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Post by Robbymac on Dec 3, 2009 8:16:31 GMT -5
WWE really doesn't get it do they? They want to fix the 2 shows with the least problems! If you were running the company would you feel this way? Its a business. Raw does the best business. Therefore it has the least problems. Period. I prefer Smackdown and ECW too, but if I was running the WWE I'd be looking to change them up in order to make them more like the show that gets more viewers. Not the other way around. Granted most of those changes would involve timeslot and network, but there are other reasons that casual fans prefer Raw. I always use my old roommate as the barometer for who the WWE needs to hook. He was not a wrestling fan by any means. He would watch Raw. He wouldn't make fun of it. On occassion he'd even mark out for a few things. If I was watching Smackdown he'd say "this is dumb, turn the channel" That's a problem.
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Post by angryfan on Dec 3, 2009 9:01:03 GMT -5
Trying to re-brand their two best shows? Dammit, it's like they're ashamed to be a wrestling company now. You win, this is exactly what it is. Vince has done everything he can for over twenty years to not be a wrestling company, since before Turner bought WCW. He's been in the "entertainment business", he's given interviews where he says, "we don't do wrestling, we make movies" (a solid decade plus before WWE films was even thought of), renaming the concept "sports entertainment" and the performers "superstars". It's brand identity to a point, but it's also the fact the he does not want to be a "wrestling promotion", because that lacks the grandeur and magnitude he feels should be associated with what he does.
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Post by brettappedout (BLM) on Dec 3, 2009 9:02:30 GMT -5
Well I like the new talent idea for whatever ECW will be, but I'll wait and see before I freak out until more ideas comes out about SmackDown, however I'm glad they turned down the TMZ/Hollywood Excess like show, I think we all know that would've been awful.
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Beast Army Ass
Hank Scorpio
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Post by Beast Army Ass on Dec 3, 2009 9:35:33 GMT -5
I don't know how many of the people reacting actually read the second paragraph, but WWE does not want to change ECW. Sy Fi does. And since their contract is up soon, WWE has no choice or lose the timeslot. Very true, but keep in mind WHY SyFy wants WWE to change ECW. The ratings are a shell of what they were pulling in when ECW started, mostly due to WWE booking the show into the dirt after Heyman went away. Basically, SyFy noticed that WWE was taking the "do just enough work to not get fired" route, and are forcing them to get their crap together. Given how the ratings are now, it'll take a LOT of work to pull ECW out of the gutter, so while I want the show to keep going (as someone said, for pure wrestling it's hard to top), I think they'll switch it up to the new guys only show, it'll still get the same crappy numbers, and execs will get impatient, pulling the plug entirely. Given how they introduce the new guys now (that is, no hype or reason to care whatsoever), why would viewers care about a show full of Randy Orton clones fresh out of FCW?
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Post by hajimenoippo on Dec 3, 2009 14:23:07 GMT -5
It's the changes that have happened in the last couple of months that I'm unhappy with. You had a roster on Smackdown that was younger, physically smaller and better workers and they're getting great reviews. Then Punk is kicked out of the main event in favour of Taker who can't go more than 10 minutes anymore. Then Batista is brought in and Smackdown starts to look like the land of the giants again. It just reeks of Vince interfering with a show that was gaining success and starting to bring the ratings up with some *gasp* actual wrestling. I've come to the conclusion that the two remaining McMahons are the albatross around this company's collective neck smaller doesn't equal better they lost edge and Jeff so they bring in Batista to fill that main eventer void. punk is doing just fine feuding with r-truth. Like he Orton is feuding with Kori
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2009 20:19:30 GMT -5
It's the changes that have happened in the last couple of months that I'm unhappy with. You had a roster on Smackdown that was younger, physically smaller and better workers and they're getting great reviews. Then Punk is kicked out of the main event in favour of Taker who can't go more than 10 minutes anymore. Then Batista is brought in and Smackdown starts to look like the land of the giants again. It just reeks of Vince interfering with a show that was gaining success and starting to bring the ratings up with some *gasp* actual wrestling. I've come to the conclusion that the two remaining McMahons are the albatross around this company's collective neck smaller doesn't equal better they lost edge and Jeff so they bring in Batista to fill that main eventer void. punk is doing just fine feuding with r-truth. Like he Orton is feuding with KoriI support this feud. Mostly since Orton would quickly be annihilated.
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Post by Kroot bringing Justice on Dec 3, 2009 22:51:50 GMT -5
Was it Candido who was trying to become a writer for ECW and met the chick who said that there not a Wrestling Company?
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Post by The Tank on Dec 3, 2009 22:53:31 GMT -5
Was it Candido who was trying to become a writer for ECW and met the chick who said that there not a Wrestling Company? That would be Steve Corino. Chris Candido was dead LONG before ECW came back.
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Dave at the Movies
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Post by Dave at the Movies on Dec 3, 2009 23:57:16 GMT -5
This is so stupid.
doesn't WWE understand that ECW and Smackdown get lower ratings due to the networks they are on and also due to the fact that they aren't on live?
The guest host crapfest hasn't done anything for WWE.
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Post by Mayonnaise on Dec 4, 2009 0:03:55 GMT -5
Well, Smackdown's deal is up soon and, Bonnie Hammer needs to help Comcast shore up the NBC Family of networks...
I mean, ECW has proven they can draw on SyFy (2.8 for it's debut) so maybe have Smackdown "merge" with ECW and take their slot. Both problems solved.
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Post by Kroot bringing Justice on Dec 4, 2009 0:45:46 GMT -5
Was it Candido who was trying to become a writer for ECW and met the chick who said that there not a Wrestling Company? That would be Steve Corino. Chris Candido was dead LONG before ECW came back. Funny story. I actually did that to Corino at a Indy show once. He was not happy and seriously thought I was trying to poke fun when I'm just an idiot who gets names mixed up.
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H-Fist
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Post by H-Fist on Dec 4, 2009 0:49:33 GMT -5
Was it Candido who was trying to become a writer for ECW and met the chick who said that there not a Wrestling Company? That would be Steve Corino. Chris Candido was dead LONG before ECW came back. This is the second post in this thread that displays a very, very different sense of time than I possess. Candido died in 2005, barely a year before ECW on SyFy debuted. The other post said something to the effect that Smackdown is not interesting partly because it is taped so far in advance. The "advance" is a mere three days. Having grown up watching Superstars and pre-taped Raws, not to mention renting Coliseum home releases from Blockbuster, I have a hard time connecting the "3 days = long time" logic. I'm not meaning to attack anyone or anything. I'm just pointing out that, perhaps, part of the problem WWE is facing in all phases of its game is that today's dominant culture demands instant gratification. Everyone wants spoilers and newz rather than surprises. Everyone wants an immediate payoff (ie, rapid title changes, short periods of heel dominance, same old mediocrity instead of change) rather than a slow burn. Everyone wants to be entertained in a completely impersonal sort of way, as if they don't want an emotional connection. OR so it appears because that is the sort of product that they have experienced (in wrestling, in movies, in reality TV, in music, online, on cable news, etc.) for the past few years. Let's face it: John Cena and Triple H are the ONLY draws that WWE has who have been ACTIVE for ALL of 2009. Taker missed time. HBK missed time. Jeff Hardy left. Rey Mysterio has been suspended. Batista has been hurt. Orton is someone who faces can draw against to some extent. Jericho is definitely someone faces can draw against. Big Show is...not a draw because he's Shaq's bitch. Edge is one of those guys, too, but he has been hurt. Punk potentially can be one of those top draw-against heels. Morrison and Kingston are showing the potential to be draws down the road. A draw puts asses in seats. Those asses trek to the arenas and buy the pay-per-views. But those asses also tune in to the TV shows and affect Nielsen ratings. Raw is the "first" show of the week, so obviously simple availability makes it a bit of a draw on its own. ECW and Smackdown are never treated as equals, so they shouldn't be seen that way no matter what the booking or roster says otherwise. But the company has done a terrible job of making new stars the past few years. Hardy, Punk and Morrison are three examples of guys making themselves and being made by the fans. WWE knew they were good; but they sure didn't expect those three shrimpy, goofy-looking guys to main event while Lashley would be out of the company and Kozlov (and so many developmental Create-a-Wrestlers) would be sent right back down. WWE didn't try to hide those guys or anything like that. But they are FAR from the template WWE likes to see on top. Kofi is another one of those guys who isn't a behemoth or "true" heavyweight. SO they might be making changes in that respect (also, fewer and fewer big guys seem to be entering the business; there are way more Evan Bournes out there than Edges). Smackdown's problem the past couple years has been a lack of credibility. They did so well between the draft and the return of the Undertaker to find so many younger talents so many new niches. Ziggler got over, Punk moved up, R-Truth looked good in limited use, Khali was over as a face in spite of the previous "you can't wrestle" chants from the bleeping marks, Edge and Jericho were doing great stuff trying to out-heel one another, and Mysterio was having his best year in ages...plus Haas was on TV as a solid jobber while Morrison became an instant fan-favorite who is now, in the mind of the casual fan, the next Jeff Hardy-type main eventer. But Batista/Taker MURDERS the flow the show had. It forces a match off the show to make way for promos because those two guys can't wrestle 4 times per week between TV and house shows. So the lower card ends up on Superstars or off TV, losing the chances that Ziggler and JoMo had earlier this year. WWE could have taken one on the chin for a year in terms of the ratings. Let 2009 be the year that Morrison, Ziggler, Punk, R-Truth, Mike Knox, Festus/Gallows, Cryme Time, the Hart Dynasty, McIntyre, Escobar, Shelton, Jesse/Slam Master J, and anyone else they have could grab the damn bull by the balls and get over with the fans. You know: fans. THE PEOPLE WHO ACTUALLY PAY MONEY DIRECTLY TO YOU IN EXCHANGE FOR ACCESS TO YOUR PRODUCT AND ANCILLARY MERCHANDISE. Smackdown has been the "weak" show...but who was on top of the card over the summer? Which show churned out the matches that made fans glad they tuned in and happy to pay more money next time [ECW, jump on this bandwagon, too] without requiring gimmicked matches? What show actually saw the vocal audience response consistently improve from week to week? You're right: that does not mean that Smackdown's or ECW's ratings would necessarily go up. But it DOES mean that, down the road, as all the old and injured guys hang 'em up, they will have viable replacements who have been groomed to get over with the fans and make them invest. They won't just be midcarders who are put into midcard-type feuds that happen to involve a main eventer on the other side (see Sheamus/Cena and, to a lesser extent because he's f***ing run with it, Kofi/Orton).
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Post by Schattenjager on Dec 4, 2009 2:09:10 GMT -5
Trying to re-brand their two best shows? Dammit, it's like they're ashamed to be a wrestling company now. They are. Vince has always been ashamed of running a wrestling company. That's why he has tried his utmost to brand it as "entertainment" and get away from the "rassling" stigma.
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Chainsaw
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Post by Chainsaw on Dec 4, 2009 2:12:31 GMT -5
If you go by these reports, it looks like WWE is priming itself up for a potential run at a new chapter in their lives. Chapter 11.
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Post by Rorschach on Dec 4, 2009 17:08:56 GMT -5
If you go by these reports, it looks like WWE is priming itself up for a potential run at a new chapter in their lives. Chapter 11. ;D
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AriadosMan
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Post by AriadosMan on Dec 4, 2009 17:39:39 GMT -5
ECW doesn't make much sense of Syfy anyway. Its audience has no overlap with WWE's (or at best, very minimal). Would it kill them to try for a more general interest channel like FX? Or WGN?
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Matt Dunn
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Post by Matt Dunn on Dec 7, 2009 16:24:53 GMT -5
Anyone else amused at how Syfy had to rebrand for a stupid reason and now the WWE's show on Syfy is doing the same thing? Yes. Incredibly amused.
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barley96
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Post by barley96 on Dec 7, 2009 17:11:37 GMT -5
When ECW was somewhat catered to the smarks they had there highest ratings. When Vince McMahon further emasculated the show, ratings plummeted.
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Post by manstis1804 on Dec 7, 2009 20:41:39 GMT -5
ECW should be the cruiserweight show with an emphasis on high flying and wild personalities and matches. Smackdown should be more of straight wrestling show and get a GM that will hook viewers, like if they could get someone like Bret Hart for example, someone wrestling fans connect with and respect. And Raw should be Raw, with all the drama, promos, skits, etc. but NO GUEST HOST. That's all really vague and simple but I think they just need to differentiate more and make each brand stick out instead of Raw being the only one that does.
Or, they could scrap everything but Raw, make it 3 hours every week and have everything on one show.
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