543Y2J
Patti Mayonnaise
Seventh level .gif Master
Posts: 38,794
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Post by 543Y2J on Apr 9, 2013 0:30:24 GMT -5
He was wonderful tonight and played it perfectly
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DIIV
ALF
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Posts: 1,017
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Post by DIIV on Apr 9, 2013 0:37:49 GMT -5
I still say that not turning heel is the most heel thing Cena can do. Oddly enough this is true. I don't think there's ever been a case like this in all of wrestling where a babyface is booed on a such a consistent basis that the most heelish thing he could do is remain a babyface.
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Post by flatsdomino on Apr 9, 2013 2:13:44 GMT -5
y'know, this is PURE speculation on my part, but sometimes I really get the vibe that John Cena isn't the saint we make him out to be in real life. Guy has TOO much fun acting like a smug asshole and rubbing it in people's faces that he's on top and not going anywhere. Could be nothing, but I'm starting to think there might just be a little something to it.
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mrjl
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 20,319
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Post by mrjl on Apr 9, 2013 5:08:40 GMT -5
getting to crowds is not manipulating crowds. The adults are getting pissed off and the kids are maybe getting a laugh from that so bot groups are feeling what they would be feeling a little bit stronger, but they're still feeling what they would be anyway. Honestly, the whole heel turn to freshen up, and presumably then be cheered just seems so weak to me. I like Cena and I can get behind a guy who likes kids, especially if it means acting like he doesn't want to. The choice between playing a character that appeals to people who already like him and is apparently close to his real personality versus playing a more fictional character to appeal to people who screwed with him for years seems a no brainer to me. Fans in WWE have put Cena into an after school special situation and want him to choose the wrong ending Children are too stupid to know or enjoy that adults are getting trolled. They'd likely not understand it. All they know or care about is that Cena is strong and wins all the time. It's the same formula that drove me as a kid to like Hogan or Warrior before I realized that Mr. Perfect and Randy Savage were much more interesting. And to say that we want Cena to choose the "wrong ending" implies that your view that he's right and just is absolute. Some people want him to turn because he's irritating in his current incarnation and by being a heel, hopefully with the same attributes and booking, we can at least count on the fact that eventually he'll get his comeuppance. That's what drove last year's Rock match. Wow! I'm so used to people claiming kids are smarter than people in power give them credit for when someone is trying to justify changing something kids like by saying they can understand nuance, that seeing them called dumb is pretty shocking. On the wrong ending subject, actually changing yourself to please others is presented as the wrong ending in those sort of specials whatever my opinion on the subject and Cena would be changing himself. In fact it's not limited to after school specials, though outside of them it's often presented as a good thing and it's just the audience that doesn't approve. Like in the 70's movie/musical Grease when Olivia Newton John's character changes for Danny Zuko's. In fact at at site hosted by the FreakinAwesomeNetwork; Dave the Dave's Review Review there's criticism of the Steve Urkel/Laura Winslow relationship when he had to change for her and there was a character named Myra who loved him as is. And as to whether heel Cena would get his comeuppance, that's a bit of presumption to justify such a dramatic change. Top faces who turn tend to not have it happen. Hulk Hogan not getting a proper one of those is considered something that really hurt WCW, hell none of the core nWo did and I think they all got eventual face runs. Steve Austin had a blood bath with Kurt Angle and lost ending the WCW/ECW Alliance, which no one liked and then turned face after it. Triple H's "Reign of Terror" is still held against him and the closest he got was being turned on and outsmarted by Batista (though I'm not sure you consider him a top face).
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mrjl
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 20,319
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Post by mrjl on Apr 9, 2013 5:12:02 GMT -5
y'know, this is PURE speculation on my part, but sometimes I really get the vibe that John Cena isn't the saint we make him out to be in real life. Guy has TOO much fun acting like a smug asshole and rubbing it in people's faces that he's on top and not going anywhere. Could be nothing, but I'm starting to think there might just be a little something to it. he's not made out to be a saint, he's made out to be a decent guy who enjoys working with kids and representing his job! That's not a saint. His sense of humor has ALWAYS leaned toward smartass and he's never been presented as too good to hurt or damage the property of those who wrong him. How often in WWE history has he turned the other cheek and let an attack on him go?
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2013 5:41:34 GMT -5
I still say that not turning heel is the most heel thing Cena can do. But this argument is flawed because a Cena heel turn would be a babyface turn to most adults and smarks and a heel turn to women and children!
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543Y2J
Patti Mayonnaise
Seventh level .gif Master
Posts: 38,794
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Post by 543Y2J on Apr 9, 2013 6:16:36 GMT -5
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2013 6:53:34 GMT -5
Kane was actually doing him a favor last year, when he told him to "Embrace The Hate".
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CM Dazz
King Koopa
Chuck
Posts: 10,475
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Post by CM Dazz on Apr 9, 2013 7:45:21 GMT -5
I'll second this. His heel turn nearly had me falling out of the recliner. Gold Jerry, GOLD!
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Post by #RUDO Coco Del Rio on Apr 9, 2013 8:46:58 GMT -5
... White boy can mooooove them hips.
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The Doctor
Dennis Stamp
New teeth. That's weird.
Posts: 4,952
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Post by The Doctor on Apr 9, 2013 9:01:28 GMT -5
I still say that not turning heel is the most heel thing Cena can do. Exactly.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2013 9:05:42 GMT -5
Troll Cena > Heel Cena. I don't care about his stale character, lack of heel turn as long as he continues trolling the "partisan" crowds.
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Dat Dude
Dennis Stamp
Wait, what?
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Post by Dat Dude on Apr 9, 2013 9:06:09 GMT -5
I kept on saying over and over that he wasn't turning heel, but instead was gonna just troll folks.
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The Doctor
Dennis Stamp
New teeth. That's weird.
Posts: 4,952
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Post by The Doctor on Apr 9, 2013 9:07:23 GMT -5
Children are too stupid to know or enjoy that adults are getting trolled. They'd likely not understand it. All they know or care about is that Cena is strong and wins all the time. It's the same formula that drove me as a kid to like Hogan or Warrior before I realized that Mr. Perfect and Randy Savage were much more interesting. Children aren't stupid enough to keep watching something they don't like though. Can't say the same thing for most 'smart' wrestling fans.
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Post by Kitty Shamrocks on Apr 9, 2013 9:11:00 GMT -5
Cena is not face.Cena is not heel.Cena is Cena. There are an infinite number of Cenas in an infinite number of universes. He just is.
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Post by airraidcrash on Apr 9, 2013 9:14:31 GMT -5
If he's going to stay like this then he should only be programmed against faces. Heels can't get a lot of heat from the fans when they're feuding with him. Look at Ziggler and Punk. I'm glad Ryback is his next feud.
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The Doctor
Dennis Stamp
New teeth. That's weird.
Posts: 4,952
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Post by The Doctor on Apr 9, 2013 9:18:04 GMT -5
If he's going to stay like this then he should only be programmed against faces. Heels can't get a lot of heat from the fans when they're feuding with him. Look at Ziggler and Punk. I'm glad Ryback is his next feud. It is important to remember that a lot of people DO like him. In fact they love him. Just because the people who boo are loud doesn't mean they are most important. I understand your point but I do think he needs to feud with heels as well. Because those kids who buy his shirts are just as important as anyone else. Wrestling is for everyone not just people who post about it on forums.
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Post by PTBartman on Apr 9, 2013 9:22:54 GMT -5
Cena is not face.Cena is not heel.Cena is Cena. There are an infinite number of Cenas in an infinite number of universes. He just is. If you take an infinite number of Cenas and an infinite number of typewriters would they eventually write all the great promos in the history of our sport?
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Post by Kitty Shamrocks on Apr 9, 2013 9:23:17 GMT -5
If he's going to stay like this then he should only be programmed against faces. Heels can't get a lot of heat from the fans when they're feuding with him. Look at Ziggler and Punk. I'm glad Ryback is his next feud. It is important to remember that a lot of people DO like him. In fact they love him. Just because the people who boo are loud doesn't mean they are most important. I understand your point but I do think he needs to feud with heels as well. Because those kids who buy his shirts are just as important as anyone else. Wrestling is for everyone not just people who post about it on forums. I think Cena/Henry is a great program tbh. Henry is clearly over with both fanbases (to generalize as much as possible: hated by the kids, liked by "smarks"). We get another strongman match and a big fight feel with people cheering both sides. If we keep getting stuff like that, I'm fine with Cena staying the way he is.
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Post by Kitty Shamrocks on Apr 9, 2013 9:25:04 GMT -5
There are an infinite number of Cenas in an infinite number of universes. He just is. If you take an infinite number of Cenas and an infinite number of typewriters would they eventually write all the great promos in the history of our sport? Already done, and he didn't even need to speak it.
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