Turd Ferguson
Hank Scorpio
John Cena: Colossal Douche
Posts: 7,402
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Post by Turd Ferguson on Jun 14, 2011 11:05:17 GMT -5
I'm reading the Reign of Doomsday arc in DC and it got me thinking back to the original DOOMSDAY! Saga in 1991/2.
Where the hell was Captain Marvel? Of all the people in the world who could go toe to toe with Superman, why couldn't he have helped with someone who had already dismantled the Justice League? If Supes was enough to fight Doomsday to death, imagine if the two of them doubleteamed the monster?
I think it was Kurt Busiek (I can't for the life of me find the quote) who came up with a laundry list of things wrong with the whole arc.
Including Maxima's seemingly diminished power. Or why a GL didn't call for backup from a few dozen other Corpsmen. Guy even had his yellow ring!
I don't even know if I was questioning or venting, but anyone else feel that this milestone event (and it's aftermath) were riddled with ridiculous plot holes?
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CMWaters
Ozymandius
Rolled a Seven, Beat the Ads.
Bald and busy
Posts: 63,103
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Post by CMWaters on Jun 14, 2011 11:07:27 GMT -5
That is a good question. I'm guessing he was busy with something in his home city.
But do keep in mind this whole Death of Superman thing was pretty much a last minute decision by the writers.
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Post by Bishblast on Jun 14, 2011 11:07:35 GMT -5
I started reading this over a decade ago, but gave up pretty quickly.
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Post by Baldobomb-22-OH-MAN!!! on Jun 14, 2011 11:39:19 GMT -5
well apparently it never happened now so I wouldn't worry about it
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darthalexander
Hank Scorpio
I have a feeling I may end up getting banned soon.
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Post by darthalexander on Jun 14, 2011 13:14:54 GMT -5
I have two copies of the "special collector's edition" of the issue where Superman dies. Lucky me.
This is one thing that has bugged me about comics: in a world where there are more heroes than you can shake a stick at, why is it that more don't show up when some big evil alien/robot/whatever appears? Here Superman is in trouble so you'd think everyone would show up to help kick some ass.
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Goldenbane
Hank Scorpio
THE G.D. Goldenbane
Posts: 7,331
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Post by Goldenbane on Jun 14, 2011 13:33:00 GMT -5
I have two copies of the "special collector's edition" of the issue where Superman dies. Lucky me. This is one thing that has bugged me about comics: in a world where there are more heroes than you can shake a stick at, why is it that more don't show up when some big evil alien/robot/whatever appears? Here Superman is in trouble so you'd think everyone would show up to help kick some ass. I guess I don't fully understand what was going on in the DC comics at the time, but I always wondered "Where are the following?" Batman (Yeah I know, "he's only human, what's he supposed to do to help Superman?" but then I have to ask "Isn't he the goddamn Batman? Get his ass out there to help!") Wonder Woman Flash Martian Manhunter (I think he was another character at the time...so I could be wrong on this) Hal Jordan Jon Stewart Captain Marvel Firestorm The New Titans I just can't help but feel if ANY of these characters had shown up, Superman would have been fine and Doomsday would have had his butt kicked.
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Post by hossfan on Jun 14, 2011 13:42:26 GMT -5
Doomsday would have just beaten any other hero who showed up until he got to Superman anyway, so it was probably for the best that heavy hitters like Wonder Woman and Captain Marvel didn't appear and job to him.
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Goldenbane
Hank Scorpio
THE G.D. Goldenbane
Posts: 7,331
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Post by Goldenbane on Jun 14, 2011 13:47:19 GMT -5
Doomsday would have just beaten any other hero who showed up until he got to Superman anyway, so it was probably for the best that heavy hitters like Wonder Woman and Captain Marvel didn't appear and job to him. In a pure storyline sense, sure...this is supposed to be the death of Superman afterall...but in a common sense sort of way, it's just really bad writing.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jun 14, 2011 16:14:49 GMT -5
The Doomsday storyline itself was lacking, but Funeral For A Friend and Reign Of The Supermen were and are among my all time favorite comic stories.
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Post by Cela on Jun 14, 2011 16:20:30 GMT -5
I think it had to do with it being similar to most other Superman fights, sure he's having trouble, but usually he ends up winning, this time he just happened to die. Imagine if every hero in existence showed up every time Supes fought Metallo.
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Post by Citizen Zero on Jun 14, 2011 16:21:39 GMT -5
Honestly once you start thinking about things like this reading any Batman story becomes impossible.
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erisi236
Fry's dog Seymour
... enjoys the rich, smooth taste of Camels.
Not good! Not good! Not good!
Posts: 21,904
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Post by erisi236 on Jun 14, 2011 17:35:00 GMT -5
It probably would have worked better if it had been a longer series. If Doomsday had plowed though the entire DC roster who could be on Earth at the time and left Superman as the last hope it would have been believable.
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Raging_Demons
Don Corleone
I Can Ride My Bike With No Handlebars, No Handlebars, No Handlebars!
Posts: 1,620
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Post by Raging_Demons on Jun 14, 2011 17:38:00 GMT -5
I didn't read the comic instead I read the actual book "The Life & Death Of Superman" which is all about the Death of Superman arc & it was mostly focused on the Superman Universe more than it was a DC Universe book.
That's my logic there.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jun 14, 2011 17:47:28 GMT -5
At the time DC needed to give Doomsday the rub from Superman to get him over as a heel with the fans. The problem was Management soured on Doomsday afterwards because of some behind the scenes heat with veteran Hank Crenshaw over who should get the next big superfeud.
In the end Crenshaw won out because he had better mic skills than Doomsday even though Doomsday had a better workrate.
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Post by Baldobomb-22-OH-MAN!!! on Jun 14, 2011 19:00:06 GMT -5
I have two copies of the "special collector's edition" of the issue where Superman dies. Lucky me. This is one thing that has bugged me about comics: in a world where there are more heroes than you can shake a stick at, why is it that more don't show up when some big evil alien/robot/whatever appears? Here Superman is in trouble so you'd think everyone would show up to help kick some ass. I guess I don't fully understand what was going on in the DC comics at the time, but I always wondered "Where are the following?" Batman (Yeah I know, "he's only human, what's he supposed to do to help Superman?" but then I have to ask "Isn't he the goddamn Batman? Get his ass out there to help!") Wonder Woman Flash Martian Manhunter (I think he was another character at the time...so I could be wrong on this) Hal Jordan Jon Stewart Captain Marvel Firestorm The New Titans I just can't help but feel if ANY of these characters had shown up, Superman would have been fine and Doomsday would have had his butt kicked. dunno about the rest, but Batman would've been a black and grey smear if he tried to fight Doomsday, and the GLs were both off earth at the time. Guy Gardner was there, though, so I guess that point's moot. Captain Marvel and Wondy really have no excuse, though.
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Post by Cela on Jun 14, 2011 19:20:49 GMT -5
Didn't Batman kill a Kryptonite Doomsday for some reason?
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Post by Citizen Zero on Jun 14, 2011 19:22:40 GMT -5
You know what they say, never let logic or established characterization get in the way of a good story.
Or a mediocre story.
Or a bad story.
Or...hell...whatever half-baked idea the editor's trying to shove down your throat.
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Post by Z-A Sandbaggin' Son of a b!%@h on Jun 14, 2011 19:37:07 GMT -5
So as a 12-13 year old kid I thought the Death/Return of superman was really cool. It was superman for chrissakes and he was "dead". As a hardcore marvel guy it was enough to sway me to the DC comic section for a good little while.
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Thaal Sinestro
Hank Scorpio
In Brightest Night, In Blackest Day. Etc.
Posts: 5,012
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Post by Thaal Sinestro on Jun 14, 2011 19:58:42 GMT -5
At the time DC needed to give Doomsday the rub from Superman to get him over as a heel with the fans. The problem was Management soured on Doomsday afterwards because of some behind the scenes heat with veteran Hank Crenshaw over who should get the next big superfeud. In the end Crenshaw won out because he had better mic skills than Doomsday even though Doomsday had a better workrate. idk Henshaw's workrate is pretty good. Dude never dies.
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Post by lildude8218 on Jun 14, 2011 20:04:38 GMT -5
all the other heroes thought Superman was getting too full of himself and needed to be taken down a peg. they were all in on it.
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