being squashed, at all. And I guess his take on Orton is close enough, no real disagreements there. I'd rather see her wrestle unknown talent for five minutes than see her go week after week with Maria. Here she comes again indeed. Not all squash matches are created equal.
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Post by SBYM (Heel Turn) on May 20, 2008 13:08:01 GMT -5
Beth Phoenix destroying jobbers won't get her interest from the crowd, regardless of how well she goes about doing so, people just don't give a crap about jobbers being squashed, at all. And I guess his take on Orton is close enough, no real disagreements there. I'd rather see her wrestle unknown talent for five minutes than see her go week after week with Maria. Here she comes again indeed. Not all squash matches are created equal. I agree that new people for her to go against would be a nice change of pace, but it still won't get her over any more than beating up Maria.
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Post by Mayonnaise on May 20, 2008 13:12:55 GMT -5
Beth Phoenix destroying jobbers won't get her interest from the crowd, regardless of how well she goes about doing so, people just don't give a crap about jobbers being squashed, at all. I don't think he is talking about jobber squashes so much as building the division with legit talent and feeding them to Beth along the way (much like TNA has done with Awesome Kong) and then having someone step up and beat her. That was you have a strong heel character that you can build the division around by having the "Who can beat the unstoppable monster" angle.
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Post by SBYM (Heel Turn) on May 20, 2008 13:15:56 GMT -5
Well, yeah that makes sense. Awesome Kong is doing really great in TNA because they've built her up properly. But if you read Heyman's suggestion he basically is describing brining in random female jobbers every week for Beth to destroy.
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Post by Mayonnaise on May 20, 2008 13:18:08 GMT -5
Well, yeah that makes sense. Awesome Kong is doing really great in TNA because they've built her up properly. But if you read Heyman's suggestion he basically is describing brining in random female jobbers every week for Beth to destroy. Yeah, I missed that little bit but, I still don't think he is talking about jobbers only. At least I hope he wouldn't, cause there is no going back to those days now.
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Jiren
Patti Mayonnaise
Hearts Bayformers
Posts: 35,163
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Post by Jiren on May 20, 2008 13:19:25 GMT -5
I agree beth is Underused.
But WWE just don't care, they're still profiting with the bare minimum so they're gonna keep doing it.
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Post by lildude8218 on May 20, 2008 13:21:17 GMT -5
so Randy wasn't the one who kicked Cena's dad in the head and sent him to the hospital? or kicked Matt Hardy in his appendix scar? RKO'd Triple H after the lights went out?
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Post by SBYM (Heel Turn) on May 20, 2008 13:21:25 GMT -5
I say bring in Victoria and Natalya from Smackdown, and hire another talented female then put them all on Raw. And take all the dancers that wear wrestling boots sometimes and put them on Smackdown, or vice versa. That way, one show could have decent matches, not just for Beth but all of them in general, and they still get to have dance-offs and pillow fights without them taking up each other's air time.
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Joekishi
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 20,490
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Post by Joekishi on May 20, 2008 13:28:35 GMT -5
I really liked his assessment on TNA as that's how i feel about their product
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greeby
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 7,088
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Post by greeby on May 20, 2008 13:36:39 GMT -5
I say bring in Victoria and Natalya from Smackdown, and hire another talented female then put them all on Raw. And take all the dancers that wear wrestling boots sometimes and put them on Smackdown, or vice versa. That way, one show could have decent matches, not just for Beth but all of them in general, and they still get to have dance-offs and pillow fights without them taking up each other's air time. Then you'd have heels way outnumber the faces, that's no way to build any kind of division. Besides, I thought they had mostly stopped doing stupid stuff like pillow fights just before the Royal Rumble.
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Post by SBYM (Heel Turn) on May 20, 2008 13:38:28 GMT -5
I say bring in Victoria and Natalya from Smackdown, and hire another talented female then put them all on Raw. And take all the dancers that wear wrestling boots sometimes and put them on Smackdown, or vice versa. That way, one show could have decent matches, not just for Beth but all of them in general, and they still get to have dance-offs and pillow fights without them taking up each other's air time. Then you'd have heels way outnumber the faces, that's no way to build any kind of division. Besides, I thought they had mostly stopped doing stupid stuff like pillow fights just before the Royal Rumble. Turn a couple of 'em faces?
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Krimzon
Crow T. Robot
This guy is the man!
R.I.P. Deadpool
Posts: 43,870
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Post by Krimzon on May 20, 2008 13:40:41 GMT -5
No Elijah Burke? He's the textbook definition of "underutilized" talent. He could already be a big midcard player right now, but he's not even getting airtime on ECW.
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The OP
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
changed his name
Posts: 15,785
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Post by The OP on May 20, 2008 13:40:52 GMT -5
so Randy wasn't the one who kicked Cena's dad in the head and sent him to the hospital? or kicked Matt Hardy in his appendix scar? RKO'd Triple H after the lights went out? Yeah, I think Paul missed a couple things with that one.
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Post by PTBartman on May 20, 2008 13:55:17 GMT -5
What an idiot. I mean I know this is his opinion and all but he doesn't even com close to hitting the mark. He makes persuasive arguments for his choices and I might even rank them 6 - 2 but isn't it obvious that the most under utilized talent in pro wrestling is Paul Heyman?
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Post by Slammywinner on May 20, 2008 14:25:32 GMT -5
Anyone have a link to the full article?
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Post by wrestlecrapcrap on May 20, 2008 14:30:17 GMT -5
No Elijah Burke? He's the textbook definition of "underutilized" talent. He could already be a big midcard player right now, but he's not even getting airtime on ECW. He's got great potential and even an awesome moveset, but he doesn't have a unique identity. He's basically MVP-lite right now. Once he develops that, he'll rocket upwards.
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Post by Seth Drakin of Monster Crap on May 20, 2008 14:31:24 GMT -5
YOU see them all the time.
Wrestlers that should be much bigger superstars than they are.
Held back by politics, stupidity, lack of writers' understanding and sometimes even their own devices and demons.
They're called 'underutilised talents', but every now and then the miracle occurs and you see someone bust through the parameters under which he or she works.
I've seen it happen, up close and personal.
With Steve Austin, the time he was released by WCW and was given the forum to express himself in the original ECW.
With Mick Foley, when he agreed to turn heel on the fans and cut some of the most memorable promos of this or any other generation.
And even with Brian Pillman, when he stopped settling for upper mid card and wanted to be the talk of the industry.
These are, in my opinion, the Top 5 most underutilised talents in pro wrestling today.
Let the debate begin!
NUMBER 5 - TITO ORTIZ
Why not start right off with some controversy?
I was going to mention The Briscoes from Ring of Honor, because a long-term storyline between the young, hip, edgy Briscoes and the team of Miz and Morrison would be a classic.
But The Briscoes are not underutilised in ROH, just underexposed to the masses.
Tito, however, is finishing up his UFC contract this weekend. What does he do next?
Wear out his name in MMA, or capitalize on his love for pro wrestling and exploit his larger than life personality by joining WWE or TNA?
And remember, where Tito goes, so goes Jenna Jameson, the best self-promoter in show business today.
Forget these short term deals with Pac Man Jones and Floyd Mayweather. Tito and Jenna can be long term stars who command attention, and they can bring that attention to whatever wrestling promotion is smart enough to TAP into their controversial relationship.
NUMBER 4 - BETH PHOENIX
It doesn't matter that she's already been WWE women’s champion, the audience hasn't even had a taste of what this phenomenal athlete is capable of.
I think Beth's ring skills are deteriorating because she's not being allowed to work up to her potential. WWE should bring in opponents for Beth to squash every week.
There are plenty of women wrestlers in the Shimmer group, the West Coast indies, even in Mexico to feed to Beth.
Then, in due time, when someone finally steps up to her, the audience would be craving to pay to see WWE's heel version of Gina Carano get chopped down to size.
The WWE's women’s division lacks a long term vision, and Beth has been rushed into programs that just fill the female-segment on Raw, reminding one of the old adage about "leaving a lot of money on the table".
NUMBER 3 - JAMES MITCHELL
The best backstage promo artist in the business, bar none. A brilliant spokesman who can articulate the merits of the opponent without selling his own act short.
The Sinister Minister's delivery is defined by a composure that only top notch thespians can master, and his timing is nothing short of awe-inspiring.
A compelling character whose attention-grabbing look is surpassed only by his wealth of talent. WASTED talent, I might add.
But that's not surprising, considering that he works for TNA. Speaking of which ...
NUMBER 2 - THE ENTIRE TNA ROSTER
No long term concepts + bad television writing + zero marketing strategy = hard working talents whose efforts are wasted on a show that has not grown the audience whatsoever despite the tens of millions of dollars sunken into it.
NUMBER 1 - RANDY ORTON
What? How can the most spotlighted heel in WWE be the most underutilised talent in wrestling?
Because how often is Randy Orton scripted to get real heat?
Orton's run with Shawn Michaels was based on HBK superkicking The Legend Killer into oblivion week after week on TV.
Orton's storyline with Jeff Hardy was based on Hardy pinning the champ, and then one-upping him at almost every turn. Orton's schedule with Cena was the same story.
Ditto for HHH. The final week before WrestleMania, Orton tapped out to Ric Flair on Monday Night Raw.
On a case-by-case scenario, there's nothing wrong with any of it. But put into context, when does Orton get to make you hate him so badly, you're willing to pay to see him get beat, or at least beaten up?
What heinous act has Orton committed against a babyface you care about?
The only time Randy is allowed to 'pile on the heat' is during promos, and admittedly he falls short in that department.
His voice does drag. I concede, he doesn't have enough range. So, Orton either needs a manager, or a full-time off-camera behind the scenes interview coach.
The fact Orton carries the heat he does right now, even though he really hasn't done anything in almost a year - when he was given the credit for putting Shawn Michaels, Rob Van Dam, and a host of legends on the shelf - is a testament to his ability to carry himself like a main-event heel.
With a new round of contemptible actions added to the mix, Orton can be a far bigger superstar than he already is today.
That's my Top 5. What's YOUR opinion? Your feedback is most encouraged on the MySun forums below.
And don't forget to check back here tomorrow for a very special Wednesday edition of the Heyman Hustle featuring Gossip Girl sex symbol Taylor Momsen, Donald Trump and his hot wife, Donald Trump Jr and HIS hot wife, Broadway legend Harvey Fierstein and Victoria's Secret/Sports Illustrated swimsuit model Brooklyn Decker.
There is the whole article.
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