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Post by chunkylover53 on Oct 19, 2009 19:57:15 GMT -5
in single's competition? I've noticed every time he was in a tag team, he had at least moderate success(the most successful was the New Age Outlaws), but every time he went solo, it got over like a fart in church. Here's a breakdown of Billy Gunn's WWF/E career...
1993 to 1996: Tag Champions with Bart Gunn as one half of The Smoking Gunns on three occasions. Had Sunny as a manager.
Late 1996 to Mid 1997: After the team broke up, he was directionless until Honky Tonk Man took him under his wing as Rockabilly. Then fizzled out until....
Late 1997 to early 1999: Formed a tag team with "Road Dogg" Jesse James and became the New Age Outlaws. Known for their crazy antics. They brought four tag team championships to their name. In early 1998, they became part of DX. Though looking back on it, I think it had more to do with Road Dogg's character and mic skills that carried(a word I don't often use) him to success. I'm sure the D-O double G could've had killer success in the upper midcard.
Mid 1999 to early 2000: Breaks up with Road Dogg, becomes Mr. Ass, a gimmick based on shaking his ass, wins the King of The Ring in an anti-climatic fashion, feuds with The Rock(was Gunn over then?), then goes back to help reform DX and wins the tag team titles with Road Dogg for the fifth and final time, after they lose the belts, he gets injured and put on the shelves for most of the year.
Late 2000 to 2001: When he came back, he was pushed again as a face and became Intercontinental champion. When he lost the belt, he was directionless, and formed a brief tag team with the Big Show(aptly titled The ShowGunns, cool name BTW).
2002: Formed a tag team with notable underachiever Chuck Palumbo. The team had homosexual overtones to it and most notably, had a gay wedding. After Eric Bischoff and Three Minute Warning crashed the scene, they automatically became "rugged" men in jeans, though that was cut short.
2002 to 2004: I don't remember what he did during that time, and quite frankly, I don't care. All I remember is he had Torrie Wilson as a manager, and he was later future endeavored after 10 plus years with the company.
So my question is, was it bad booking, lack of charisma, a combination of the two that prevented fans from caring about him? I know many will say The Rock and Edge & Christian buried him through their promos, but lets be honest, they did that kind of thing to everybody, why would Mr. Ass be singled out?
Your thoughts?
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2009 19:58:08 GMT -5
God spoke to Billy.
That's... That's pretty much why.
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Tapout
Hank Scorpio
WWE Creative(TM)
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Post by Tapout on Oct 19, 2009 19:59:10 GMT -5
The man just wasn't good enough to be a star in any area. Wasn't a good enough talker, wasn't a good enough worker, couldn't connect with the fans. God only knows he had enough chances.
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"Hollywood" Cactus Matt
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
You couldn't ask for a better custom title!
How do you spell "Goddess"? C-H-R-I-S-T-Y!
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Post by "Hollywood" Cactus Matt on Oct 19, 2009 20:01:30 GMT -5
Late 2000 to 2001: When he came back, he was pushed again as a face and became Intercontinental champion. When he lost the belt, he was directionless, and formed a brief tag team with the Big Show(aptly titled The ShowGunns, cool name BTW). I liked the name, too, but it would have been better had they acknowledged the KotR win in the team name, and would therefore be known as the ShowKingGunns. I'll see myself out..... |
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Pink Lloyd
Bubba Ho-Tep
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Post by Pink Lloyd on Oct 19, 2009 20:05:27 GMT -5
He just didn't have that "it" that it takes to go from mid-card to Main Event. He was great with Road Dogg but, on his own he just didn't connect with the fans as a heel or face.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2009 20:08:09 GMT -5
Late 2000 to 2001: When he came back, he was pushed again as a face and became Intercontinental champion. When he lost the belt, he was directionless, and formed a brief tag team with the Big Show(aptly titled The ShowGunns, cool name BTW). I liked the name, too, but it would have been better had they acknowledged the KotR win in the team name, and would therefore be known as the ShowKingGunns. I'll see myself out..... I thought they were the GunnShow  Anyways, I always saw Billy as a package deal. He worked well with the Road Dogg. Other than the terrible idea that was Billy and Chuck, what has he done that was memorable? I've always liked Billy...to a point. Some people'll tell you he's garbage. I don't think so, I just think he's a moderately skilled individual that never really found something to latch onto by himself. |
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Post by chunkylover53 on Oct 19, 2009 20:13:13 GMT -5
I liked the name, too, but it would have been better had they acknowledged the KotR win in the team name, and would therefore be known as the ShowKingGunns. I'll see myself out..... I thought they were the GunnShow Anyways, I always saw Billy as a package deal. He worked well with the Road Dogg. Other than the terrible idea that was Billy and Chuck, what has he done that was memorable? I've always liked Billy...to a point. Some people'll tell you he's garbage. I don't think so, I just think he's a moderately skilled individual that never really found something to latch onto by himself. Him and Road Dogg did many memorable things as the New Age Outlaws, and part of DX, but then again, that was a team effort, never by himself. |
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EvilMasterBetty, Esq.
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
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Post by EvilMasterBetty, Esq. on Oct 19, 2009 20:15:02 GMT -5
He didn't have "it". He's certainly a decent to pretty good wrestler. Very good athlete also. But he just never could push through as a top guy.
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Post by Mighty Attack Tribble on Oct 19, 2009 20:21:38 GMT -5
Some guys just can't make it by themselves. Even in tag teams he's always never been prominant member. Sunny outshone both of the Gunns (no pun intended), Road Dogg carried the Outlaws, Rico was more over than either Billy or Chuck. The trend continued in TNA too...
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Slim Loves Lily
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Post by Slim Loves Lily on Oct 19, 2009 20:27:04 GMT -5
Because he's Billy Gunn.
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Post by Oh Cry Me a Screwball on Oct 19, 2009 20:32:09 GMT -5
God spoke to Billy. That's... That's pretty much why. As hilarious as that promo was, it was a pretty ridiculous burial and Billy didn't have the charisma or the booking to make a recovery. |
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Ragnal
Game Genie
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Post by Ragnal on Oct 19, 2009 21:01:58 GMT -5
Aside from the "God spoke to Billy" promo, Billy just wasn't that great as a singles performer. You'll hear everyone talk about how great the Smoking Gunns were, the New Age Outlaws, and even Billy & Chuck. That's mostly because Billy was good to work off another person in another tag team. In singles, he didn't have that same factoring, and it hurt him big time.
Also, his TNA run was bad. Not only because of Voodoo Kin Mafia, but just because of the fact he was older, and didn't get the same rub there like he did from DX.
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Post by Crazy Diamond on Oct 19, 2009 21:15:54 GMT -5
God spoke to Billy. That's... That's pretty much why. As hilarious as that promo was, it was a pretty ridiculous burial and Billy didn't have the charisma or the booking to make a recovery. Billy shouldn't have been fighting The Rock to begin with. It got to be so bad that I began to feel sorry for Billy because even if he won, he still lost because no one took him seriously when he beat The Rock. Looking back, it was weird that Rock was fighting guys like Gangrel while Triple H was fighting Austin. I liked the NAO, but like the Road Warriors they never should have split up. Together they were fine because they could combine their strengths but separate they got exposed pretty quickly. |
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Post by hajimenoippo on Oct 19, 2009 21:18:16 GMT -5
The man just wasn't good enough to be a star in any area. Wasn't a good enough talker, wasn't a good enough worker, couldn't connect with the fans. God only knows he had enough chances. He was very over, he just wasn't a main eventer. This always pisses me off, just because he didn't win the WWE title doesn't mean he wasn't over. He was just as over as Shamrock was. |
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Post by The Summer of Muskrat XVII on Oct 19, 2009 21:23:26 GMT -5
Billy is just made for tag team wrestling, and he was always at his best when he was working with someone else. Gunns, NAO, GunnShow (no name was ever official), Billy and Chuck and finally working with Hardcore for the tail end of his run, he was pretty much always over.
But by himself, he just wasn't taken seriously. WWE always tried to treat him like an upper midcarder on the cusp of ME but the crowd never saw him as anything more then a run of the mill mid carder.
I blame WWE more the Billy, they always tried to make him something he wasn't whereas if they just treated him like an average midcarder he'd probably be relatively fondly remembered, rather then people remembering him as the guy who blow every push. He never should have been the one to get those pushes
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Post by chunkylover53 on Oct 19, 2009 21:37:23 GMT -5
Billy is just made for tag team wrestling, and he was always at his best when he was working with someone else. Gunns, NAO, GunnShow (no name was ever official), Billy and Chuck and finally working with Hardcore for the tail end of his run, he was pretty much always over. But by himself, he just wasn't taken seriously. WWE always tried to treat him like an upper midcarder on the cusp of ME but the crowd never saw him as anything more then a run of the mill mid carder. I blame WWE more the Billy, they always tried to make him something he wasn't whereas if they just treated him like an average midcarder he'd probably be relatively fondly remembered, rather then people remembering him as the guy who blow every push. He never should have been the one to get those pushes I think Shelton Benjamin's numerous pushes were worse. I mean, he has interactions with major stars such as Triple H, Chris Jericho, Ric Flair, etc etc. Is given a manager who outpops him THE FIRST WEEK, given 3 intercontinental and one US title run. I mean, don't get me wrong, the WWE recognizes his talent, but he lacks serious charisma. Didn't Billy Gunn at least get two major pushes? |
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Jimmy
Grimlock
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Post by Jimmy on Oct 19, 2009 21:40:53 GMT -5
As Mick Foley said in Foley is Good "With the exception of a Billy Gunn singles push, there are no bad intentions in wrestling".
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Post by Slingshot Suplay on Oct 19, 2009 21:42:57 GMT -5
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Post by The Deadly Snake on Oct 19, 2009 21:48:56 GMT -5
I think you all have missed the boat. Billy Gunn was the kind of guy that was decent enough at everything, but it always outshone in everything. He could do something good; someone else could do it better. Two, in a popularity-based promotion, he never quite had the size, look, or "IT" to make it higher, and in a performance-based promotion, he never quite the skills to be the best. He had decent size, look, "IT, and decent skills, but some people are better than him at least one, sometimes, all, of these areas than he was.
In a promotion where popularity was just important as your "rasslin'g", and the other way around, he might have become a bigger player.
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Soultastic
El Dandy
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Post by Soultastic on Oct 19, 2009 21:54:08 GMT -5
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