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Post by Single H on Aug 3, 2008 9:54:27 GMT -5
What if instead of coming to the WWF in 1995/96 as 'The Ringmaster' alongside Ted DeBaise and then dropping 'The Ringmaster' gimmick and getting a super man huge push which (along with WCW and there NWO angle) . Started the 'Attitude era' giving wrestling mainstream popularity again and started the blur between classic good guy (babyface) and bad guy (heel) in the WWF in the 90's.
What if instead of 'Stone Cold' being born and coming in in the mid 90's. Steve Austin was born 10 years older meaning he wasn't ready for any sort of wrestling or push or to help revolutionize wrestling. Until 2007/8 he didn't come into wrestling.
Do you think 'Stone Cold' would still be giving his monster push if he would have came into WWE in 2007/08?. How do you think the fans would have accepted him?. Do you think Austin 3.16 would still be born and still be as popular now as he was back then? and where do you think he would fit on the card in this day and age?
How would you book 'The Ringmaster' Steve Austin to 'Stone Cold' Steve Austin in the WWE nowadays?
Where do you think wrestling would be nowadays without 'Stone Cold'? and how do you think it would have effected the WWF back in 1996 onwards without Steve Austin?. Who do you think would have took his place back in the day? how would the 'Attitude era' have begun without 'Stone Cold'? and how would you book the WWF and the impact without 'Stone Cold' back in 1996 onwards?
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Post by SNITSKY on Aug 3, 2008 10:37:03 GMT -5
How would you book Chilly McFreeze?
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Post by Crazy Diamond on Aug 3, 2008 10:43:12 GMT -5
I don't think you would be talking about the WWF right now if Stone Cold hadn't been around. I think HHH was originally going to be the guy to get the superpush, but that would just lead to more of the same. So the WWF would have been like WCW in 1999, except with wrestling plumbers and pig farmers. Maybe ECW would have had more of an impact, but even then I think their finances would have still done them in.
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Bo Rida
Fry's dog Seymour
Pulled one over on everyone.
Got away with it, this time.
Posts: 23,589
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Post by Bo Rida on Aug 3, 2008 10:52:07 GMT -5
I think in the age of scripted promos and ignoring crowd reactions he wouldn't have been given the chance to make as big an impact, I also assume that many other aspects of the attitude era would still have been present negating his impact.
The question I've always wondered is if even keeping the "Stone Cold" character exactly the same would Steve Austin have gotten as over is he had kept his long blonde hair?
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Post by Crazy Diamond on Aug 3, 2008 10:58:40 GMT -5
I wonder if the WWE would have recovered earlier if they had let Steve keep his ECW character? I saw some of it on Youtube and it was great.
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Post by MysteryPartner on Aug 3, 2008 11:00:44 GMT -5
Everything for Stone Cold happened at the right time. If he came into the WWE now for the first time as The Ringmaster he would be like The Gold Standard, Shelton Benjamin.
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Post by Single H on Aug 3, 2008 11:04:34 GMT -5
The question I've always wondered is if even keeping the "Stone Cold" character exactly the same would Steve Austin have gotten as over is he had kept his long blonde hair? I think that 'Stone Cold' charchter wouldn't have worked. He would have looked out of place with the long blonde hair and I personally don't think that it would have worked the way it did with the long blonde hair. They could;d have tweaked the character somewhat though so it did fit. May have not came across as natural and therefore not got over as much as it did if they did do that however. |
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Hiroshi Hase
Patti Mayonnaise
The Good Ol' Days
Posts: 30,755
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Post by Hiroshi Hase on Aug 3, 2008 11:10:38 GMT -5
Actually Austin cut his long hair while he was in ECW, so I don't think you'd have to worry about that too much.
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Ben Wyatt
Crow T. Robot
Are You Gonna Go My Way?
I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
Posts: 41,515
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Aug 3, 2008 11:10:58 GMT -5
Everything for Stone Cold happened at the right time. If he came into the WWE now for the first time as The Ringmaster he would be like The Gold Standard, Shelton Benjamin. This, Austin arrived at the absolute right time. It was a perfect storm of dumb luck, ability and circumstances |
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Aug 3, 2008 13:00:48 GMT -5
Well take a look at all the newcomers in the last couple years:
Cody Rhodes
Ted DiBiase
Chris Masters
Kenny Dykstra
John Cena (before Steph found out he could rap)
All generic looking f***s. That's why they never got over, because WWE thinks that what we want are handsome-toned clean-cut guys in underwear. And I know I'm missing a good 10-20 people who fit that list who have debuted since 2002 that were just generic looking guys.
Austin would have been like that. Who would have cared? It's just another guy with blond hair who can wrestle. He wouldn't have been given any personality as the Ringmaster, and would have been released or retconned before he would have been given a chance to become Stone Cold.
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Post by Single H on Aug 3, 2008 15:23:18 GMT -5
Well take a look at all the newcomers in the last couple years: Cody Rhodes Ted DiBiase Chris Masters Kenny Dykstra John Cena (before Steph found out he could rap) All generic looking smurfs. That's why they never got over, because WWE thinks that what we want are handsome-toned clean-cut guys in underwear. And I know I'm missing a good 10-20 people who fit that list who have debuted since 2002 that were just generic looking guys. Austin would have been like that. Who would have cared? It's just another guy with blond hair who can wrestle. He wouldn't have been given any personality as the Ringmaster, and would have been released or retconned before he would have been given a chance to become Stone Cold. That was the thing about Stone Cold when he debuted and even afterwards he did look very generic. It was his charisma and mic work that got him over more than anything. Most the guys nowadays don't get a chance to work the mic properly as all there promos are scripted by the bookers mostly. That's partly what's wrong with wrestling on a hole at the present compared to 10 years ago. There scared to take any risks with there workers anymore. They did in the past (take risks) and two of there biggest (and probably a lot more) came of it Stone Cold and The Rock. Just by letting them be there selves (just with the volume turned right up!) and do there own thing to a point. |
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The_ripoff_artist
Unicron
Just Regular Ol' Folk
R.I.P. Todd Newton 1989-2009
Posts: 2,791
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Post by The_ripoff_artist on Aug 3, 2008 16:31:39 GMT -5
Dibiase jr cant work a mic?  Cody has proven a better heel mic worker by far. |
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Crappler El 0 M
Dalek
Never Forgets an Octagon
I'm a good R-Truth.
Posts: 58,479
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Post by Crappler El 0 M on Aug 3, 2008 16:34:03 GMT -5
It's hard to imagine 1996 to 2001 without Austin; therefore I don't know how wrestling in general would be if he wouldn't have been there untill ten years later.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Aug 3, 2008 17:08:17 GMT -5
Well take a look at all the newcomers in the last couple years: Cody Rhodes Ted DiBiase Chris Masters Kenny Dykstra John Cena (before Steph found out he could rap) All generic looking smurfs. That's why they never got over, because WWE thinks that what we want are handsome-toned clean-cut guys in underwear. And I know I'm missing a good 10-20 people who fit that list who have debuted since 2002 that were just generic looking guys. Austin would have been like that. Who would have cared? It's just another guy with blond hair who can wrestle. He wouldn't have been given any personality as the Ringmaster, and would have been released or retconned before he would have been given a chance to become Stone Cold. That was the thing about Stone Cold when he debuted and even afterwards he did look very generic. It was his charisma and mic work that got him over more than anything. Most the guys nowadays don't get a chance to work the mic properly as all there promos are scripted by the bookers mostly. That's partly what's wrong with wrestling on a hole at the present compared to 10 years ago. There scared to take any risks with there workers anymore. They did in the past (take risks) and two of there biggest (and probably a lot more) came of it Stone Cold and The Rock. Just by letting them be there selves (just with the volume turned right up!) and do there own thing to a point. I disagree. Maybe for a while he still looked generic, but give him the street clothes look and the vests and he wasn't so generic anymore. But you're right. If he was stuck with what the E would give him, he would be floundering around the mid-card (if even brought up from developmental). He wouldn't be able to curse, or make catch phrases, or be a bad ass, or hell, even give that Stone Cold smile he has. He'd basically be a robot spewing out either "I'm prettier than you" or "I'm a better wrestler than you" crap like every other generic smurf WWE thinks we fans like. You know, I honestly don't think Vince likes wrestling. I think the only times he gets motivated is when his company is being run in the limelight and thats when all his creativity comes out. When it's in it's lowpoints between bursts, he just doesnt care. Like, have you seen Beyond the Mat where he's talking to Droz about his gimmick? You honestly think that same transcript would happen today? Vince wouldn't encourage anyone to be a puking wrestler, he would have told Droz to lose the piercings and cut his hair, and gain 40 pounds and then he might have a shot. |
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Post by Single H on Aug 3, 2008 20:08:18 GMT -5
I disagree. Maybe for a while he still looked generic, but give him the street clothes look and the vests and he wasn't so generic anymore.
But you're right. If he was stuck with what the E would give him, he would be floundering around the mid-card (if even brought up from developmental). He wouldn't be able to curse, or make catch phrases, or be a bad ass, or hell, even give that Stone Cold smile he has. He'd basically be a robot spewing out either "I'm prettier than you" or "I'm a better wrestler than you" crap like every other generic smurf WWE thinks we fans like.
You know, I honestly don't think Vince likes wrestling. I think the only times he gets motivated is when his company is being run in the limelight and thats when all his creativity comes out.
When it's in it's lowpoints between bursts, he just doesnt care.
Like, have you seen Beyond the Mat where he's talking to Droz about his gimmick? You honestly think that same transcript would happen today? Vince wouldn't encourage anyone to be a puking wrestler, he would have told Droz to lose the piercings and cut his hair, and gain 40 pounds and then he might have a shot.[/quote]
Stone Cold was generic for the most part esspeically when he was brought in as The Ringmaster to the King Of The Ring 3.16 speech. That's when his character really started to change and turn the volume up and take off.
that's basically what The Ringmaster gimmick was going to be the same gimmick as every other mid carder. That's what he and us the fans would have ended up with if they had not just let him be his self starting with King Of The Ring or just before and cutting aw some promos.
I think the WWF/E bookers and writers burnt out a lot of good quality story lines and entertainment during the 'Attitude era' a lot of stuff that should have lasted months sometimes even a year was lasting weeks even just one or two week story lines and having two top class shows a week as well as another show (Heat) and monthly (sometimes more than monthly) PPV's won't help in keeping you writing for your company absolute top notch. I don't think it's the performers I think it's just the writers are scraping the barrel for most part at this time. However they will come up with something or bring in someone over time who will bring the writing back to what it was but probably not as soon as most fans would like.
I haven't saw Beyond The Mat have heard of it but never got round to watching it
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Post by goodomens on Aug 4, 2008 6:02:20 GMT -5
How would you book Chilly McFreeze? As a mixture of Glacier and Doink, of course. |
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Post by kretchpoof on Aug 4, 2008 6:42:06 GMT -5
Well take a look at all the newcomers in the last couple years: Cody Rhodes Ted DiBiase Chris Masters Kenny Dykstra John Cena (before Steph found out he could rap) All generic looking smurfs. That's why they never got over, because WWE thinks that what we want are handsome-toned clean-cut guys in underwear. And I know I'm missing a good 10-20 people who fit that list who have debuted since 2002 that were just generic looking guys. Austin would have been like that. Who would have cared? It's just another guy with blond hair who can wrestle. He wouldn't have been given any personality as the Ringmaster, and would have been released or retconned before he would have been given a chance to become Stone Cold. Two of those guys mentioned are kinda over, and one is over like lube at a porn convention. Can you guess which one? |
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