Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2010 12:58:13 GMT -5
Honestly is Bryan's half as good as people around here seem to think he is maybe there just trying to help the others get over
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Post by dh03grad on Apr 7, 2010 13:30:06 GMT -5
To everybody who's saying "He's being booked right": First, I'll ask again, what if he doesn't get the "Big Win" over Miz like you all think he will? The end of NXT is still 7 or so weeks away. If he doesn't get any wins by that point, then he'll be 0-14. How stupid would the other 7 rookies, all 8 pros, and the NXT concept in general look if the winner was the guy who went 0-14? And if they're going to give him a win vs. some lesser opponent, then why haven't they just done it already? Even if they give him a win or two, the guy going 1-13 or 2-12 winning the whole thing still makes NXT, etc. look incredibly dumb. After all the work the WWE put into the Miz -- arguably the most over heel in the company right now -- do you really think they're going to sacrifice all of that to give some new guy that the fans may very well have abandoned a win? How stupid does it make the Miz (and his previous opponents) look to lose clean to a rookie who went 0-15 (or whatever) after wrestling some of the best wrestlers in the world? If Bryan gets a dirty win, it doesn't help him at all. He'll look like a 0-15 loser who couldn't pull off a win without help. His victory (and if the belt is on the line, his reign) will look like a complete fluke and will be crapped all over by the fans. If he wins the belt, his reign will be remembered about as well as Santino's IC title reign. If he gets a dirty win, it won't be a feud between Miz and Bryan. It'll be a feud between Miz and the guy who cost him the belt, with Bryan being the third wheel. The most likely outcome of that would be a triple threat match where Bryan loses the title. The Miz and the other guy then continue to feud over the belt while Bryan becomes the next Evan Borne. The more I think about this angle, the more I realize that this will not help Bryan -- or anyone else involved -- in the long run, and could very well hurt them. Bryan getting past 0-10, then you are getting into Barry Horowitz level if you are trying to put him against Miz for the title. WWE needs to abort whatever they are doing, and run a 'turning the tide' angle where Danielson starts to win and Miz gets nervous or something.
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Post by dh03grad on Apr 7, 2010 13:32:22 GMT -5
All it takes to win the casual fans over is one win. CM Punk was jobbing to Hardcore Holly in the weeks before his Money in the Bank victory at WrestleMania XXIV. Hell, he was a complete afterthought on Raw right before he cashed in the Money in the Bank and won the World Heavyweight Championship in June 2008. Jack Swagger was a joke who was on a colossal losing streak before winning Money in the Bank at WrestleMania XXVI. A week later, he's the World Heavyweight Champion. All it takes is one big win to completely wash away the previous weeks of failure. That being said, they really need to do it sooner rather than later. They can't turn him into Barry Horowitz, and keep jobbing him out, because no matter how over they are with the crowd, there will still be that fringe that looks at Bryan as the guy who couldn't win after his first eight matches on NXT. He needs to start winning soon, because you can tell that he's starting to lose the crowd that was so vocally on his side in the first week of NXT. At least Punk and Swagger were ECW champ and booked with some respect long before winning the World title.
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Post by sunnytaker on Apr 7, 2010 15:15:35 GMT -5
the Young loss was the one that made me wince a bit. the rest were more or less a "strength of schedule" losses thing compared to what the other rookies had done. but was it just me or did Danielson seem a bit more ticked off as he was heading up the ramp after the match this time. from what i recall of the other matches i got more of a disapointed vibe from him. this time looked to be more of an angry vibe. a sign of a more serious/focused danielson to come?
as for the keg race, i didn't really think he took it that seriously compared to the others and was trying to be more of a goofball/entertaining/make faces at Cole guy to give the fans who declined to take a bathroom break during it a chuckle.
to be honest i was expecting him to face tarver or otunga this week after the verbal jawing they had each of the past two weeks. i'm also half wondering if, at this rate, they are planning on a Tarver vs. Bryan- the bottom two of the next poll facing off to decide who stays with neither of them having a win to that point.
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Post by Brian Suntan on Apr 7, 2010 15:37:24 GMT -5
MVP hasn't recovered from his losing streak because they don't want him too. They're clearly happy with where he's at in the card at this point in time. Aside from the fued with the Miz (which he was over in), he's had nothing to do in months.
Bryan on the other hand, is the focal point of the show. There's a clear difference.
Just see where it goes. It's not like the dude is Tarver and he's doing nothing. I hate the arguements that go 'I myself don't like this, therefore I will generalise and make out that I know casual fans won't either'.
If they care enough about Bryan to put him in meaningful fueds and plenty of tv time, he'll be over just fine.
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Post by truwrestlingfan on Apr 7, 2010 15:43:19 GMT -5
MVP hasn't recovered from his losing streak because they don't want him too. They're clearly happy with where he's at in the card at this point in time. Aside from the fued with the Miz (which he was over in), he's had nothing to do in months. Bryan on the other hand, is the focal point of the show. There's a clear difference. Just see where it goes. It's not like the dude is Tarver and he's doing nothing. I hate the arguements that go 'I myself don't like this, therefore I will generalise and make out that I know casual fans won't either'. If they care enough about Bryan to put him in meaningful fueds and plenty of tv time, he'll be over just fine. Dude, did you not read my post? MVP won the US title a few weeks after his losing streak...I don't see how a wrestler is "ruined" when they won a title after the supposed "burial"
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Post by dh03grad on Apr 7, 2010 15:56:18 GMT -5
MVP hasn't recovered from his losing streak because they don't want him too. They're clearly happy with where he's at in the card at this point in time. Aside from the fued with the Miz (which he was over in), he's had nothing to do in months. Bryan on the other hand, is the focal point of the show. There's a clear difference. Just see where it goes. It's not like the dude is Tarver and he's doing nothing. I hate the arguements that go 'I myself don't like this, therefore I will generalise and make out that I know casual fans won't either'. If they care enough about Bryan to put him in meaningful fueds and plenty of tv time, he'll be over just fine. Dude, did you not read my post? MVP won the US title a few weeks after his losing streak...I don't see how a wrestler is "ruined" when they won a title after the supposed "burial" Winning a title is only as good as the booking of the title reign. A title is an inanimate object that is defined by the wrestler holding it and the booking.
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Post by Galluchadore on Apr 7, 2010 17:41:26 GMT -5
if it makes anyone feel better Kenta Kobashi lost his first 60 or so matches... and he did alright.
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Post by dimoent on Apr 7, 2010 18:16:33 GMT -5
After watching this week's RAW, does anybody else have the feeling that they might go for Otunga for the win to cash in on his mainstream popularity?
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toonami4life
Don Corleone
Better than your favorite crossover
Posts: 1,770
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Post by toonami4life on Apr 7, 2010 18:25:38 GMT -5
if it makes anyone feel better Kenta Kobashi lost his first 60 or so matches... and he did alright. Yeah, but in Japan it's different. You can expect to lose a lot of matches as a beginner as you continue you're training which is basically them getting mauled apart by some of the baddest and stiffest dudes around to see if you have what it takes. After they believe you have learned enough you get sent to the states or elsewhere overseas to get a better style and then when they make their return they are viewed as ready in the public eye and can make a name for yourself. Ultimo Dragon after he completed his training in Mexico was pretty much begged to come back to Japan as he had increased so much.
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jamielowndes {N}
Unicron
The following post has been paid for by the Nexus World Order
Posts: 3,240
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Post by jamielowndes {N} on Apr 7, 2010 18:39:17 GMT -5
Honestly is Bryan's half as good as people around here seem to think he is maybe there just trying to help the others get over You can't put someone over if you yourself have no TV credibility.
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Post by Stab Sword on Apr 7, 2010 22:06:18 GMT -5
No, now Michael Tarver is being jobbed out.
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Post by thedudebuster on Apr 7, 2010 22:14:04 GMT -5
The small pale guy is the underdog, I think.
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Post by I Like Your Poetry on Apr 7, 2010 22:16:48 GMT -5
It should lead to match where he wrestles the Miz for the US title on PPV...then he loses.
Bryan then goes on to pretty much wrestle exclusively on Superstars, picking up occasional wins over Chavo and Carlito.
He's released within a year, and the internet goes apes***.
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Post by Confused Mark Wahlberg on Apr 7, 2010 22:31:16 GMT -5
Since Young is Bizarro Cena, you'd think the odds would overcome him, not the other way around.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2010 8:12:51 GMT -5
Honestly, I think it's amazing how the one thing NXT seems to be devoted to is that Bryan loses. Barrett goes from week to week between being the strongest of the rookies and being a total jobbber, they tell us Darren Young is useless when he has a better win / loss record than most of the guys on the NXT roster, Otunga seems to be getting pushed while not actually doing anything, etc. Most of the show just makes no sense.
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Post by N E O G E O B O Y S on Apr 8, 2010 8:39:08 GMT -5
I can see the story now, the miz hasn't appeared in the lasts weeks
Bryan is being buried by everybody, cole, striker, and the rest who are expecting to be someone better, he always showcase his wrestling skills but still, needs ''something'' to cut onto the wwe
Then, he will ally with miz becoming a mega heel, or something like that
The other thing could be is that since he is losing a lot, he would be at the bottom of the ranking, and then, and every week he will be the first one to being eliminated, selling the show in that, in some reality shows always the popular is in constant peril to be eliminated
But listen, I doubt that they are burying him, he is at the top of the ranking, they had michael cole only to destroy him, he slowly showcase his maneuvers (I think that this was the first time that he applied the Cattle Mutilation Right?) and they gave him instantly a feud with his pro, who is also one of the mos overs heels at the moment
if they really wanted to bury him, his pro will be carlito, he will not be mentioned in all the shows that cole is it, and he will be at the middlo or the bottom of the ranking
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H-Fist
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 6,485
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Post by H-Fist on Apr 8, 2010 13:56:40 GMT -5
Do you really consider a game like, for example, the Lions vs. Patriots or Lions vs. Colts to be anywhere near "fair and balanced"? Top teams have more money to spend, better talent, a better coaching staff, etc. While I don't follow the salaries of the NFL players, I'm willing to bet that the Patriots have spent more money on Tom Brady and Wes Welker than the Lions have spent on half their roster. The rules might be equal, but a game like Pats/Lions or Colts/Lions is nowhere near "Fair and Balanced". To me, a game like Pats/Colts is the football equivalent to Bryan/Jericho. You already know who's going to win before it even begins. While the NFL owners have opted out of the final year of the expiring CBA for the upcoming season, the Collective Bargaining Agreement under which the League has operated includes a hard salary cap, which was 59.5% of the total projected revenue of the NFL for the upcoming season. It was about $127 million in 2009. The hard cap cannot be exceeded under any circumstances. Similarly, the floor is mandatory. The most recent hard floor was calculated to be 87.8% of the hard cap, or $111.5 million. The difference between the floor and the cap was $15.5 million. Furthermore, the NFL's media distribution and other marketing outlets are handled on a national as opposed to local level. As such, each franchise receives an equal share of the total pooled revenue of the League. So yes, the playing field is COMPLETELY level in the National Football League. There is no league past or present that has ever offered the true competitive balance of the NFL in the past decade. The imbalances arise solely from human incompetence and hubris, which exist purely at the upper levels of ownership and management. The League can't make stupid rich people smart or humble enough to hire competent people they disagree with. And to take the point still further, the Green Bay Packers are publicly owned by the people of Green Bay, WI. They don't have Jerruh or Dan Snyder or the McCaskeys or Al Davis running things. They are owned by the people. The field is balanced. The Lions were run into the ground by incompetence from the top down. ----------------------------------- On topic specifically, please see the following picture: This is a picture of a broom. I urge you to ignore the straw and focus on the wooden handle, or "stick." I would then ask you to think about the current WWE roster as constructed. Make a mental list of names who fit the following description: 1) Extensive in-ring experience 2) Ability to wrestle against myriad styles convincingly 3) Able to call a match and carry the load of its structure 4) Makes the opponent look good in victory or defeat *Waits a minute* {Spoiler}Chavo, Regal, Jericho, Christian, Punk, Goldust Triple H and Finlay are limited by their age, though no doubt would have been near the top a couple years back. Taker's gimmick is such that he generally doesn't have those kinds of matches. Mysterio's and Kane's sizes are a detriment to making an opponent look good. Hardy's health issues the past few years have slowed him down. Cena can make anyone look decent, but still, he is booked so often not to. Edge's Achilles recovery leaves a lot to be seen. And every other questionable name you might put forward - Carlito, Shelton, Funaki - has equal arguments against him. The simple matter of fact is that, on WWE NXT, if they want some of their Rookies to get over, they need to get wins. And to get a win, someone has to lose. It can't just be losses to each other, as no one can distinguish himself that way if they keep trading. And they can't consistently feed established WWE veterans to the kids without hurting the standing and credibility of any of them. And it would hurt everyone for a Skip Sheffield or a Darren Young to pick up a crap win in a crappy match against Chris Masters or Caylen Croft. So the answer is Daniel Bryan. The moment he walked through the door, he became one of their top broomstick workers. Whether or not you [general plural you] think he's awesome or not, he fits all four criteria I listed above. And he does get good matches out of anyone. So he is stuck in a position where they need him to take those falls. He's the only guy who can't lost his own credibility but still add to someone else's, speaking purely in terms of NXT alone.
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Post by Lance Uppercut on Apr 8, 2010 14:34:43 GMT -5
Do you really consider a game like, for example, the Lions vs. Patriots or Lions vs. Colts to be anywhere near "fair and balanced"? Top teams have more money to spend, better talent, a better coaching staff, etc. While I don't follow the salaries of the NFL players, I'm willing to bet that the Patriots have spent more money on Tom Brady and Wes Welker than the Lions have spent on half their roster. The rules might be equal, but a game like Pats/Lions or Colts/Lions is nowhere near "Fair and Balanced". To me, a game like Pats/Colts is the football equivalent to Bryan/Jericho. You already know who's going to win before it even begins. While the NFL owners have opted out of the final year of the expiring CBA for the upcoming season, the Collective Bargaining Agreement under which the League has operated includes a hard salary cap, which was 59.5% of the total projected revenue of the NFL for the upcoming season. It was about $127 million in 2009. The hard cap cannot be exceeded under any circumstances. Similarly, the floor is mandatory. The most recent hard floor was calculated to be 87.8% of the hard cap, or $111.5 million. The difference between the floor and the cap was $15.5 million. Furthermore, the NFL's media distribution and other marketing outlets are handled on a national as opposed to local level. As such, each franchise receives an equal share of the total pooled revenue of the League. So yes, the playing field is COMPLETELY level in the National Football League. There is no league past or present that has ever offered the true competitive balance of the NFL in the past decade. The imbalances arise solely from human incompetence and hubris, which exist purely at the upper levels of ownership and management. The League can't make stupid rich people smart or humble enough to hire competent people they disagree with. And to take the point still further, the Green Bay Packers are publicly owned by the people of Green Bay, WI. They don't have Jerruh or Dan Snyder or the McCaskeys or Al Davis running things. They are owned by the people. The field is balanced. The Lions were run into the ground by incompetence from the top down. ----------------------------------- On topic specifically, please see the following picture: This is a picture of a broom. I urge you to ignore the straw and focus on the wooden handle, or "stick." I would then ask you to think about the current WWE roster as constructed. Make a mental list of names who fit the following description: 1) Extensive in-ring experience 2) Ability to wrestle against myriad styles convincingly 3) Able to call a match and carry the load of its structure 4) Makes the opponent look good in victory or defeat *Waits a minute* {Spoiler}Chavo, Regal, Jericho, Christian, Punk, Goldust Triple H and Finlay are limited by their age, though no doubt would have been near the top a couple years back. Taker's gimmick is such that he generally doesn't have those kinds of matches. Mysterio's and Kane's sizes are a detriment to making an opponent look good. Hardy's health issues the past few years have slowed him down. Cena can make anyone look decent, but still, he is booked so often not to. Edge's Achilles recovery leaves a lot to be seen. And every other questionable name you might put forward - Carlito, Shelton, Funaki - has equal arguments against him. The simple matter of fact is that, on WWE NXT, if they want some of their Rookies to get over, they need to get wins. And to get a win, someone has to lose. It can't just be losses to each other, as no one can distinguish himself that way if they keep trading. And they can't consistently feed established WWE veterans to the kids without hurting the standing and credibility of any of them. And it would hurt everyone for a Skip Sheffield or a Darren Young to pick up a crap win in a crappy match against Chris Masters or Caylen Croft. So the answer is Daniel Bryan. The moment he walked through the door, he became one of their top broomstick workers. Whether or not you [general plural you] think he's awesome or not, he fits all four criteria I listed above. And he does get good matches out of anyone. So he is stuck in a position where they need him to take those falls. He's the only guy who can't lost his own credibility but still add to someone else's, speaking purely in terms of NXT alone. yes, it's the curse of being too good without enough personality. Happens a lot in WWe.
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metylerca
King Koopa
Loves Him Some Backstreet Boys.
Don't be alarmed.
Posts: 12,479
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Post by metylerca on Apr 8, 2010 15:37:08 GMT -5
Do you really consider a game like, for example, the Lions vs. Patriots or Lions vs. Colts to be anywhere near "fair and balanced"? Top teams have more money to spend, better talent, a better coaching staff, etc. While I don't follow the salaries of the NFL players, I'm willing to bet that the Patriots have spent more money on Tom Brady and Wes Welker than the Lions have spent on half their roster. The rules might be equal, but a game like Pats/Lions or Colts/Lions is nowhere near "Fair and Balanced". To me, a game like Pats/Colts is the football equivalent to Bryan/Jericho. You already know who's going to win before it even begins. While the NFL owners have opted out of the final year of the expiring CBA for the upcoming season, the Collective Bargaining Agreement under which the League has operated includes a hard salary cap, which was 59.5% of the total projected revenue of the NFL for the upcoming season. It was about $127 million in 2009. The hard cap cannot be exceeded under any circumstances. Similarly, the floor is mandatory. The most recent hard floor was calculated to be 87.8% of the hard cap, or $111.5 million. The difference between the floor and the cap was $15.5 million. Furthermore, the NFL's media distribution and other marketing outlets are handled on a national as opposed to local level. As such, each franchise receives an equal share of the total pooled revenue of the League. So yes, the playing field is COMPLETELY level in the National Football League. There is no league past or present that has ever offered the true competitive balance of the NFL in the past decade. The imbalances arise solely from human incompetence and hubris, which exist purely at the upper levels of ownership and management. The League can't make stupid rich people smart or humble enough to hire competent people they disagree with. And to take the point still further, the Green Bay Packers are publicly owned by the people of Green Bay, WI. They don't have Jerruh or Dan Snyder or the McCaskeys or Al Davis running things. They are owned by the people. The field is balanced. The Lions were run into the ground by incompetence from the top down. ----------------------------------- On topic specifically, please see the following picture: This is a picture of a broom. I urge you to ignore the straw and focus on the wooden handle, or "stick." I would then ask you to think about the current WWE roster as constructed. Make a mental list of names who fit the following description: 1) Extensive in-ring experience 2) Ability to wrestle against myriad styles convincingly 3) Able to call a match and carry the load of its structure 4) Makes the opponent look good in victory or defeat *Waits a minute* {Spoiler}Chavo, Regal, Jericho, Christian, Punk, Goldust Triple H and Finlay are limited by their age, though no doubt would have been near the top a couple years back. Taker's gimmick is such that he generally doesn't have those kinds of matches. Mysterio's and Kane's sizes are a detriment to making an opponent look good. Hardy's health issues the past few years have slowed him down. Cena can make anyone look decent, but still, he is booked so often not to. Edge's Achilles recovery leaves a lot to be seen. And every other questionable name you might put forward - Carlito, Shelton, Funaki - has equal arguments against him. The simple matter of fact is that, on WWE NXT, if they want some of their Rookies to get over, they need to get wins. And to get a win, someone has to lose. It can't just be losses to each other, as no one can distinguish himself that way if they keep trading. And they can't consistently feed established WWE veterans to the kids without hurting the standing and credibility of any of them. And it would hurt everyone for a Skip Sheffield or a Darren Young to pick up a crap win in a crappy match against Chris Masters or Caylen Croft. So the answer is Daniel Bryan. The moment he walked through the door, he became one of their top broomstick workers. Whether or not you [general plural you] think he's awesome or not, he fits all four criteria I listed above. And he does get good matches out of anyone. So he is stuck in a position where they need him to take those falls. He's the only guy who can't lost his own credibility but still add to someone else's, speaking purely in terms of NXT alone. That's what I've been trying to tell you.
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