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Post by Threadkiller [Classic] on Dec 25, 2010 3:01:18 GMT -5
Although, as an English major, I should say "You're the only ones to which I can turn."
I have a problem, and I feel you're the only ones who can listen to it objectively.
Here's the deal:
I'm twenty-five years old and met a girl when I was seventeen. She was fifteen at the time, and we hit it off as friends. Her name (changed for the purposes of this story) was Gloria.
Over the course of the next five years, we would have an on-again/off-again friendship, arguing over everything from who we were friends with, to who we were dating.
I didn't know at the time that she wanted me exactly as badly as I wanted her.
Eventually, I become friends with a man named Evan (two years younger than me), who was friends with all of my friends, and so I decided to go with him, consider him close. And we were close. We got along brilliantly, like old soldiers who had women and problems in common.
Fast forward a bit. Evan and Gloria wind up dating. It lasts less than a month before it implodes on itself. But she remains friends, hanging out with him, and even agreeing when he offers to take her to New Orleans with her (where he was going to school at the time), for the weekend. At this time, he was embroiled in the drug scene and made her life hell for the time she was visiting, belittling her and trying to have sex with her the entire time.
She came back and told me the whole experience and, independent of this, we started chatting again. We became close. Very close. And before long, we were dating. This entire time, Evan was asking me what he did wrong, and why she hated him, even though he spent the entire time talking about how much he hated her.
I told him the truth - "She doesn't talk about you. Maybe ya'll can work it out. I don't know."
Fast-forward, and she and I fall in love. We're dating now, and it's important to me that he understand that I didn't mean this as an affront. He said it was absolutely okay and that he understood, only to renege on this a week later and claim he wanted to beat my guts for taking his woman away.
Fast-forward to now. We haven't spoken since July, when he found out that she and I had been speaking with each other since last winter, which he had felt was a betrayal, even though he openly spoke about how much he disliked her and what a bitch she was at the time, all of which I believe to be unfounded. Of course, he simply found her to be unappreciative of the free trip to New Orleans he afforded her.
And so it wound up being that Gloria, now my girlfriend and someone who I love with perilous depth, was away with her family, and so I went to the bar with friends.
I ran into Evan and he challenged me to a fight.
Given that our friends were mutual (one of whom was back from Germany, having been stationed there with the military), I vowed not to fight him, out of respect for my friends, and for my girlfriend who vowed she would be disappointed in me if I fought.
He responded by spitting in my face.
We stepped outside and had people standing between us to ensure we didn't fight.
Two of my friends, two that had introduced me and Evan, had claimed that they would lose respect for me if I engaged his tactics. And so I did nothing.
He spit again.
I did nothing.
And so now I stand here, embarrassed that I didn't make a move against someone that I know I could have taken. I've been trying to convince myself that I was the better man, and was told as such by my friends, but I don't feel that way.
I'm so angry, and I just let him leave, thinking that he'd won, and now I can't sleep.
I know this is a relatively one-sided story, but I can only turn to you, my WC family, because I feel you're the only ones who might understand.
Please, give me your honest opinion. I need your help more than I can say.
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Post by The Rager (Cole Miner) on Dec 25, 2010 3:08:22 GMT -5
Honestly If I were you I would have beat his ass. Don't know how you didn't, you are a stronger man than me.
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percymania
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Percymania will live forever! Oh yeah!
Posts: 17,296
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Post by percymania on Dec 25, 2010 3:11:12 GMT -5
Yeah, you should have kicked his ass - or at least tried to. Too bad she wasn't there to see it, because it probably would have turned her on, despite what she said about not wanting you to fight him. Girls love a man who will stand up for himself, because it means you can stand up for her as well.
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Post by Society of the Spectacle on Dec 25, 2010 3:17:34 GMT -5
I had a similar situation with a friend and his ex-, though she never became my girlfriend (but that's a different story.)
I'm glad you didn't fight him. I've always been of the opinion that if you like someone, even if they are your best friend's girl, if your friend throws her away, you've got to follow your heart. Bluntly, I've never subscribed to "bros before hos" or whatever the saying is. He's just angry that things didn't work out, but he doesn't seem to care as much for much as you have for him--otherwise you would have fought him. Why can't he be happy that you are happy? And even though you had a few friends and a girlfriend that would have been disappointed in you if you had fought, you showed your own character by making the decision yourself, even in the face of blatant and disrespectful provocation.
Just stay away from the guy for a while. It might feel bad or weird, but everyone has to pursue their own happiness, and he has no right to impinge on yours. He'll find his own happiness soon enough, I know it.
Oh and I'm an English major as well! Cheers!
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Cranjis McBasketball
Crow T. Robot
Knew what the hell that thing was supposed to be
Peace Love and Nothing But
Posts: 41,897
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Dec 25, 2010 3:18:13 GMT -5
I'd just take my ass kicking and be on my way. All he really wants to do is hit you. Might as well take that lump and put it all behind you.
This isn't for everyone, mind you......
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Post by ellisdee on Dec 25, 2010 3:19:11 GMT -5
“I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig, you get dirty; and besides, the pig likes it.” You would have given him what he wanted. He then could of used it against you and implied you started it. I too would have wanted to lay the smack down but you were the bigger man.
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Post by Threadkiller [Classic] on Dec 25, 2010 3:21:02 GMT -5
I mean, I feel I should at least provide his side of the story for consistency's sake:
He was seeing her for a while, and they would occasionally get drunk and it would lead to sex. They were close friends at the time, and so she thought nothing of it because he wasn't territorial, he was consistent, and I (the person she apparently wanted) wasn't showing interest (because I didn't think she was interested). So it was consensual in that respect.
But then he took her to New Orleans and expected sex most of the way there, given their prior history. And when it didn't happen, he began verbally berating her, comparing her to a slut for not putting out after having put out in the past.
When she came back from New Orleans, she vowed never to speak to him again, and he didn't understand at the time that he had said things to offend her. I know it's crazy, but he really thought he'd done right by her, showing her New Orleans and buying her drinks and showing her hospitality and all that. So he asked me to talk to her. And that's how she and I became close again. And so when he asked me what she was saying, I told him the truth - "She doesn't talk much about you, and she doesn't seem as averse to the idea of talking to you as you probably think." Eventually, it got to the point where I wound up telling him that it wasn't out of the question that they could be close again.
But I didn't mean like THAT.
But I know that's how he took it, and I don't blame him since I didn't differentiate. And so he's been angry ever since, since I apparently gave him hope that wasn't really there.
I just don't think I've ever been this angry before, and never felt like such a failure before. I don't know if it's more manly to knock a loser out or walk away, because I grew up without a father. I know that's a poor excuse, but I just don't know sometimes.
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Glitch
King Koopa
Not Going To Die; Childs, we're goin' out to give Blair the test. If he tries to make it back here and we're not with him... burn him.
Watching you.
Posts: 12,716
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Post by Glitch on Dec 25, 2010 3:24:52 GMT -5
If you didn't intend to fight him but still wanted to maintain dignity, you should have said "oh yeah. that's gonna make her come to you" after he spit on your face. Ok, maybe not a good idea. XD
But seriously, as bad is it may feel for you, I bet it's worse for him because he's still stewing in his own misery because your happy with this girl that never liked him to begin with. you get to be with her while he goes home alone.You shouldn't feel shame because of some other guys delusions.
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Post by Threadkiller [Classic] on Dec 25, 2010 3:28:27 GMT -5
Thank you. All of you. This is the only place on the internet that I feel I can say a single damn thing without ridicule. I love this place more than I can say.
That said...
Looking back, I honestly didn't mean to post a story that was one-sided in order to feel better about my inaction.
But I am in love, and I will never apologize for that, no matter who the offended friend may have been.
Your opinions, in my favor or against me, mean more to me than most of the people I know in this real world, believe it or not.
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Oak: Certified Jade Hater
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Edgier than Wayne Brady, Harder than Chinese Arithmetic, and Higher than the ratings for Blade: The Series
TOP ROPE CATCH A VIBE YEAH I SWERVE WHEN I DRIVE
Posts: 15,391
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Post by Oak: Certified Jade Hater on Dec 25, 2010 3:39:20 GMT -5
As someone who essentially grew up without a father (now back in my life for about two years now), I had to learn a lot of stuff either from common sense or advice from elders. So I know how you feel dude.
I can see his side: His friend talks to his ex-girlfriend, they end up close, they start dating. But then I see what he doesn't: That he expected sex, and upon not getting any, called her a slut. Also, that Gloria had feelings for you and you had feelings for her.
As someone who is currently interested in a girl, I know I'd be slightly angry if my best friend decided to date her. I'll admit, I'd be happy that he found someone, but it would kill me that he found someone I'm interested in.
Spitting, to me, is the ultimate form of disrespect. I'll spit on the floor without a second thought, but spitting on a person is the lowest of the low. I would've ignored the first offense, but after the second spit I would've lost control. For you to walk away is a testament, and something I definitely respect you for.
I guess what I'm ultimately saying, is I see your side more than his. You had no intention of getting together with Gloria when you went to talk with her (I believe), but it happened. He can't say anything since he had the girl and proceeded to f*** things up with her. He had his chance, and he blew it. You have your chance, and your making the most of it. Even refusing to fight him because she'd be disappointed (seriously, I respect you as a man for doing that).
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Phosphor Glow
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Is a real girl!
Posts: 19,870
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Post by Phosphor Glow on Dec 25, 2010 9:21:11 GMT -5
I wouldn't have blamed you or thought less of you for kicking the shit out of him. He's being a miserable asshole and needs to be shown that.
However, I also respect the hell out of you for NOT doing so. So he thinks he won and he's the better man. So what? Let him. You know you're right, your friends know you're right, Gloria knows you're right...so in the end, what does it really matter?
I imagine sometime in the future he'll realize what a gigantic douche he was being, and he'll probably apologize. If not, he probably wasn't worth your time anyway.
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h
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 5,734
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Post by h on Dec 25, 2010 9:54:27 GMT -5
I imagine sometime in the future he'll realize what a gigantic douche he was being, and he'll probably apologize. If not, he probably wasn't worth your time anyway. This sums is up perfectly. If you had chosen to fight him, you would be closing the window for a possible future resolution. Alternatively, you could look at it as follows: You got the girl and didn't look like a boorish asshole. He got nothing and, in fact, made a choice that will make it even harder for him to become friends with "Gloria" again. You: 2 Him: 0
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Post by Bob Schlapowitz on Dec 25, 2010 10:01:25 GMT -5
You're a bigger man than I am, Threadkiller, and I salute you for it. Regardless of the situation, if someone spit in my face, they'd be eating through a tube for the rest of their natural born life.
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@TenaciousBe
Hank Scorpio
Guess who's back... back again
Posts: 5,659
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Post by @TenaciousBe on Dec 25, 2010 10:49:31 GMT -5
My opinion:
You absolutely did the right thing, in every aspect. He sounds like a real piece of work, and the kind of dude who deserves a complete and thorough ass-whipping. That said, if you had engaged in fisticuffs with him, as it was said, he wins. Even if you kick his ass, he got what he wanted -- for you to admit some sort of guilt / wrongdoing. By even fighting back with him, you would have been, in effect, acknowledging that there was something for the two of you to fight about. And there's not. Nothing you did was wrong -- she was never "his" to begin with. I may hate the song, but Beyonce had a good point - "if you liked it, then you shoulda put a ring on it." He didn't, and in fact did just the opposite in treating her the way he did on the New Orleans trip, so you had absolutely no reason to feel any wrongdoing in winding up with the girl.
You have absolutely nothing to feel ashamed about. He didn't win, just because he spit and you didn't fight back. YOU won, for not acknowledging that he had any kind of case. If he walks away thinking he got one over, then so be it -- hopefully he'll just stay away after this.
Walk tall, sir. You got the moral victory AND the girl. That doesn't happen very often!
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Post by the zookeepah! on Dec 25, 2010 11:07:34 GMT -5
He wanted you to hit him. You did the mature thing.
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Toxik916
Hank Scorpio
Sacramento Proud
Posts: 6,207
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Post by Toxik916 on Dec 25, 2010 11:24:26 GMT -5
You were indeed the bigger man. I don't know if I could have done what you did. With that said don't feel down about it, you said that you feel like a failure but you're completely wrong about that. You honored your friends and GIRLFRIENDS wishes to not engage in physical contact and its probably safe to assume that their respect for you has grown tenfold. Bottom line is you have the girl which means you won. I know it sucks losing a friend, but honestly if him spitting on you gives him any sense of satisfaction he's not worth your emotions and friendship.
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Post by Wolfpack Bitch on Dec 25, 2010 11:32:41 GMT -5
I wanna know if your "friends" who claimed they'd lose respect for you if you fought him, offered him the same ultimatum ? Seems like he's the one they should lose respect for. If they told you than, then still buddy around with him, I think you need new friends. You were right not to fight, it's childish and immature and would have put you right on that same level with Evan, a tool.
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Grendel
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
But ... why is all the rum gone?
Posts: 17,593
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Post by Grendel on Dec 25, 2010 11:43:50 GMT -5
Wow ... tough situation. I would like to echo everyone who said that you did the right thing. If he keeps acting this way, you may have to cut ties with him. It hurts, but some times these things happen.
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Viva
Dennis Stamp
THAT'S MY PURSE! *kick to the groin*
You can dance if you want to.
Posts: 4,099
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Post by Viva on Dec 25, 2010 12:06:36 GMT -5
So can anyone explain to my why Threadkiller should have fought this guy? The sentiments echoed seem to be "If I were you, I'd have stomped him out." But... why? Threadkiller wins already. He's got the girl, and he's got the respect of his friends. He's the one with everything to lose, which is precisely why this jackass tried to mess things up for him. Honestly? If people are trying to fight you, and you haven't done anything wrong... it means you're doing something RIGHT. You're giving people a reason to be jealous, and while your current girl should have shut this down a long time ago, it's not your place. Even if he spits in your face. Spit washes off, but that guy will never not be a bag of s***. Take solace in that. He didn't 'win' anything. You're 25 years old, dude. Give me a break. Tell me the last time you looked at a guy who spit in someones face and called him a winner. Oh. Yeah. Never.
Fact is this. You got the girl. Period. Game over.
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Post by Rated R Pixie on Dec 25, 2010 13:25:10 GMT -5
I think you did the right thing, as fighting him would have hurt your girl as obviously she was with him (albeit short-lived) and had asked that you didn't, he was obviously trying to provoke a reaction and from a girls point of view i would say that the fact you didnt rise to it would have bugged him more than if you had decked him and starting laying into him, thus you have stayed un touched (apart from spit which just makes me think of gross red-neck hillbillys lol) and you have the knowledge that he had to resort to provoking you but spitting in your face whereas you are the more mature one who through all this just let him get on with it and leave when he seen it wasn't working, I've been in similar situations and know how tempting it would have been to just beat his ass to a pulp but i think you did the right thing by not touching him as he could have gotten the cops on your ass also.
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