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Post by arrx on Sept 9, 2011 17:10:47 GMT -5
Then he went on to trash Cleveland in an interview, saying we're all stupid and fat and our women are ugly. So yeah f*** that guy. Why get mad at a guy for speaking the truth about a trashy city....
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Post by Bishblast on Sept 9, 2011 17:13:10 GMT -5
Billy Corgan... maybe he doesn't suck at promotion as much as he sucks at making music. Smashing Pumpkins are definitely among the most overrated bands of the 80s... and their more recent shows are proving that. Um, the first Smashing Pumpkins record was released in 91. And if you meant to put 90s and you think they were overrated then I seriously have reservations about your knowledge of music. As a music fan in the 90s, I can testify firsthand that the Pumpkins were absolutely huge at the time. I mean "Tonight Tonight" actually won Video of the Year at the MTV Awards in 1996. I understand that's a meaningless award, but when you consider that the last few winners have been Katy Perry, Lady Gaga and Beyonce, it shows you how big the Pumpkins were at the time. After the death of Kurt Cobain, the Pumpkins, Pearl Jam and Green Day really did inherit the rock and roll throne for a few years there. Nowadays rock and roll is dead as far as the mainstream is concerned and I think that alters people's perceptions of how massive these bands were at the time. "Today", "Bullet With Butterfly Wings", "1979" and "Tonight Tonight" were all hugely popular songs. And I'm know things can be successful and overrated at the same time, but I don't feel like the Pumpkins were overrated. Granted anything they did after 1997 was pretty awful, but at their peak they were successful, influential and wrote some really solid tunes. Oh, duh. Yeah, I meant 90s... even today, I meant to put "02" for something and put "08". Still, Pumpkins were overrated as hell. Also, I'm perfectly comfortable with my knowledge of music, it's quite high. Don't let a typo and a difference of opinion entitle you to assume anything, bud. Also, the fact that you are using them winning a f***ing VMA as a barometer for anything meaningful is just laughable. But, I will say it was a great music video. As an album, Siamese Dream was alright, and Melon Collie had some good songs, but like most double albums, was packed with filler... more than most. I'm not trying to say they weren't huge... that's just ignorant. However, that holds nothing on what I think of them as a band. They robbed My Bloody Valentine's ideas, made them their own, threw in some generic alt rock vibes, and voila, generic 90s rock band. I suppose in comparison to allot of radio rock at the time, they may have been near the top of the pack... but, is that really saying much? I'm on multiple music forums on the net, where all we do is talk music. Nothing but. And I never run across people as willing to make assumptions as some of the people I find here. I get it, you disagree. You don't have to try to insult my intelligence (granted, my typo was really silly if you didn't know it was a typo )
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Post by Manute Bol on Sept 10, 2011 10:17:56 GMT -5
Um, the first Smashing Pumpkins record was released in 91. And if you meant to put 90s and you think they were overrated then I seriously have reservations about your knowledge of music. As a music fan in the 90s, I can testify firsthand that the Pumpkins were absolutely huge at the time. I mean "Tonight Tonight" actually won Video of the Year at the MTV Awards in 1996. I understand that's a meaningless award, but when you consider that the last few winners have been Katy Perry, Lady Gaga and Beyonce, it shows you how big the Pumpkins were at the time. After the death of Kurt Cobain, the Pumpkins, Pearl Jam and Green Day really did inherit the rock and roll throne for a few years there. Nowadays rock and roll is dead as far as the mainstream is concerned and I think that alters people's perceptions of how massive these bands were at the time. "Today", "Bullet With Butterfly Wings", "1979" and "Tonight Tonight" were all hugely popular songs. And I'm know things can be successful and overrated at the same time, but I don't feel like the Pumpkins were overrated. Granted anything they did after 1997 was pretty awful, but at their peak they were successful, influential and wrote some really solid tunes. Oh, duh. Yeah, I meant 90s... even today, I meant to put "02" for something and put "08". Still, Pumpkins were overrated as hell. Also, I'm perfectly comfortable with my knowledge of music, it's quite high. Don't let a typo and a difference of opinion entitle you to assume anything, bud. Also, the fact that you are using them winning a f***ing VMA as a barometer for anything meaningful is just laughable. But, I will say it was a great music video. As an album, Siamese Dream was alright, and Melon Collie had some good songs, but like most double albums, was packed with filler... more than most. I'm not trying to say they weren't huge... that's just ignorant. However, that holds nothing on what I think of them as a band. They robbed My Bloody Valentine's ideas, made them their own, threw in some generic alt rock vibes, and voila, generic 90s rock band. I suppose in comparison to allot of radio rock at the time, they may have been near the top of the pack... but, is that really saying much? I'm on multiple music forums on the net, where all we do is talk music. Nothing but. And I never run across people as willing to make assumptions as some of the people I find here. I get it, you disagree. You don't have to try to insult my intelligence (granted, my typo was really silly if you didn't know it was a typo ) I myself wrote that it was a meaningless award, but I still do think it is worth pointing out just as evidence of how hugely popular they were at the time. Like I said, this award in recent years has been given to widely successful mainstream acts like Lady Gaga and Beyonce and it's hard to imagine a time where bands like the Smashing Pumpkins were receiving the same awards they are today. Obviously that's more a reflection of the mid-90s when alternative rock music had mainstream appeal. Now, believe me I'm not saying that just because they were popular means they were good. I'm not naive enough to think there's any correlation between the two. If there was then Justin Bieber wouldn't be where he is and bands like The Gaslight Anthem would get radio play. I do think the Pumpkins being at the top of the pack of the mid 90s rock scene does mean a lot more than you say though. I mean you had Green Day, Soundgarden, Pearl Jam, Red Hot Chili Peppers, Oasis, Metallica, Nine Inch Nails, Foo Fighters, Hole, Live, Rage Against The Machine, R.E.M., Stone Temple Pilots, Beck, No Doubt, Marilyn Manson, U2, Bush, Everclear and Sublime all putting out music at the time. Many of these bands are future Rock and Roll Hall of Fame acts and, while some of them turned out to be flash in the pans (Bush, Everclear, Stone Temple Pilots), it was an exciting time for mainstream rock music that hasn't been seen since. For the Pumpkins to be toward the "top of the pack" (your words) at that time is pretty impressive. We do have a difference of opinion, but it's easy to call a band overrated 15 years after the fact. They made some great music, gained a ton of success commercially and critically, and left an impressive legacy in rock and roll history. Also, just for the record, I'm far from a Pumpkins fan boy or anything like that, but I do love music discussions like this. I'm only arguing for them so passionately because I was in junior high school when "Today" blew up and I can vividly recall their HUGE success. They were critical darlings at the time and there were no reviewers calling them overrated or really saying anything disparaging about them, plus they had the songs, success and resume to back the praise up. I think it's a tremendously false claim to say they were ever overrated. Maybe you don't enjoy their music personally, but that does not in any way mean they were ever overrated. Also, I have to say "Cherub Rock" and "Disarm" are amazing songs.
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Welfare Willis
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Post by Welfare Willis on Sept 10, 2011 20:32:19 GMT -5
Also, just for the record, I'm far from a Pumpkins fan boy or anything like that, but I do love music discussions like this. I'm only arguing for them so passionately because I was in junior high school when "Today" blew up and I can vividly recall their HUGE success. They were critical darlings at the time and there were no reviewers calling them overrated or really saying anything disparaging about them, plus they had the songs, success and resume to back the praise up. I think it's a tremendously false claim to say they were ever overrated. Maybe you don't enjoy their music personally, but that does not in any way mean they were ever overrated. Also, I have to say "Cherub Rock" and "Disarm" are amazing songs. Think we're getting a little off topic with Billy's music and I agree with what your saying. I'm a huge pumpkins fan and I find some of the stuff Billy does today odd. Still I can't deny his love of wrestling. He may look like Nosferatu incarnate, but if wants to start a promotion... awesome. He can't do worse than some of the promoters out there.
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Kris
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Post by Kris on Sept 10, 2011 23:31:17 GMT -5
Hallowicked and Frightmare have been added to the roster.
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Post by Kash Flagg on Sept 10, 2011 23:38:32 GMT -5
I love that they picked the worst possible pic for Steen.
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Post by mjolnir on Sept 11, 2011 11:02:16 GMT -5
I also love the fact Corgan is basically saying "Yeah, we're using this as a platform for guys to get noticed by WWE or TNA so that they can go there. We'll change plans if that happens but we won't begrudge the guys for going for bigger pay days, it's what we want them to do". I don't think any promotion (developmentals aside) has ever openly stated that is their purpose, to be a train station (basically) to the big time. It is interesting and it has me even more excited for this (though I'm well aware this could all fall on its face).
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 11, 2011 17:10:00 GMT -5
If anything, I'm enjoying the Cleveland hate in this thread. As a former resident. Yeah, Billy Corgan, pro wrestling, blah blah. But I love Cleveland hate.
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Welfare Willis
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Post by Welfare Willis on Sept 11, 2011 22:41:30 GMT -5
Teddy Hart?
Well there's another promotion to get himself banned from.
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