Juice
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Post by Juice on Mar 4, 2013 15:07:24 GMT -5
A batman superman movie in Nolanverse could work. Flash, Wonder Woman, Green Lantern, Aquaman, doesn't make sense yet. Not even in a broad look how floored everyone is at their existence now kind of way.
However the super gritty realism of Nolans batman interacting with Superman makes me chuckle in a good way. I can see good banter like Loki and Stark in the Avengers.
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Post by xCompackx on Mar 4, 2013 15:08:01 GMT -5
Is it wrong that I still think the idea of a Justice League movie with so little buildup just screams of desperation? I'd be down for seeing Superman and Batman on screen as much as the next guy, but unless they intend for Man of Steel to set up EVERYTHING involved with Justice League, how is this going to work?
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Post by Koda, Master Crunchyroller on Mar 4, 2013 15:19:10 GMT -5
Is it wrong that I still think the idea of a Justice League movie with so little buildup just screams of desperation? I'd be down for seeing Superman and Batman on screen as much as the next guy, but unless they intend for Man of Steel to set up EVERYTHING involved with Justice League, how is this going to work? True. This still looks like it'll be a disaster. There is no build up. ESPECIALLY for Wonder Woman, Flash, and either Martian Manhunter or Aquaman(something tells me we are only getting one of the two). They could haphazardly slap together Supes, Batman, and Green Lantern by using the Man of Steel Supes, either of the Nolanverse Bats(even though I am opposed to Bale for this), and Ryan Reynolds as Green Lantern. But still. The WB execs are clearly missing the point as to why The Avengers worked. It worked because from the beginning in 2008 with Iron Man and Hulk, it was clear these films were all part of the same universe, if only because they had characters that appeared in other films in the universe show up in the other other films in the universe. They spent 2008, 2009, 2010, and 2011 building up to The Avengers. WB is jumping straight to the Justice League.
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Jake, The Jake, Jake
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Post by Jake, The Jake, Jake on Mar 4, 2013 15:33:33 GMT -5
I feel bad for JGL, he gets the torch passed to him and then taken away? ![](http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h162/Dark_Enigma_2006/JBL.jpg) I WANT MY DAMN TORCH BACK!
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Post by austinariesfan88 on Mar 4, 2013 16:15:12 GMT -5
I just hope Ryan Reynolds returns to be GL.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2013 16:20:12 GMT -5
This thing with Bale is like the animated Batman movies, when they use Kevin Conway in different multi-continuity films and stories (and fans go apecrap crazy getting to hear Conway over and over again). Cripes, didn't we have a series of live action movies with 3 different actors in the role? Why can't it be reverse, like with Conway? Why can't 1 live action actor play the role in different multi-continuity films? It's automatic name/star value for the project - let the nerds online (whoops) worry about the details.... ![:P](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/tongue.png)
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Welfare Willis
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Post by Welfare Willis on Mar 4, 2013 16:28:17 GMT -5
This thing with Bale is like the animated Batman movies, when they use Kevin Conway in different multi-continuity films and stories (and fans go apecrap crazy getting to hear Conway over and over again). Cripes, didn't we have a series of live action movies with 3 different actors in the role? Why can't it be reverse, like with Conway? Why can't 1 live action actor play the role in different multi-continuity films? It's automatic name/star value for the project - let the nerds online (whoops) worry about the details.... ![:P](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/tongue.png) Conway? Why can't 1 live action actor play the role in different multi-continuity films? It's a good question. My only response does Warner Brothers want to pay an actor to play in so many films? Also would said actor want to grow and not be pigeonhold as "batman". I think it's slightly different for voice actors and "big name" talent actors to tackle a role multiple times. It's the same thing that I think is going to happen to Robert Downey Jr. In the movie universe he IS Tony Stark/Iron Man. However, at some point he's either going to get tired of playing the character or Marvel is going to get tired ponying up the money for him.
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Post by BorneAgain on Mar 4, 2013 16:29:18 GMT -5
I still think the potentially risky but more rewarding way to go with the JL film would be to set it back in the late 40s/early 50. Its a different tone from Avengers, a chance to see a fun late golden age/early silver age aesthetic, and just interesting dramatic potential of a Cold War world reacting to people like Superman and especially Wonder Woman and a John Stewart Green Lantern.
Plus it might mean a detective/film noir Batman flick which in a 1940s setting would be so awesome.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2013 16:54:23 GMT -5
If anything, I'd consider having Nolan and Bale involved to be a bad thing. Great series of movies and all, but I want a new Batman that actually feels like the proper character. This thing with Bale is like the animated Batman movies, when they use Kevin Conway in different multi-continuity films and stories (and fans go apecrap crazy getting to hear Conway over and over again). Cripes, didn't we have a series of live action movies with 3 different actors in the role? Why can't it be reverse, like with Conway? Why can't 1 live action actor play the role in different multi-continuity films? It's automatic name/star value for the project - let the nerds online (whoops) worry about the details.... ![:P](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/tongue.png) Conway? Why can't 1 live action actor play the role in different multi-continuity films? It's a good question. My only response does Warner Brothers want to pay an actor to play in so many films? Also would said actor want to grow and not be pigeonhold as "batman". I think it's slightly different for voice actors and "big name" talent actors to tackle a role multiple times. It's the same thing that I think is going to happen to Robert Downey Jr. In the movie universe he IS Tony Stark/Iron Man. However, at some point he's either going to get tired of playing the character or Marvel is going to get tired ponying up the money for him. From what I hear, Downey's already said that he has no interest in doing more Iron Man movies and is only willing to do two more Avengers ones.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2013 17:01:40 GMT -5
Is it wrong that I still think the idea of a Justice League movie with so little buildup just screams of desperation? I'd be down for seeing Superman and Batman on screen as much as the next guy, but unless they intend for Man of Steel to set up EVERYTHING involved with Justice League, how is this going to work? True. This still looks like it'll be a disaster. There is no build up. ESPECIALLY for Wonder Woman, Flash, and either Martian Manhunter or Aquaman(something tells me we are only getting one of the two). They could haphazardly slap together Supes, Batman, and Green Lantern by using the Man of Steel Supes, either of the Nolanverse Bats(even though I am opposed to Bale for this), and Ryan Reynolds as Green Lantern. But still. The WB execs are clearly missing the point as to why The Avengers worked. It worked because from the beginning in 2008 with Iron Man and Hulk, it was clear these films were all part of the same universe, if only because they had characters that appeared in other films in the universe show up in the other other films in the universe. They spent 2008, 2009, 2010, and 2011 building up to The Avengers. WB is jumping straight to the Justice League. And if they did the buildup, and people complained that they were just copying how the Avengers did it. What then? To be honest, Avengers needed the buildup because - to mainstream people - who the bleep were these folks? Iron Man? Thor? Hawkeye and Black Widow? Their stories and origins and even existances were unknown to mainstream moviegoers. Comic nerds know them inside and out, sure. But I'll bet you more moviegoers learned who Iron Man was from the movies than from the comics. Marvel's Avengers bunch largely needed the buildup. DC's JLA largely does not. Mainstream folks know the standard superheroes: thanks to cartoons and common lore from youth, Spider-Man and Hulk are easies. Maybe the X-Men too. But from DC? Superman, Batman, probably Wonder Woman, Aquaman, GL had his movie, maybe Flash.... If anything, let the big DC team movie spawn individual movies.
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Post by Koda, Master Crunchyroller on Mar 4, 2013 17:18:41 GMT -5
True. This still looks like it'll be a disaster. There is no build up. ESPECIALLY for Wonder Woman, Flash, and either Martian Manhunter or Aquaman(something tells me we are only getting one of the two). They could haphazardly slap together Supes, Batman, and Green Lantern by using the Man of Steel Supes, either of the Nolanverse Bats(even though I am opposed to Bale for this), and Ryan Reynolds as Green Lantern. But still. The WB execs are clearly missing the point as to why The Avengers worked. It worked because from the beginning in 2008 with Iron Man and Hulk, it was clear these films were all part of the same universe, if only because they had characters that appeared in other films in the universe show up in the other other films in the universe. They spent 2008, 2009, 2010, and 2011 building up to The Avengers. WB is jumping straight to the Justice League. And if they did the buildup, and people complained that they were just copying how the Avengers did it. What then? To be honest, Avengers needed the buildup because - to mainstream people - who the bleep were these folks? Iron Man? Thor? Hawkeye and Black Widow? Their stories and origins and even existances were unknown to mainstream moviegoers. Comic nerds know them inside and out, sure. But I'll bet you more moviegoers learned who Iron Man was from the movies than from the comics. Marvel's Avengers bunch largely needed the buildup. DC's JLA largely does not. Mainstream folks know the standard superheroes: thanks to cartoons and common lore from youth, Spider-Man and Hulk are easies. Maybe the X-Men too. But from DC? Superman, Batman, probably Wonder Woman, Aquaman, GL had his movie, maybe Flash.... If anything, let the big DC team movie spawn individual movies. You are GROSSLY overestimating the mainstream public, mate. They may know that names of the DC characters, but they often know jack all about them. For example, when Jason Todd was killed as Robin the vast majority of the mainstream public at the time thought it was Dick Grayson that was killed off. Basically they didn't know that by that point that there was 3 Robins. And Green Lantern? Oh dear lord that is a colossal clusterf*** right there. I mean just how many people bitched at the Green Lantern movie for using Hal Jordan, and not because he was Hal Jordan, but because they "used a white Green Lantern"? In other words, to the mainstream public, the only Green Lantern there is is John Stewart. And the Flash? Are you f***ing kidding me? I'm pretty damned sure the mainstream public can't tell any of the Flashes apart from one another. Trust me, man, they NEED build up films. If anything they need them more than Marvel did, because sooooooo many of DC's premier heroes are legacy characters, meaning they pass the name down over time.
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Post by Cry Me a Wiggle on Mar 4, 2013 17:21:35 GMT -5
Considering how much Nolan and Goyer actually DID pull from the comics, the solution is simple: Batman Incorporated. Blake is still the Batman of Gotham, while Bruce Wayne gets pulled out of retirement due to the events of the Justice League movie to handle a worldwide crisis. This is the status quo of Batman books from 2010 to 2011, where we had two Batmen operating at the same time.
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Post by Koda, Master Crunchyroller on Mar 4, 2013 17:27:42 GMT -5
Considering how much Nolan and Goyer actually DID pull from the comics, the solution is simple: Batman Incorporated. Blake is still the Batman of Gotham, while Bruce Wayne gets pulled out of retirement due to the events of the Justice League movie to handle a worldwide crisis. This is the status quo of Batman books from 2010 to 2011, where we had two Batmen operating at the same time. Oh yeah........that could work......wouldn't care much for it, but it could work.
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Sin Cara Tres
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Post by Sin Cara Tres on Mar 4, 2013 17:46:05 GMT -5
Bale should totally be the Kevin Conroy of live action. Change him up a bit, give Bruce different hair, a new Batsuit, don't reference The Dark Knight Trilogy.
To not include him in a JL movie sounds bullshit anyway. The Batman of this generation, involved in a huge trilogy, and we can't even get him for what's supposed to be the best of the best?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2013 17:57:51 GMT -5
Also, speaking of mainstream audiences; Fairly sure Aquaman is still seen as a joke character.
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CMWaters
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Post by CMWaters on Mar 4, 2013 18:01:31 GMT -5
Also, speaking of mainstream audiences; Fairly sure Aquaman is still seen as a joke character. Which is all the more reason a movie of him needs to be made. Hell, before the 89 movie, most of the public when thinking Batman thought the 60s TV show.
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Post by Red Impact on Mar 4, 2013 18:15:28 GMT -5
And if they did the buildup, and people complained that they were just copying how the Avengers did it. What then? To be honest, Avengers needed the buildup because - to mainstream people - who the bleep were these folks? Iron Man? Thor? Hawkeye and Black Widow? Their stories and origins and even existances were unknown to mainstream moviegoers. Comic nerds know them inside and out, sure. But I'll bet you more moviegoers learned who Iron Man was from the movies than from the comics. Marvel's Avengers bunch largely needed the buildup. DC's JLA largely does not. Mainstream folks know the standard superheroes: thanks to cartoons and common lore from youth, Spider-Man and Hulk are easies. Maybe the X-Men too. But from DC? Superman, Batman, probably Wonder Woman, Aquaman, GL had his movie, maybe Flash.... If anything, let the big DC team movie spawn individual movies. You are GROSSLY overestimating the mainstream public, mate. They may know that names of the DC characters, but they often know jack all about them. For example, when Jason Todd was killed as Robin the vast majority of the mainstream public at the time thought it was Dick Grayson that was killed off. Basically they didn't know that by that point that there was 3 Robins. And Green Lantern? Oh dear lord that is a colossal clusterf*** right there. I mean just how many people bitched at the Green Lantern movie for using Hal Jordan, and not because he was Hal Jordan, but because they "used a white Green Lantern"? In other words, to the mainstream public, the only Green Lantern there is is John Stewart. And the Flash? Are you f***ing kidding me? I'm pretty damned sure the mainstream public can't tell any of the Flashes apart from one another. Trust me, man, they NEED build up films. If anything they need them more than Marvel did, because sooooooo many of DC's premier heroes are legacy characters, meaning they pass the name down over time. The fact that there are legacy heroes is really irrelevant in terms of a movie, because we won't see movies with the legacy characters, unless they're presented as the only version of the character in that universe. It doesn't matter that there've been five Robins, because there will never be enough of them for Robin to pass them down. A new reader understanding comics is much different from a non-comic fan watching a movie. Where the general public probably couldn't identify 2/3 of the major players in the Avengers without the build up movies, they probably could identify 2/3 of the main cast of a Justice League movie. They may not be able to tell you where Wonder Woman came from, but they still know more about her than they do Black Widow. While I doubt this movie would do well if they just threw it out there, it'd really have nothing to do with comic book continuity. Hell, I think most lead ins would probably do fairly poorly just because the characters by and large arent' as interesting.
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Post by mjolnir on Mar 4, 2013 18:29:49 GMT -5
Considering how much Nolan and Goyer actually DID pull from the comics, the solution is simple: Batman Incorporated. Blake is still the Batman of Gotham, while Bruce Wayne gets pulled out of retirement due to the events of the Justice League movie to handle a worldwide crisis. This is the status quo of Batman books from 2010 to 2011, where we had two Batmen operating at the same time. I suggested this in the page prior but nobody wants to listen to me, it seems. ![:(](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/sad.png) Also it makes some sense. Something as Earthly as Gotham? Bruce let's Blake handle. But something as massive as an alien showing up, an Amazon, and so on? Bruce gets pulled out of retirement for. And, if they don't want to do Martian Manhunter, have Bruce somewhat adopt his usual position within the group. Being the, supposedly, oldest of the group and the most experienced, and the most banged up, have Bruce be their eye in the sky & tactical support. Naturally at some point he'll have his action scene and his moment, but this is a way to set up the others and not have it be Batman + the JLA too.
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Post by Koda, Master Crunchyroller on Mar 4, 2013 18:36:59 GMT -5
You are GROSSLY overestimating the mainstream public, mate. They may know that names of the DC characters, but they often know jack all about them. For example, when Jason Todd was killed as Robin the vast majority of the mainstream public at the time thought it was Dick Grayson that was killed off. Basically they didn't know that by that point that there was 3 Robins. And Green Lantern? Oh dear lord that is a colossal clusterf*** right there. I mean just how many people bitched at the Green Lantern movie for using Hal Jordan, and not because he was Hal Jordan, but because they "used a white Green Lantern"? In other words, to the mainstream public, the only Green Lantern there is is John Stewart. And the Flash? Are you f***ing kidding me? I'm pretty damned sure the mainstream public can't tell any of the Flashes apart from one another. Trust me, man, they NEED build up films. If anything they need them more than Marvel did, because sooooooo many of DC's premier heroes are legacy characters, meaning they pass the name down over time. The fact that there are legacy heroes is really irrelevant in terms of a movie, because we won't see movies with the legacy characters, unless they're presented as the only version of the character in that universe. It doesn't matter that there've been five Robins, because there will never be enough of them for Robin to pass them down. A new reader understanding comics is much different from a non-comic fan watching a movie. Where the general public probably couldn't identify 2/3 of the major players in the Avengers without the build up movies, they probably could identify 2/3 of the main cast of a Justice League movie. They may not be able to tell you where Wonder Woman came from, but they still know more about her than they do Black Widow. While I doubt this movie would do well if they just threw it out there, it'd really have nothing to do with comic book continuity. Hell, I think most lead ins would probably do fairly poorly just because the characters by and large arent' as interesting. You are kind of missing the point I was trying to make. What I was trying to say is the mainstream public only knows the hero monikers. They don't know a thing about the characters beyond their moniker and what they look like. That's fine with someone like Wonder Woman and Supes and even Batman(especially Batman because he is meant to be a symbol, people are supposed to fear the name and costume, not who is wearing it). But Green Lantern? Flash? They need to sort those out. Especially because each of the GLs and Flashes are their own unique characters. So they could probably get away without lead in films for Bats, Supes, and WW, but they have to have lead in films for GL, the Flash, and Aquaman(because people need to get over their f***ing, "Herr durr, Aquaman sucks, he only talks to fish."), though they might be able to get away without doing a GL film if they just go with Hal Jordan again, but otherwise they would have to do the typical origin film for Guy, Kyle, or John.
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Post by xCompackx on Mar 4, 2013 18:45:53 GMT -5
You are GROSSLY overestimating the mainstream public, mate. They may know that names of the DC characters, but they often know jack all about them. For example, when Jason Todd was killed as Robin the vast majority of the mainstream public at the time thought it was Dick Grayson that was killed off. Basically they didn't know that by that point that there was 3 Robins. And Green Lantern? Oh dear lord that is a colossal clusterf*** right there. I mean just how many people bitched at the Green Lantern movie for using Hal Jordan, and not because he was Hal Jordan, but because they "used a white Green Lantern"? In other words, to the mainstream public, the only Green Lantern there is is John Stewart. And the Flash? Are you f***ing kidding me? I'm pretty damned sure the mainstream public can't tell any of the Flashes apart from one another. Trust me, man, they NEED build up films. If anything they need them more than Marvel did, because sooooooo many of DC's premier heroes are legacy characters, meaning they pass the name down over time. The fact that there are legacy heroes is really irrelevant in terms of a movie, because we won't see movies with the legacy characters, unless they're presented as the only version of the character in that universe. It doesn't matter that there've been five Robins, because there will never be enough of them for Robin to pass them down. A new reader understanding comics is much different from a non-comic fan watching a movie. Where the general public probably couldn't identify 2/3 of the major players in the Avengers without the build up movies, they probably could identify 2/3 of the main cast of a Justice League movie. They may not be able to tell you where Wonder Woman came from, but they still know more about her than they do Black Widow. While I doubt this movie would do well if they just threw it out there, it'd really have nothing to do with comic book continuity. Hell, I think most lead ins would probably do fairly poorly just because the characters by and large arent' as interesting. I don't really think it's an issue of identity though in this case since DC Universe Online and Injustice: Gods Among Us takes care of showing people who the Justice League is, character-wise. The problem with no buildup is that (assuming it will be a 2 hour-ish movie) you've got so many characters and stories to introduce all at once. Even if Man of Steel sets up Superman and Batman, how do you introduce Wonder Woman, Aquaman, The Flash, Martian Manhunter, and retcon/re-introduce Green Lantern and still have a movie (along with villians and other characters)?
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