"You'll make more money driving a truck."

[Burst]

Another vent topic, I'm sorry.

When did this mindset come about that any degree that doesn't involve math, engineering, or otherwise setting you up for some trade isn't worth the paper that it's printed on?

Furthermore, when did all these people show up that say that going to college in general is stupid, and that you should go to some tech school or just save your money and start an entry level job, and if you want to learn that stupid liberal arts shit just read a book or go to a community college?

It just kind of rankles me, as a writing major spending two years after college to change over to medicine, to eventually spend four years drowning in student loans in medical school, to have people saying that I should've just become a plumber or a tradesman or drive a truck, because I'd be making more money than I will going through all this wimpy education. Because that's totally what everything is all about, money.

/rant

[FinalGwen]

I say screw anyone who doesn't believe that the pursuit of knowledge isn't intrinsically worthwhile. I don't need to be geared towards the world of work to make learning a good thing. While it may help to have a trade at the end of it, that's a bonus, not the actual point, and I hate the system that tries to say it is.

[Bam Neeley]

I remember being in grade school and our teacher told us that we all should go to a trade school instead of going to a university or a polytechnic. It's a good thing I didn't listen because now I'm in a university studying something I like instead of being a plumber or something.

[Alex Shelley]

For me, the money has never been important. If I were rich and didn't need to work for the rest of my life, I'd still be in college right now. I'm not going to school because I want to earn money, I'm going to school because I want to be a scientist. The money never even crossed my mind.

[Lardlad]

I saved my money and started at an entry level job. 6 years later, I am still in the same entry level job wishing I had gone to college or university for something....

[Red Impact]

Honestly, it depends on the goal of the person doing the learning.

If you're learning something because you want to and are interested, by all means, learn all you can and screw anyone who tells you not to.

If you're in school to get a degree and get a job, then colleges don't do a very good job of being realistic with students. People hold onto the beliefs like being a film major will get them a job as a film critic or things equally incorrect, and it's all because colleges largely don't care what you do after they get your money. People shouldn't pussyfoot around the subject of what you'll be able to do with a degree and what your chances are of actually doing it. Then, leave it up to the student to take that risk or not, just don't coddle them and make them think they're going to get into the movie industry because they got a degree from NIU.

That said, I'm never going to tell anyone they should just go to trade school. That's obnoxious.

[Throwback]

3:25 Language

[ptp2011]

I thought the whole point of education (at least Western-world post-secondary education) was to avoid unemployment. Problem is, there are too many people in university/college, and not enough jobs for the graduates. If EVERYONE had a Ph. D., a Ph. D would be completely worthless.

If education is education for its own sake then only those with money to burn should go to university/college.

Employers need to decide what they want from schools, then throw out the rest. Heck, K-12 should be all about future employment, get rid of the useless Art, Music, Gym, etc. classes. Then maybe corporations could pay the cost of public education, and then they would have a fresh pool of new employees upon graduation.

[potpie]

Actually what it's about is networking- how well you can smootz for a job. Everything else is secondary in college. They really, really don't emphasize that enough when you're a freshman. I personally dropped out of art school to pursue something I thought was employable but wasn't, so I went to chiro school. I had to drop out of that for health reasons. Now I'm drowning in debt, and if possible less employable than when I started. It's a crap-shoot, really.

[The Line]

Mar 20, 2011 16:32:40 GMT -5 @potpie said:

Actually what it's about is networking- how well you can smootz for a job. Everything else is secondary in college. They really, really don't emphasize that enough when you're a freshman. I personally dropped out of art school to pursue something I thought was employable but wasn't, so I went to chiro school. I had to drop out of that for health reasons. Now I'm drowning in debt, and if possible less employable than when I started. It's a crap-shoot, really.

This is EXACTLY why I'm in school. it's ALL about networking. The dean of the college of Journalism here at Wazzu was a foreign correspondent for 30 years in the middle east, and I plan on going into F.C., so it's like a no-brainer. Not only is he a big name, but he has more journalism connections than probably anyone I'll meet for a long while(hell, the guy was on Anderson Cooper 360 and Wolf Blitzer's situation room...ON THE SAME DAY. Last month! And he's the boss of my school). I hate when I tell people I'm a journalism major and they say "Oh, you're wasting your time. You should just start a blog or something".

[Thomas Powers of Paine]

It's because of our Mammon-worshiping culture. People think that making more money is the only reason for getting an education. They fail to see how enriching an education in the liberal arts can be.

[The Line]

Mar 20, 2011 16:44:21 GMT -5 Thomas Powers of Paine said:

It's because of our Mammon-worshiping culture. People think that making more money is the only reason for getting an education. They fail to see how enriching an education in the liberal arts can be.

basically. I work more on the science and engineering part of campus, despite my major(i just work in a coffee shop), and it's frustrating, sad, and slightly amusing seeing some people's respect for other people's majors/degrees, or rather lack thereof.

[willywonka666]

I couldn't go to school and love what I do anymore than I do now. I don't make a lot, but I don't care. It's a trade off and that's fine with me.

[FinalGwen]

Mar 20, 2011 16:15:09 GMT -5 @ptp2011 said:

I thought the whole point of education (at least Western-world post-secondary education) was to avoid unemployment. Problem is, there are too many people in university/college, and not enough jobs for the graduates. If EVERYONE had a Ph. D., a Ph. D would be completely worthless.

If education is education for its own sake then only those with money to burn should go to university/college.

Employers need to decide what they want from schools, then throw out the rest. Heck, K-12 should be all about future employment, get rid of the useless Art, Music, Gym, etc. classes. Then maybe corporations could pay the cost of public education, and then they would have a fresh pool of new employees upon graduation.

I sincerely hope this is a sarcastic post. Otherwise, what a depressing thought. A world where knowledge and the love of it are reserved for those who can afford it. The proles can know their place, and remain ignorant. Their education will be based upon what is necessary for work rather than what is necessary to live, and the world becomes that much more bleak.

[Red Impact]

Mar 20, 2011 16:15:09 GMT -5 @ptp2011 said:

I thought the whole point of education (at least Western-world post-secondary education) was to avoid unemployment. Problem is, there are too many people in university/college, and not enough jobs for the graduates. If EVERYONE had a Ph. D., a Ph. D would be completely worthless.

If education is education for its own sake then only those with money to burn should go to university/college.

Employers need to decide what they want from schools, then throw out the rest. Heck, K-12 should be all about future employment, get rid of the useless Art, Music, Gym, etc. classes. Then maybe corporations could pay the cost of public education, and then they would have a fresh pool of new employees upon graduation.

The kinds of jobs you get with the K-12 education only are generally those where you learn skills on the job anyways, so removing a lot of the curriculum to focus solely on that would be worthless.

[Milkman Norm]

Mar 20, 2011 17:14:00 GMT -5 FinalGwen said:

Mar 20, 2011 16:15:09 GMT -5 @ptp2011 said:

I thought the whole point of education (at least Western-world post-secondary education) was to avoid unemployment. Problem is, there are too many people in university/college, and not enough jobs for the graduates. If EVERYONE had a Ph. D., a Ph. D would be completely worthless.

If education is education for its own sake then only those with money to burn should go to university/college.

Employers need to decide what they want from schools, then throw out the rest. Heck, K-12 should be all about future employment, get rid of the useless Art, Music, Gym, etc. classes. Then maybe corporations could pay the cost of public education, and then they would have a fresh pool of new employees upon graduation.

I sincerely hope this is a sarcastic post. Otherwise, what a depressing thought. A world where knowledge and the love of it are reserved for those who can afford it. The proles can know their place, and remain ignorant. Their education will be based upon what is necessary for work rather than what is necessary to live, and the world becomes that much more bleak.

Agreed. I think knowledge for the sake of learning knowledge always has value.

[ptp2011]

Mar 20, 2011 17:14:00 GMT -5 FinalGwen said:

A world where knowledge and the love of it are reserved for those who can afford it.

It's already that way, except for the ability for students to borrow massive amounts of money.

[The Line]

Mar 20, 2011 17:33:25 GMT -5 @ptp2011 said:

Mar 20, 2011 17:14:00 GMT -5 FinalGwen said:

A world where knowledge and the love of it are reserved for those who can afford it.

It's already that way, except for the ability for students to borrow massive amounts of money.

so rather than allow people to go into debt, they just shouldn't have the option of post-secondary education?

[Baixo Astral]

Mar 20, 2011 16:15:09 GMT -5 @ptp2011 said:

I thought the whole point of education (at least Western-world post-secondary education) was to avoid unemployment. Problem is, there are too many people in university/college, and not enough jobs for the graduates. If EVERYONE had a Ph. D., a Ph. D would be completely worthless.

If education is education for its own sake then only those with money to burn should go to university/college.

Employers need to decide what they want from schools, then throw out the rest. Heck, K-12 should be all about future employment, get rid of the useless Art, Music, Gym, etc. classes. Then maybe corporations could pay the cost of public education, and then they would have a fresh pool of new employees upon graduation.

Hully gee, I can't imagine anything more wrong. K-12 obviously should be the point at which we all get fitted for the yoke.

[Red Impact]

Mar 20, 2011 18:07:24 GMT -5 Baixo Astral said:

Mar 20, 2011 16:15:09 GMT -5 @ptp2011 said:

I thought the whole point of education (at least Western-world post-secondary education) was to avoid unemployment. Problem is, there are too many people in university/college, and not enough jobs for the graduates. If EVERYONE had a Ph. D., a Ph. D would be completely worthless.

If education is education for its own sake then only those with money to burn should go to university/college.

Employers need to decide what they want from schools, then throw out the rest. Heck, K-12 should be all about future employment, get rid of the useless Art, Music, Gym, etc. classes. Then maybe corporations could pay the cost of public education, and then they would have a fresh pool of new employees upon graduation.

Hully gee, I can't imagine anything more wrong. K-12 obviously should be the point at which we all get fitted for the yoke.

It's an important time to give people not only a basic core knowledge, but a taste of other things to see if students have an affinity for things they weren't exposed to before. Companies don't need k-12 to train employees, if they want high school educated employees, then it's for jobs they can train people for on the jobs. You don't need to learn how to work in a factory or as a receptionist in 8th grade, the employers will teach you how to do it themselves.