Hiroshi Hase
Patti Mayonnaise
The Good Ol' Days
Posts: 30,755
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Post by Hiroshi Hase on May 17, 2009 18:12:46 GMT -5
....there's no other way to have a decent match with Hogan. Ask the Undertaker. Decent by whose standards? It wasn't going to be a technical masterpiece for smarks to swoon over. It did its purpose and the crowd went home happy which was more than enough that night.
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repomark
Unicron
For Mash Get Smash
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Post by repomark on May 17, 2009 18:14:13 GMT -5
When it comes to both HBK and Hogan, who did they ever truly put over in their careers? Now that I think about it, I think HBK has only elevated HHH. At least Hogan put over Warrior and eventually Yokozuna, although he did screw Yoko at Wrestlemania 8. It was Wrestlemania 9 where Hogan came out and beat Yokozuna. HBK has put over Razor Ramon, Diesel, Steve Austin, Kurt Angle, John Cena, Chris Jericho, Triple H, the Undertaker.....ofcourse it depends if your definition of "putting over" is limited to making the opponent a bigger star by losing to them or just losing to them. There are many more that he has lost high profile matches to, and I do not think there is any problem with HBK since his return in 2002 in terms of doing a job. Hogan put over quite a few guys in his return in 2002 - the Rock, Brock Lesnar and Kurt Angle spring to mind. Again it is arguable whether the wins elevated any of the three stars - although it certainly did in Lesnar's case. Warrior is the only one really I can think of in his 80's/early 90s peak years - although by his own admission he tried to wreck that by presenting the belt and taking away some of the focus on the Warrior's big moment at WM6. Back on topic - I love this match. HBK's comedy selling is pure gold - especially on the big boot. I do believe it made very little sense for Hogan to go over and I would have liked to see HBK continue the heel character that he played in the build up to the match.
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Hiroshi Hase
Patti Mayonnaise
The Good Ol' Days
Posts: 30,755
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Post by Hiroshi Hase on May 17, 2009 18:15:57 GMT -5
A lot of people are also forgetting that HBK was the antagonist throughout this feud and got the upper hand on Hogan nearly every week, while it would be cool for the heel to go over for the smarks, in the storyline it wouldn't have made sense.
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Starlight Starbright
Don Corleone
Suffers From Macho Madness.
?Literary, intelligent, yet capable of great savagery. A terrifying genius.?
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Post by Starlight Starbright on May 17, 2009 18:19:17 GMT -5
....there's no other way to have a decent match with Hogan. Ask the Undertaker. Decent by whose standards? It wasn't going to be a technical masterpiece for smarks to swoon over. It did its purpose and the crowd went home happy which was more than enough that night. So you agree because that's what I said. That's what I'm saying: it's the only way to go. Shawn didn't do anything wrong- maybe he mocked the concept of such a one-dimensional guy going over a little bit but no one noticed much anyway. Smarks aren't the only ones who dig "technical masterpieces". The only good way to have an entertaining match is make Hogan look like superman and bounce around everywhere. Punch, kick, punch, punch- sell it like he's the Hulk (which he is) legdrop.
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Starlight Starbright
Don Corleone
Suffers From Macho Madness.
?Literary, intelligent, yet capable of great savagery. A terrifying genius.?
Posts: 1,969
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Post by Starlight Starbright on May 17, 2009 18:20:37 GMT -5
A lot of people are also forgetting that HBK was the antagonist throughout this feud and got the upper hand on Hogan nearly every week, while it would be cool for the heel to go over for the smarks, in the storyline it wouldn't have made sense. I don't think any of us "smarks" you so despise because we're stupid or something said anything about HBK needing to go over. Im just pointing out the only thing one can do with Hogan is what Shawn did.
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Hiroshi Hase
Patti Mayonnaise
The Good Ol' Days
Posts: 30,755
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Post by Hiroshi Hase on May 17, 2009 18:25:06 GMT -5
A lot of people are also forgetting that HBK was the antagonist throughout this feud and got the upper hand on Hogan nearly every week, while it would be cool for the heel to go over for the smarks, in the storyline it wouldn't have made sense. I don't think any of us "smarks" you so despise because we're stupid or something said anything about HBK needing to go over. Im just pointing out the only thing one can do with Hogan is what Shawn did. I never said anyone was stupid, but usually when this topic gets brought up people talk about how HBK should've gone over when it wouldn't have made sense to. But I don't despise anyone either, just pointing out something that I noticed, nothing more, just settle down as it's not that serious.
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Hiroshi Hase
Patti Mayonnaise
The Good Ol' Days
Posts: 30,755
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Post by Hiroshi Hase on May 17, 2009 18:26:06 GMT -5
Decent by whose standards? It wasn't going to be a technical masterpiece for smarks to swoon over. It did its purpose and the crowd went home happy which was more than enough that night. So you agree because that's what I said. That's what I'm saying: it's the only way to go. Shawn didn't do anything wrong- maybe he mocked the concept of such a one-dimensional guy going over a little bit but no one noticed much anyway. Smarks aren't the only ones who dig "technical masterpieces". The only good way to have an entertaining match is make Hogan look like superman and bounce around everywhere. Punch, kick, punch, punch- sell it like he's the Hulk (which he is) legdrop. Smarks aren't, but they seem to be the majority who do and that's not what Vince is catering to.
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Starlight Starbright
Don Corleone
Suffers From Macho Madness.
?Literary, intelligent, yet capable of great savagery. A terrifying genius.?
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Post by Starlight Starbright on May 17, 2009 18:28:35 GMT -5
So you agree because that's what I said. That's what I'm saying: it's the only way to go. Shawn didn't do anything wrong- maybe he mocked the concept of such a one-dimensional guy going over a little bit but no one noticed much anyway. Smarks aren't the only ones who dig "technical masterpieces". The only good way to have an entertaining match is make Hogan look like superman and bounce around everywhere. Punch, kick, punch, punch- sell it like he's the Hulk (which he is) legdrop. Smarks aren't, but they seem to be the majority and that's not what Vince is catering to. ...which was my original point. You're so caught up with trying to expose smark logic as ridiculous (with the ridiculous "technical masterpieces" that obviously have no place in WWE ), you can't even realize when someone is saying the same thing you are. You non-smarks are so down to earth.
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Hiroshi Hase
Patti Mayonnaise
The Good Ol' Days
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Post by Hiroshi Hase on May 17, 2009 18:33:06 GMT -5
Smarks aren't, but they seem to be the majority and that's not what Vince is catering to. ...which was my original point. You're so caught up with trying to expose smark logic as ridiculous (with the ridiculous "technical masterpieces" that obviously have no place in WWE ), you can't even realize when someone is saying the same thing you are. You non-smarks are so down to earth. I just couldn't care about things like "workrate" and how many moves a guy can perform as to be honest that doesn't mean a whole lot especially in WWE. Technical masterpieces can be in WWE, just that don't hold your breath on that being the norm or featured in that company as it's more about entertainment. As for it being decent, it was just fine, the crowd liked it and that's all that mattered. You thought it wasn't decent, I disagreed there. That was it.
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Starlight Starbright
Don Corleone
Suffers From Macho Madness.
?Literary, intelligent, yet capable of great savagery. A terrifying genius.?
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Post by Starlight Starbright on May 17, 2009 18:36:45 GMT -5
...which was my original point. You're so caught up with trying to expose smark logic as ridiculous (with the ridiculous "technical masterpieces" that obviously have no place in WWE ), you can't even realize when someone is saying the same thing you are. You non-smarks are so down to earth. I just couldn't care about things like "workrate" and how many moves a guy can perform as to be honest that doesn't mean a whole lot especially in WWE. Technical masterpieces can be in WWE, just that don't hold your breath on that being the norm or featured in that company as it's more about entertainment. As for it being decent, it was just fine, the crowd liked it and that's all that mattered. You thought it wasn't decent, I disagreed there. That was it. When did I ever say I wanted to see a technical masterpiece in the WWE? When did I ever say I cared about video game concepts like "omg movez" and workrate? Don't unload your smark-hate unto me because I said the match was fine; I was replying to all the people who thought HBK did the wrong thing. I did think it was decent because it was the only thing to do. Get that through your smark-hating skull.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2009 18:38:09 GMT -5
Whole lotta Serious flowing through here
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Hiroshi Hase
Patti Mayonnaise
The Good Ol' Days
Posts: 30,755
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Post by Hiroshi Hase on May 17, 2009 18:39:02 GMT -5
I just couldn't care about things like "workrate" and how many moves a guy can perform as to be honest that doesn't mean a whole lot especially in WWE. Technical masterpieces can be in WWE, just that don't hold your breath on that being the norm or featured in that company as it's more about entertainment. As for it being decent, it was just fine, the crowd liked it and that's all that mattered. You thought it wasn't decent, I disagreed there. That was it. When did I ever say I wanted to see a technical masterpiece in the WWE? When did I ever say I cared about video game concepts like "omg movez" and workrate? Don't unload your smark-hate unto me because I said the match was fine; I was replying to all the people who thought HBK did the wrong thing. I did think it was decent because it was the only thing to do. Get that through your smark-hating skull. From reading your posts, it seems to me that you're the one with lots of anger, very much so. I never said you did, I just brought that up as a statement because that's what gets brought up when HBK and Hogan are compared, it wasn't directed towards you. I don't hate anyone, least of all smarks. My sig pretty much explains how my approach towards wrestling is.
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Magician under the moonlight
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Always Beaten To The Punchline. Always.
A magician and a thief. That's Badass
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Post by Magician under the moonlight on May 17, 2009 18:41:45 GMT -5
....there's no other way to have a decent match with Hogan. Ask the Undertaker. Shawn proved it otherwise.
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Starlight Starbright
Don Corleone
Suffers From Macho Madness.
?Literary, intelligent, yet capable of great savagery. A terrifying genius.?
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Post by Starlight Starbright on May 17, 2009 18:47:39 GMT -5
....there's no other way to have a decent match with Hogan. Ask the Undertaker. Shawn proved it otherwise. ....Shawn had the only kind of decent match by letting Hogan throw him around.
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Post by thedavefather on May 17, 2009 20:58:34 GMT -5
Find me one wrestler who complained about the match itself being bad, not Hogan, not HBK, not Jericho (HBK's dvd), not Vince. The only people who ever seem to be mad at what Shawn did was the internet smakrs like us. It was a good match, it was highly rated even by super hard Meltzer. This was the only way to do a match with Hogan to make him look good.
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Post by Jay Carroll on May 17, 2009 21:53:52 GMT -5
I was dissapointed as hell with the match cause HBK didn't go over, but it was funny as hell in hindsight to watch Shawn impersonate a guppy outside of water.
Also in hindsight, since HBK and Hogan were both pretty much legends at the time of the match, it only made sense for the bigger legend (Hogan) to go over. Had the match happened in Texas, Shawn should have went over, but, especially since he was being dick-heel HBK, he had to get his comeuppance.
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Professor Chaos
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Bringer of Destruction and Maker of Doom
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Post by Professor Chaos on May 17, 2009 22:10:46 GMT -5
Pretty much, though I go agree that Shawn should have gone over, but it's not like it hurt HBK's image. He was already a legend at that point and doing the job did nothing to hurt him. Great vid... I remember watching this match live laughing my ass off thinking WTF. The selling of the big boot is priceless.
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Post by VeggieOverlord on May 17, 2009 22:18:51 GMT -5
I love both guys, but both were dickish. I did find it hilarious how Shawn buried Hogan the next night on Raw. Calling him "cat-like."
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Johnny D
Don Corleone
Creature of the Night Forever
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Post by Johnny D on May 18, 2009 4:47:12 GMT -5
Both were at fault. The End.
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