Burst
El Dandy
*inarticulate squawking*
Posts: 8,599
|
Post by Burst on Nov 24, 2011 8:20:05 GMT -5
I was thinking about the Raw in MSG a few years ago, where Kofi Kingston did the Boom Drop on Orton through a table, and also had had that equally impressive moment when he had trashed Orton's NASCAR. Both cases he had the crowd fully behind him, and he seemed like a surprisingly good promo cutter when freed from the Jamaican accent.
Then "stupid stupid stupid" happened and he's been stuck back in the Midcard since, with everybody writing him off as having gone as far as he's going to go.
We all talk about how the WWE is incredibly bad at capitalizing on a performer's hot streak, with only this year really seeming to be the exception and really only then with Punk. What other instances can you think up where a seemingly star-making moment was either not followed upon or deliberately de-emphasized?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 24, 2011 8:23:13 GMT -5
Are you really comparing Kofi getting heat on Orton to Austin 3:16?
|
|
|
Post by Cam on Nov 24, 2011 8:32:53 GMT -5
WWE does it all the time. Half of the midcarders in WWE at the moment have had major title wins/feuds/matches and then de-pushed completely afterwards. And pretty much all of them had a chance to be big stars:
Alex Riley (got a big win over Miz, was over as hell....then dropped off the face of the Earth)
Daniel Bryan (won MITB and has done nothing until now)
Dolph Ziggler (won the world title this year, only to do absolutely nothing when his storyline with Edge ended and he got "fired" from SmackDown)
Drew McIntyre (won the IC title, touted as the future of WWE - now he's losing almost every match on Superstars (!) and can't get on Raw or SD to save his life)
Jack Swagger (won MITB out of nowhere, won the world title, then lost it after 3 months and proceeded to do nothing until WM)
John Morrison (where do we start....over as hell, gets to the final of KOTR, wins No.1 Contender match at TLC, loses in a great match to Miz, impressive Rumble showing, impressive EC performance....then WM27 comes and I think we know the rest of the story)
Wade Barrett (Gets major heat as the leader of Nexus, then he gets replaced by Punk and pretty much does nothing for the next 8 months except winning the IC title which he loses to Ezekiel)
And of course the aforementioned Kofi Kingston. WWE does it all the time. Pretty much all the guys I listed above could be main eventers right now if WWE hadn't decided to do nothing with them.
|
|
|
Post by EoE: Well There's Your Problem on Nov 24, 2011 8:35:05 GMT -5
Are you really comparing Kofi getting heat on Orton to Austin 3:16? You have to look at it in context. If they had followed through on Kofi's push and somehow created a main event talent, people would be undoubtedly looking back to either the MSG Boom Drop or the NASCAR vandalism and saying "That's where it all began for Kofi Kingston: Main Eventer." It would be his Austin 3:16 moment.
|
|
|
Post by Oh Cry Me a Screwball on Nov 24, 2011 8:41:10 GMT -5
John Morrison has had some many potential Austin 3:16 moments it hurts. Take your pick between the awesome ladder match with Sheamus, his impressive avoidance of elimination at the Rumble and the subsequent mini Rumble the next night, and his impressive peformance at the Elimination Chamber. And that's just in the span of three months.
|
|
|
Post by Jedi-El of Tomorrow on Nov 24, 2011 8:58:47 GMT -5
Drew McIntyre (won the IC title, touted as the future of WWE - now he's losing almost every match on Superstars (!) and can't get on Raw or SD to save his life) For Drew his star making moment should have been after Elimination Chamber, but they proceeded to do nothing with him after that. Ted Dibiase and Cody Rhodes - Cody's bounced back nicely, and I have no doubt he'll be a World Champion in 2012. But the WWE dropped the ball massively on these 2 after the DX feud. They had faced DX in 3 consecutive big time matches at ppvs, main eventing one, and IMO having the match of the night all 3 times, but creative didn't do a damn thing with them. I still maintain that creative should have had DX say before Bragging Rights "We've been in the ring with you, and we know what you are, and what you can do. You're on the team."
|
|
|
Post by Ryushinku on Nov 24, 2011 10:37:41 GMT -5
Considering it took still a damn long while for Austin to really catch fire after that 3:16 promo anyway, it's a bit of a tough one to answer.
Looking back we can point at that as the real birth of the character, but it took a ton of hard work, good matches and good promos from Austin after that to further push things on.
|
|
|
Post by Branimal on Nov 24, 2011 10:45:20 GMT -5
Didn't Billy Gunn have a major push going into King of the Ring '99 when he won the tournament?
Well.. until that Rock promo anyway. Also, the Edge promo from about two years later didn't help either.
|
|
Rican
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
July 17, 2011 - HHHe called it
Posts: 16,508
|
Post by Rican on Nov 24, 2011 10:51:34 GMT -5
MVP, twice. He had that night with Orton where he interrupted him while he was champion, held his own, had an awesome promo, and had a good match with Orton that night. MVP even said in a shoot that Orton had requested to work with MVP again after that. Then nothing. MVP was tagging with Mark Henry.
Then, there was that night he cut an awesome promo on Miz when they were feuding for the US title. (which was immediately after an awesome promo from Miz, too.) Then, once again, nothing.
I wasn't even the biggest MVP fan but I recognized they dropped the ball on him big time.
|
|
|
Post by Society of the Spectacle on Nov 24, 2011 11:04:39 GMT -5
Considering it took still a damn long while for Austin to really catch fire after that 3:16 promo anyway, it's a bit of a tough one to answer. Looking back we can point at that as the real birth of the character, but it took a ton of hard work, good matches and good promos from Austin after that to further push things on. Taking this into account, I'm going to say CM Punk since MITB. Basically the ending of MITB was just as cathartic and cinematic as "Austin 3:16" and although Punk is probably bigger than he's ever been with casual fans, I think they could have/can make him even bigger. This next phase in his career is very important, and as you said, if he keeps putting on dynamite matches and segments, we will have a new kind of Austin on on hands.
|
|
|
Post by crimsonwolf on Nov 24, 2011 11:09:43 GMT -5
Well, there was Chris Jericho's phantom title win when he beat Triple H. Yeah, he ended up becoming the Undisputed Champion, but his reign screamed placeholder. It wasn't until several years later that he was legitimately in the title hunt.
Kofi Kingston is definitely another case. Honestly outside of arguably botching Orton's punt (which is a completely idiotic reason to cut off someone's push), Kofi's only crime was that the crowd started to turn Orton face (which still, does mean you shunt him back to midcard feuds again.)
At risk of ridicule, I'm also going to say Matt Hardy. Even though that promo definitely did not do him any favors, Matt Hardy was over as hell in 2005, even after he was moved to Smackdown. Part of the problem was that he got lost in the shuffle after Eddie's untimely death. Prior to that, it was pretty clear he was going to be feuding with Orton (who may have ended up winning the title off of Batista). But after Eddie died, Orton was put on the SS team, Rey Mysterio became the top face, and Matt just lost whatever push he had left.
|
|
|
Post by Sparvid on Nov 24, 2011 11:26:51 GMT -5
Drew McIntyre (won the IC title, touted as the future of WWE - now he's losing almost every match on Superstars (!) and can't get on Raw or SD to save his life) For Drew his star making moment should have been after Elimination Chamber, but they proceeded to do nothing with him after that. I was going to post that. He looked like a beast in the Chamber match, and it led absolutely nowhere.
|
|
|
Post by FUNK_US/BRODUS on Nov 24, 2011 13:12:39 GMT -5
It is amazing how many theyve missed. But Wade Barrett is the worst, it was RIGHT there slap bang in their face, and they killed him. They had Cena make the Nexus look like a total joke for a month, and then Cena literally buried Barrett at TLC. Oh, and this is after your evil mastermind heel sets up a match where the special referee is in his favour because the referee loses his job in case of an Orton win.
That angle couldve easily carried itself to WrestleMania if you had Barrett win.
|
|
|
Post by crimsonwolf on Nov 24, 2011 13:22:54 GMT -5
It is amazing how many theyve missed. But Wade Barrett is the worst, it was RIGHT there slap bang in their face, and they killed him. They had Cena make the Nexus look like a total joke for a month, and then Cena literally buried Barrett at TLC. Oh, and this is after your evil mastermind heel sets up a match where the special referee is in his favour because the referee loses his job in case of an Orton win. That angle couldve easily carried itself to WrestleMania if you had Barrett win. Honestly, in retrospect I think that's the route they may have went but then Rock agreed to work with the company, finally allowing them to do the Rock/Cena dream match.
|
|
|
Post by FUNK_US/BRODUS on Nov 24, 2011 13:34:50 GMT -5
It is amazing how many theyve missed. But Wade Barrett is the worst, it was RIGHT there slap bang in their face, and they killed him. They had Cena make the Nexus look like a total joke for a month, and then Cena literally buried Barrett at TLC. Oh, and this is after your evil mastermind heel sets up a match where the special referee is in his favour because the referee loses his job in case of an Orton win. That angle couldve easily carried itself to WrestleMania if you had Barrett win. Honestly, in retrospect I think that's the route they may have went but then Rock agreed to work with the company, finally allowing them to do the Rock/Cena dream match. You could easily have set up Rock vs Cena for the Wrestlemania a YEAR after WM 27 by doing something other than Russo-ing the main event of WM 27 (e.g. what they did this year)
|
|
kidglov3s
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Wants her Shot
Who is Tiger Maskooo?
Posts: 15,870
|
Post by kidglov3s on Nov 24, 2011 13:41:46 GMT -5
Are you really comparing Kofi getting heat on Orton to Austin 3:16? You have to look at it in context. If they had followed through on Kofi's push and somehow created a main event talent, people would be undoubtedly looking back to either the MSG Boom Drop or the NASCAR vandalism and saying "That's where it all began for Kofi Kingston: Main Eventer." It would be his Austin 3:16 moment. If Kofi didn't need John Cena to coach him through a promo on Raw on live television, the night of "Stupid! Stupid! Stupid!" coincidentally (ha!) enough, and he could get reactions on a dependable basis, maybe the Push Kofi movement would be less ridiculous.
|
|
|
Post by Brother Nero....Wolfe on Nov 24, 2011 14:16:38 GMT -5
You know, if Ryder's momentum doesn't stop, I think it will be honestly hilarious to remember that his "Austin 3:16" moment involved Hugh Jackman.
|
|
|
Post by "Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay on Nov 24, 2011 14:27:56 GMT -5
The thing with this is... not everyone can be the next Austin. We can't have EVERYONE be the most over guy on the roster. Pushes like Austin's take time and effort.
|
|
Hawk Hart
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Sold his organs.
The Best There Is, the Best There Was, and the Best That There Ever Will Be
Posts: 15,296
|
Post by Hawk Hart on Nov 24, 2011 14:33:45 GMT -5
You have to look at it in context. If they had followed through on Kofi's push and somehow created a main event talent, people would be undoubtedly looking back to either the MSG Boom Drop or the NASCAR vandalism and saying "That's where it all began for Kofi Kingston: Main Eventer." It would be his Austin 3:16 moment. If Kofi didn't need John Cena to coach him through a promo on Raw on live television, the night of "Stupid! Stupid! Stupid!" coincidentally (ha!) enough, and he could get reactions on a dependable basis, maybe the Push Kofi movement would be less ridiculous. One off night and a lack of "consistent" reactions (Almost revisionist history there) is no reason to kill Kofi's push. He was getting over, he was getting a shot to work a program with Orton, and I know for a fact that Kofi managed to get a lot of people that otherwise had no interest in him as a character to care after the NASCAR promo. And that's despite almost falling on his ass and saying "I got you Randy!" a million times.
|
|
The Punisher
Unicron
"They don't fear the law. They fear me..."
Posts: 3,082
|
Post by The Punisher on Nov 24, 2011 14:49:33 GMT -5
For the shock value, Daniel Bryan choking out Justin Roberts had the potential to make him a real star - a legitimate threat to other wrestlers and a badass.
But because of PG13 he got fired and is now neutered to Hell. Oh well.
|
|