|
Post by Youngie on Oct 7, 2009 11:15:40 GMT -5
Please do not take shots at my past topics. Bret vs Goldberg only would had worked better one on one. C'mon pal you've made nearly 1000 posts in a month about nothing really. Cool off a bit.
|
|
|
Post by wasimperviz on Oct 7, 2009 11:26:47 GMT -5
Please do not take shots at my past topics. Bret vs Goldberg only would had worked better one on one. C'mon pal you've made nearly 1000 posts in a month about nothing really. Cool off a bit. I like the forum sorry. Back to topic Goldberg vs Bret still would have been good. I mean they never really had any bad matches.
|
|
|
Post by stevieraymark on Oct 7, 2009 15:49:05 GMT -5
I feel a Bret vs Goldberg match would have been huge face on face. If Bret could have beat Flair & Sting in long term feuds and then worked with Goldberg man would have been huge. You know what would have been better? If it had been a three-way with Bulldog. WCW are idiots for not doing this i feel it would have been huge i mean good not bad bottom line is it would have been a moment we woulld have all remembered for the rest of time and it would make new papers
|
|
|
Post by hbk4ever09 on Oct 7, 2009 16:14:21 GMT -5
Lol you guys are mean.
|
|
|
Post by wasimperviz on Oct 7, 2009 17:43:04 GMT -5
Goldberg & Bret worked well together and nobody can take that away from them.
|
|
|
Post by Bubble Lead on Oct 7, 2009 18:00:43 GMT -5
Goldberg doesn't deserve blame any more than say, D Lo deserves blame for ending the career of Droz. Accidents happen.
Owen Hart botched a piledriver and cut Austins career in half, but you dont hear anyone blame him for that since he is popular and Goldberg isn't.
I blame WCW and the doctors they used for what happened to Bret Hart. Not Goldberg.
|
|
|
Post by wasimperviz on Oct 7, 2009 18:19:25 GMT -5
Bret even said its not Goldbergs fault. It was a mistake end of.
|
|
|
Post by The Dark Order Inferno on Oct 8, 2009 7:09:35 GMT -5
Bret Hart doesn't blame Goldberg for what happened, he blames the WCW powerplant for not putting enough priority on teaching their wrestlers how to protect their opponent in the ring. As a Bret Hart fan, it bothers me he never got to return to the 'E and patch things up with Michaels and Vince on air to end the Montreal Saga once and for all as he's too affected by the stroke to work on live TV now, but it's not Goldberg's fault, he wrestles how he was trained to. People need to get over it and stop blaming Goldberg, Bret has.
|
|
|
Post by carter 15 on Oct 8, 2009 7:24:31 GMT -5
3-0 isn't impressive.
Because wrestling's pre-determined...
I love Berg. I like Hart, i have there Starrcade '99 match. It sucked. Hard.
And it ended in another "awesome screwjob inconclusive ending" with Roddy Piper just calling for the bell and walking out with the title.
|
|
|
Post by wasimperviz on Oct 8, 2009 10:33:02 GMT -5
3-0 isn't impressive. Because wrestling's pre-determined... I love Berg. I like Hart, i have there Starrcade '99 match. It sucked. Hard. And it ended in another "awesome screwjob inconclusive ending" with Roddy Piper just calling for the bell and walking out with the title. I remember that and will never understand why they ended the match like that at all.
|
|
|
Post by kingoftheindies on Oct 8, 2009 11:56:34 GMT -5
Sigh. Goldberg did not end Bret Hart's career. Yes, he gave Hart a concussion, but he wrestled several times with said concussion. He even did a hardcore match with Terry Funk which gave him another concussion. And THAT is what ended Bret HArt's career, not Goldbergs initial sidekick. Add to that accidents happen in wrestling. Only when it;s a wrestler the net fans don.;t like somehow it;s the other wrestlers fault. Bret didn;t get himself checked out and that;s the risk you take in any sport injury. You could argue that Bret Hart ended his own career by even being in the ring because injury's happen. The concussion he sustained from Goldberg was main, but Hart even admits in his book that he should've gotten himself checked out right away when it was clear something wasn't right. Not only the Hardcore match against Terry Funk, but he took a stiff kick from Johnny Flynn, and took a Jacknife from Nash (although Hart says Nash was trying to protect him, a Jacknife is hard to be fully protected), plus a couple other spots he shouldn't have taken. Point is, if Bret had played it safe (not easy to do), maybe it wouldn't have been so bad. Same thing can be said about a bunch of people. Had Shawn Michaels actually listened to his doctors and taken rehab and therapy for his back seriously, his back wouldn't have been bad.
|
|
|
Post by Brother Ike: Thread Killer on Oct 8, 2009 12:49:56 GMT -5
Bret Hart doesn't blame Goldberg for what happened, he blames the WCW powerplant for not putting enough priority on teaching their wrestlers how to protect their opponent in the ring. As a Bret Hart fan, it bothers me he never got to return to the 'E and patch things up with Michaels and Vince on air to end the Montreal Saga once and for all as he's too affected by the stroke to work on live TV now, but it's not Goldberg's fault, he wrestles how he was trained to. People need to get over it and stop blaming Goldberg, Bret has. Yeah that's pretty much the case. That is what happens when you just let a green worker with little training plow through everyone, and not really let him have a chance to gain experience and learn how to be a safe worker.
|
|
|
Post by Prince Petty on Oct 8, 2009 13:59:36 GMT -5
I don't think Bret blames Goldberg for what happened. He has criticised him for not taking enough care with his opponents, but much of that criticism was levelled at WCW for pushing a guy who was so green, and not making sure he protected his opponents.
He also laid blame at WCW's door for not getting his injury looked at, but he also castigates himself for trying to work through it with painkillers.
It seems that the whole atmosphere at WCW was pretty rotten by then, as Bret said in his book that most of the guys thought he was faking his concussion so he didn't have to work, or so he could try to sue the company.
It's also difficult to read anything into him having a 3 - 0 record against Goldberg, as WCW booking was such a mess that I doubt anyone was aware of it, or that anyone had made plans to use it as an angle.
|
|
|
Post by Youngie on Oct 8, 2009 14:02:58 GMT -5
As far as I can see Bret never blames himself for anything. Not saying the Goldberg incident is his fault (of course it's not) but he seems to have gotten so whiny and so into complaining since Montreal. He always has someone to blame.
|
|
|
Post by Bubble Lead on Oct 8, 2009 15:30:53 GMT -5
As far as I can see Bret never blames himself for anything. Not saying the Goldberg incident is his fault (of course it's not) but he seems to have gotten so whiny and so into complaining since Montreal. He always has someone to blame. Except he doesn't blame Goldberg for this. He also forgave Vince for Montreal and made amends. As I recall he has said that he understands how Vince felt and why he did it even though he wishes it wouldn't have happened the way it did. Its not like Bret is Ultimate Warrior or something, spewing venom from everyone at his website. Then, as others have said Bret took a measure of responsibility for his career ending because he got checked out by a WCW doctor and went out and wrestled even though he didn't feel confident about it. He should have gotten a second opinion. If Bret had rested up after the kick his career would have went on and he has acknowledged that. I get tired of people overestimating how much Bret complains or how bitter he is. If he was so bitter he wouldn't have accepted a WWE HOF induction or gave a great speech saying bye to his fans. About the only thing Bret still seems bitter about is towards Shawn Michaels, but theres a pretty long line of guys who dislike Shawn the same way Bret does, and Hart has more reasons beyond just Montreal.
|
|
|
Post by Youngie on Oct 8, 2009 15:38:20 GMT -5
Except he doesn't blame Goldberg for this. I know. Bret blames the powerplant. Bret has been bitter (IMO) since Montreal which is more than 10 years. He blamed Michaels, Vince etc for the past 10 years or so. Maybe now he's getting over it. He always has someone to blame is my point. He never blames himself though. He's totally self-centered in my eyes.
|
|
|
Post by Bubble Lead on Oct 8, 2009 15:48:59 GMT -5
Except he doesn't blame Goldberg for this. I know. Bret blames the powerplant. Bret has been bitter (IMO) since Montreal which is more than 10 years. He blamed Michaels, Vince etc for the past 10 years or so. Maybe now he's getting over it. He always has someone to blame is my point. He never blames himself though. He's totally self-centered in my eyes. Bret got over it way more than just recently. He made amends with Vince back in 2005. He even thanked Vince in his HOF speech which was in 2006. So yeah, not just recently. As far as HBK goes, like I said he dislikes HBK for more reasons than just Montreal. He may partially blame the Powerplant, which is warranted IMO. He took a measure of personal responsibility, as I said, because he continued wrestling even though he should have taken a break. Its not like Bret came out and said it was all the Powerplant trainers faults that his career was ended and then tried to sue them or something. You act as if Bret is Billy Jack Haynes doing shoot interviews saying WCW, Vince McMahon, etc. ruined his life or crap like that. Considering the HUGE number of bitter retired wrestlers out there, why must Bret Hart be singled out? Especially when he shows a much higher measure of class than the majority of them. Hell, Ric Flair to this day still bitches about WCW supposedly misusing him. Bret Hart has a much, much stronger case for being misused there but he doesn't constantly complain on TV shows or DVDs any chance he gets like Flair does.
|
|
|
Post by Youngie on Oct 8, 2009 15:53:45 GMT -5
You act as if Bret is Billy Jack Haynes doing shoot interviews saying WCW, Vince McMahon, etc. ruined his life or crap like that. I'm sure Bret feels that way about Vince. Ever read any of his interviews? "Punching Vince Was The Most Beautiful Thing I Ever Did" was one. That crap annoys me that Bret must always be the vocal point. He needs to just get on with his life. So he got over Montreal in '05. That's still nearly 10 years of complaining about being "screwed". I'm not singling Bret out at all. Only that this is a thread somewhat about Bret Hart. Amen't I allowed to criticize Bret if I feel the need to? You're taking my personal criticism of Bret way too seriously.
|
|
|
Post by Bubble Lead on Oct 8, 2009 16:04:09 GMT -5
You act as if Bret is Billy Jack Haynes doing shoot interviews saying WCW, Vince McMahon, etc. ruined his life or crap like that. I'm sure Bret feels that way about Vince. Ever read any of his interviews? "Punching Vince Was The Best Thing I Ever Did" was one. That crap annoys me that Bret must always be the vocal point. He needs to just get on with his life. So he got over Montreal in '05. That's still nearly 10 years of complaining about being "screwed". I'm not singling Bret out at all. Amen't I allowed to criticize Bret if I feel the need to? You're taking my personal criticism of Bret way too seriously. Nah. I am just making points about the situation...dont think I am taking this hard or anything. I believe that Brets bitterness or inability to get over things is constantly exaggerated because there is a popular opinion out there that he is still angry over things he hasn't been angry about in years. I mean, look at this thread. There are still a lot of people out there that believe he hates Goldberg, for instance, or that he blames Goldberg for ending his career when it couldn't be further from the truth. When you look at the guy he has every reason to be bitter. He was involved in a real life, legit situation where he got humiliated on PPV. His brother died after being pushed to do something he wasn't very comfortable with by the same company. Yet he still made amends with said company, did appearances for them, and accepted a HOF induction. I am not saying Bret is perfect or doesn't have an ego or what have you. Just that he is a pretty classy guy. When you consider all the ex WWE guys who are extremely bitter over petty things like not getting the push they wanted or feeling like their checks weren't quite as high as they wanted Bret looks pretty good by comparison to me.
|
|
|
Post by Youngie on Oct 8, 2009 16:08:38 GMT -5
Sure. Point taken.
|
|