Sinestro
Samurai Cop
I wonder how many words I can fit in this spot. Probably not many, but maybe a few. Yeah that many
Posts: 2,275
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Post by Sinestro on Jul 12, 2005 9:56:58 GMT -5
Matt Hardy is a hypocrite. A hypocrite is defined by Webster's as being someone who pretends to have beliefs they don't actually hold. The NIGHT OF when Lita turned on Kane to side with Edge, Matt posted a very real emo message on his website saying (and I'm close to a direct quote here)- "I don't know about you guys, but I find it really tasteless to turn a real life tragedy into a wrestling angle". Reread that post please. He found it REALLY TASTLESS to turn a real life tragedy into a WRESTLING ANGLE. Last night, Hardy came back to participate in the exact same angle he thought was tasteless and playing off his real life tragedy (which he was right about). Your point has some validity - but only if there was a real-life tragedy in the first place. I'm starting to think that maybe we've been worked from the beginning. - Matt was off recovering from surgery; funny how this happened while he's off for a few weeks, but never happened during the years he was on Smackdown and Amy and Adam were on the Monday show. The timing of all this happening is just too convenient...
- Edge's heel turn was going nowhere; he'd tried the "I keep getting screwed" crybaby gimmick; he'd tried the cocky "money in the bank" gimmick. Nothing was getting him over with the fans. But stealing his best friend's girl, especially when that best friend happens to be one of the darlings of the IWC? BAM! Instant heel heat!
- Lita's character was in desperate need of a change, too. What exactly was her on-screen gimmick beforehand? She was basically a high risk chick - you know, the one with the worst-looking moonsault in the business who nearly broke her neck in her second match back after breaking her neck? By giving her this gimmick change, WWE has not only garnered Amy a ton of heat, they've also taken a critical step towards protecting the health and well-being of the girls who make up their women's division. All two of them.
- By "taking advantage of a real situation", WWE was able to remove Kane from the equation; Lita's infidelity with Edge gave WWE the perfect excuse to script a divorce from Kane and bury that cluster***k of an angle.
- By aborting the Kane storyline (to the relief of the IWC), WWE gives Matt a new feud for his return. Bringing Matt Hardy back to feud with Kane was a recipie for more Matt squashing; Edge is someone he can have a great series of matches with. And since Edge is "Mr. Money-in-the-Bank", a feud with him immediately elevates Hardy towards the top of the card.
- Has Matt Hardy ever been more over at any other time in his career, to the point where he got what the HOLT reports on PWTorch.com call a "world champion pop" from the live crowd? According to some who were there, when Batista came out after Raw went off the air for an interpromotional tag match, his pop was second to Hardy's.
- Adam just got remarried in October after a failed marriage to Val Venis' sister; WWE is asking us to believe that, having screwed up his first marriage, that he's going to begin sleeping with Amy just weeks after getting married again. Okay, maybe he's a 'damn-the-consequences' horndog of Clintonesque proportions, but I think it's more likely that Adam "never had sex with that woman, Miss Dumas..."
It's like what they're saying is, "Well, that certainly was a messy and tragic situation, but at least it all worked out so that every single person involved - Hardy, Amy/Lita, Adam/Edge, even WWE Creative - benefited in the end." Right... (Don't get me wrong; I've posted before that I love the fact that we've been worked like this; this is what pro wrestling is supposed to be about! I can't help grinning every time I think about what a great job everyone involved has done. ;D) See this is what I like about being a wrestling fan sometimes. Here you have Mark who believes one thing, but doesn't consider anyone who disagrees withhim on it to be a retard or idiot. While I disagree with him. But we are both enjoying the same angle for different reasons. That is the sign of a good angle.
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Mark4HBK
Unicron
How to kill a guy in three easy steps.
Posts: 2,521
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Post by Mark4HBK on Jul 12, 2005 9:59:19 GMT -5
Was it me or when watching Matt get taken away in handcuffs last night he was yelling at someone with the name "Johnny" which got me thinking it might of been Johnny Ace as he has reputation of casuing friction backstage, really think about it? Yes, Johnny Ace was the guy with the short blonde hair that helped tackle Hardy after he screamed "Ring of Honor!" into the mic. In other words, he was once again helping to hold Hardy down...
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Mark4HBK
Unicron
How to kill a guy in three easy steps.
Posts: 2,521
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Post by Mark4HBK on Jul 12, 2005 10:07:59 GMT -5
See this is what I like about being a wrestling fan sometimes. Here you have Mark who believes one thing, but doesn't consider anyone who disagrees with him on it to be a retard or idiot. While I disagree with him. But we are both enjoying the same angle for different reasons. That is the sign of a good angle. Hey, as the old cliche goes, "I may disagree with what you say, but I will kill anyone who looks different from me, or dresses differently than me, or eats different food than me, or lives in a different part of the world than me, or speaks a different language than me to protect your right to say it." Or something like that. But why does everyone always assume my name is Mark...?
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bigjimmy
Don Corleone
WWF Attitude
Posts: 1,257
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Post by bigjimmy on Jul 12, 2005 10:09:04 GMT -5
i love that everyone is acting the sherlock in trying to work out whats going on.
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Sinestro
Samurai Cop
I wonder how many words I can fit in this spot. Probably not many, but maybe a few. Yeah that many
Posts: 2,275
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Post by Sinestro on Jul 12, 2005 10:25:49 GMT -5
See this is what I like about being a wrestling fan sometimes. Here you have Mark who believes one thing, but doesn't consider anyone who disagrees with him on it to be a retard or idiot. While I disagree with him. But we are both enjoying the same angle for different reasons. That is the sign of a good angle. Hey, as the old cliche goes, "I may disagree with what you say, but I will kill anyone who looks different from me, or dresses differently than me, or eats different food than me, or lives in a different part of the world than me, or speaks a different language than me to protect your right to say it." Or something like that. But why does everyone always assume my name is Mark...? Sorry Joe. And that statement of yours is damn near sig worthy.
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zdavis72
AC Slater
freeeedom!
Posts: 195
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Post by zdavis72 on Jul 12, 2005 10:30:07 GMT -5
yeah i agree...i mean if you had been put in his situation..and fans were chanting your name on a weekly basis..wouldnt you go back to get some closure?
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Post by doubleyou on Jul 12, 2005 10:37:48 GMT -5
I think I've resolved the Hardy vs. Daniels problem...
...It'll happen. Either WWE told Matt to sign for it, or Matt signed for it before WWE turned it into a subplot. Allow Matt to say, "Ring of Honor!" on television, and it looks even more like a shoot.
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Post by hurrikaty on Jul 12, 2005 10:41:46 GMT -5
Lets all go slap a tornado!
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Post by hurrikaty on Jul 12, 2005 11:01:21 GMT -5
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Tom
Don Corleone
Power Of Station.
Posts: 2,018
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Post by Tom on Jul 12, 2005 11:10:26 GMT -5
A work? A shoot?
I'd rather this were real.
Matt really storms into WWE. Matt really beats on Adam. Matt really hates and leaves WWE.
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Post by screwtape on Jul 12, 2005 11:32:50 GMT -5
Lets all go slap a tornado! what do you have against poor dead kerry?
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Post by 10DollarNoseBleed on Jul 12, 2005 11:33:07 GMT -5
There is no doubt in my mind this was a work. The greatest work in a long time, but it is a work. I can surely say I didn't see this coming. Nice job for a change E.
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Post by VinceNeil1981 on Jul 12, 2005 11:38:29 GMT -5
The following is a huge post by Matt Hardy from his message board on TheMattHardy.com:
If you guys are ready for a ride, jump the f*** on. Well, I promised you all fireworks, so I hope I didn't disappoint. As of July 11th, 2005, my personal Independence Day, the Movement has begun-- and the Movement's purpose is two-fold. Purpose one--To never let anyone control what Matt Hardy says and does and thinks. Purpose two--To make Adam Copeland, Amy Dumas, and the WWE regret what they did to me, what they did to us. It's time for Matt Hardy to stand up for all the MFer's that have been chanting "We Want Matt", and "You Screwed Matt". Although you may not know this--you guys, the MFers, started the Movement months ago. I can now finally join the Movement because I am no longer controlled by the WWE. The McMahons, the Johnny Aces, and all of the WWE management can kiss my @$$. I did what I did tonight because for me to live with myself, Adam "Feces" Copeland must pay. I'm not going to let the WWE forget that they f***ed up when they released me instead of that scumbag home-wrecker. And Amy Dumas, you know what's it's like to have me as your closest ally--but you're gonna hate to see what it's like to have me as your worst enemy b*tch. Even though I didn't slash your tires FCF, slashed tires are going to be the least of your problems--Bank on it. A little message to the whore, the feces, and the horsesh*t "family" that is the WWE--Matt Hardy is like cancer, I don't go away and you won't find a cure. I thank EVERYONE that has supported me through thick and thin--I promise I will always be there for my MFers. I love you guys--and as I always say, without you, there is no me. I am going to turn a hugely negative situation into something that will benefit us. If you don't want to be able to predict what happens next, you're all in for a treat.
P.S. - If you're thinking about pressing charges Vince, I got a couple bucks, I'll fight it. Besides, I think I might have some pixs and video from a camera phone that shows your officers Rodney Kinging my @$$. My wrist is cut from the handcuffs, and I would suggest that there was a little unnecessary roughness involved in kicking me out of your building.
P.S.S. - And don't forget to catch Matt Hardy in action this Friday in Indiana, PA, this Saturday in Woodbridge, CT, and you never know where I'll show up on Sunday. And The Matt Hardy Show is so on...
Matt "f***ing" Hardy
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Phoenix
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
He's back and better than ever!
Fear The Desecrator
Posts: 18,958
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Post by Phoenix on Jul 12, 2005 11:42:14 GMT -5
Like i said before I think Heyman is secretly booking again!! noone else could have come up with this thing
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Post by screwtape on Jul 12, 2005 11:43:47 GMT -5
Good morning, Mr Phoenix
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STMP
Hank Scorpio
Wild and Only 50
Posts: 5,569
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Post by STMP on Jul 12, 2005 11:43:48 GMT -5
I agree with Homo Joe, at least I think he said it.
It's all real and the WWE wants to capitalize on it. So they give Matt a nice salary, probably paid per apearance. Which means he can still work his indy dates and he only needs to appear on RAW.
But since he's not a full-time employee it will look like it's real. And as long as Matt and Adam can't work without beating the feces out of each other, Matt will probably only show up to 'help' Edge's opponent.
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Post by screwtape on Jul 12, 2005 11:51:03 GMT -5
I agree with Homo Joe, at least I think he said it. Heh.
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Post by nachoman on Jul 12, 2005 11:53:39 GMT -5
Here's a good article talking about the whole Matt Hardy situation: www.liveaudiowrestling.com/wo/news/headlines/default.asp?aID=13692Here's the article in full: Matt Hardy update by Dave Meltzer Dave@wrestlingobserver.com Although I'm sure most everyone has figured it out by now, what happened last night involving Matt Hardy was a planned part of the wrestling show. In hindsight, it's been pretty clear ever since they played his music at the wedding that WWE had a deal with him to return. The WWE simply isn't that stupid. I have to give Matt Hardy credit in that the internet posts he wrote last week were very clever, enough to where I actually thought he was going to TNA and turning down the best potential angle in his career for the chance to fully control his life and schedule. The only problem has always been his failure to commit to doing TNA and failure to commit to new indy bookings over the past few weeks from people who had agreed to his price. He will make his indy bookings he had agreed to up to this point, from what we understand. It is possible he may commit to some new ones if he and the company will attempt to go to great lengths to get over that he's not with the company. At this point, they really need to make it as believable as possible on television, without insulting people's intelligence off televisoin by trying to believe everyone's hand hasn't been tipped. As to when the deal was made for him to return, certainly most evidence indicates before June 20th, and likely by June 13th, as that was the date it seemed pretty evident to me it would turn into an angle. It is possible it was planned dating back longer than that. Last night's deal was well done in the ring. But if this was a longer and more elaborate work, I can't believe they'd have given it away by teasing the brawl with the Hardy music footage early, and the brawl backstage before the main brawl gave away the main brawl before it started. Taking him backstage as opposed to out the door was a technical mistake I was shocked they made. It's a minor point overall, but consideing how much thought had been put into other aspects, I was surprised at the minor points of execution considering what was trying to be portrayed. At some point stopping shooting him as if an order was made to not air this on the show (making sure he got his face time in with the idea in the chaos nobody at first knew how to react) would have at least allowed people to question whether it was or wasn't supposed to be on the show. It's clear everyone involved believes they can continue the work and people will believe it, from the WWE web site not acknowledging it, and Hardy trying to put it over as a shoot. For WWE's site to continue the work is fine and good, and it should, as that's the job of the company. For Hardy, under his own name, to insist on his own site to his own fans, when everyone knows better, is going to turn pathetic in a hurry. It will be interesting how he plays it on Saturday at the ROH show. It'll be interesting how the crowd reacts as well. If he tries to put over what happened as a shoot and cuts an anti-WWE promo, I could see the crowd turning on him like they did when Shane Douglas claimed he turned down appearing at the ECW PPV when the live crowd all knew the TNA contracted performers were never offered a slot to begin with. Hopefully in the end, Matt Hardy's most brilliant work won't end with the sad sight that the person being worked the most is Matt, when he doesn't realize from this point forward, you can make it as real as possible on television, but from this point forward, if you try and go any farther with "it's a shoot, really, still," the worker ends up working mostly himself.
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Post by curtrok on Jul 12, 2005 11:53:45 GMT -5
Do you guys really think this is a big deal? It made for good TV but this doesn't go along the lines of the Montreal Screwjob, atleast in my mind. This isn't Shane Douglas throwing down the title. This is a guy who got cheated on being all pissed off and making a big deal out of it.
While this is good for Hardy and Egde and Lita, it sucks for kane as it is ruins the whole wedding storyline. Futhermore when Hardy does resign with the WWE, which he will at some point what happens to all the WWE can't control me nonsense?
Whatever its still boring.
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Post by instig8r on Jul 12, 2005 12:00:31 GMT -5
This was NEVER a complete work, and I will go on record as saying that anyone who believes that is pretty close to a complete moron. Ok, say they start releasing information through Matt's website, and all this happens off-air, what would have happened if it fell flat? If it got no heat? What would have happened if the NYC fans hadn't chanted 'whore' at Lita the next night in her promo vs. Trish? Would you see another post three months later from Matt's site saying 'Hey guys, I um... got my job back. Yay! Mattitude!'?
It is pretty darned obvious that it was a shoot up to at least that night in NYC. That was the night that there was the first fan reaction, and I guarantee it stunned Vince and Co. That's why they teased Edge encountering Lita in the back- to see how the reaction would be again the next week. And when the reaction never died down, they had to act, so they put Edge and Lita together just to get their individual heat directed at both of them. Problem was, as much as they tried to push Kane, the fans still chanted for Matt. So, in the wedding angle, the fans were tested to see how they would react to Matt actually returning, which we all know was tremendous. Later that week, WWE asks Matt not to sign any long-term deals for the moment, Matt goes mysteriously silent on his board, and the work begins. It is certainly not a complete shoot, but it is also certainly not a complete work. It is luck falling into the hands of a man who was EXTREMELY unlucky, and a convenient reminder that the hottest storyline in the WWE right now wasn't even written by the writers.
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