Marty McFry
Don Corleone
"She was mine before she was yours.... Wooooo"
Posts: 1,657
|
Post by Marty McFry on Jul 10, 2013 9:24:24 GMT -5
Did Tensai not beat him clean?
|
|
Ben Wyatt
Crow T. Robot
Are You Gonna Go My Way?
I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
Posts: 41,552
|
Post by Ben Wyatt on Jul 10, 2013 9:34:54 GMT -5
Let me get this straight. In the 8 years that Cena has been the top guys, he has been pinned cleanly more times than Hogan did during his 8 year run at the top of the WWF. That is what I am reading when I look at Andrew's post. You may be right. Overall, Cena loses alot more often than some people realize
|
|
|
Post by crowwreak was WRONG on Jul 10, 2013 10:16:16 GMT -5
Let me get this straight. In the 8 years that Cena has been the top guys, he has been pinned cleanly more times than Hogan did during his 8 year run at the top of the WWF. That is what I am reading when I look at Andrew's post. You may be right. Overall, Cena loses alot more often than some people realize That's still not many times
|
|
|
Post by canceled4truth on Jul 10, 2013 10:24:12 GMT -5
How many times was Hogan pinned clearly during his run, anyways? Warrior at Wrestlemania is the only one I can think of off the top of my head
|
|
|
Post by Cyno on Jul 10, 2013 10:31:48 GMT -5
I don't get this fixation over clean losses. Heels aren't supposed to play fair.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 10, 2013 10:33:42 GMT -5
I know Khali pinned him clean on a show during their 2007 feud. SNME maybe? Yeah, it was Saturday Night's Main Event. That was the first match on that show. Embarassingly, that was the feud that made me start really liking Khali. Wait.. what about JBL at Great American Bash 2008?
|
|
thecrusherwi
El Dandy
the Financially Responsible Man
Brawl For All
Posts: 7,663
|
Post by thecrusherwi on Jul 10, 2013 10:39:21 GMT -5
I don't get this fixation over clean losses. Heels aren't supposed to play fair. That's what I'm always wondering. Also, why do people think top guys should lose clean a lot (especially babyfaces)? I know wrestling is scripted, but it still has the the effect of real sports. The teams and athletes that we get excited about seeing and that we consider the best win a lot. That's why they're the best. No one is going get excited about the Detroit Lions because they have a lot of hard-fought, clean jobs.
|
|
spagett
Hank Scorpio
Great Job!
Posts: 5,649
|
Post by spagett on Jul 10, 2013 10:48:25 GMT -5
Let me get this straight. In the 8 years that Cena has been the top guys, he has been pinned cleanly more times than Hogan did during his 8 year run at the top of the WWF. That is what I am reading when I look at Andrew's post. You may be right. Overall, Cena loses alot more often than some people realize He's had about 10 times the televised matches than Hogan though. Hogan wrestled on PPV and on Saturday nights Main Event pretty much.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 10, 2013 11:01:05 GMT -5
You may be right. Overall, Cena loses alot more often than some people realize He's had about 10 times the televised matches than Hogan though. Hogan wrestled on PPV and on Saturday nights Main Event pretty much. Exactly. This also ties into why Cena's run at the top is so "stale;" not solely because of how long it's been, but how nearly everything over the past 8 years has been about Cena, in an era when wrestling is on multiple times every week and gets heavily promoted with online material. It's not like the Hogan era where he was a special attraction and it was a huge deal when he wrestled. Cena is a pervasive element in the WWE to a degree that no wrestler in WWE history has ever been.
|
|
Ben Wyatt
Crow T. Robot
Are You Gonna Go My Way?
I don't get it. At all. It's kind of a small horse, I mean what am I missing? Am I crazy?
Posts: 41,552
|
Post by Ben Wyatt on Jul 10, 2013 11:42:29 GMT -5
Cena (and others) being stale is a result of 2 major things:'star vs star' booking every week (as a result of the Monday Night Wars) and the amount of weekly television and PPV's.
I understand that we can't go back to the days of less TV and squash matches, but it would probably benifit the product over time.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 10, 2013 12:00:19 GMT -5
What's ironic about the Attitude Era is that people say it spawned the 'star vs star' match on free TV, with the writers craving ratings every week, and yet if you look at the records Austin rarely wrestled on free TV. He maybe had one match a month on Raw, two at the most, with the other weeks featuring him either backstage, cutting a promo or being at ringside doing commentary. And he very rarely wrestled on Heat.
|
|
The Ichi
Patti Mayonnaise
AGGRESSIVE Executive Janitor of the Third Floor Manager's Bathroom
Posts: 37,352
|
Post by The Ichi on Jul 10, 2013 12:28:41 GMT -5
Didn't Tensai beat him clean as a whistle on Raw last year?
|
|
|
Post by RowdyRobbyPiper on Jul 10, 2013 13:54:40 GMT -5
How many times was Hogan pinned clearly during his run, anyways? Warrior at Wrestlemania is the only one I can think of off the top of my head Ultimate Warrior @ Wrestlemania 6. He was pinned by Undertaker at Survivor Series '91 and by Flair at an MSG Ouse show, but they were both screwjobs.
|
|
|
Post by angryfan on Jul 10, 2013 14:38:53 GMT -5
I don't get this fixation over clean losses. Heels aren't supposed to play fair. That's what I'm always wondering. Also, why do people think top guys should lose clean a lot (especially babyfaces)? I know wrestling is scripted, but it still has the the effect of real sports. The teams and athletes that we get excited about seeing and that we consider the best win a lot. That's why they're the best. No one is going get excited about the Detroit Lions because they have a lot of hard-fought, clean jobs. Heard a great interview with James Mitchell talking about babyfaces and what they've become, and frankly I think it has merit here. Mitchell noted that babyfaces used to be all about clean living and do the right thing, but now they've all become nWo-ized (my prhasing) and want to be the cool badass. He also noted they were more about fair play and competition (kayfabe notwithstanding) and it wasn't all about channelling Muhammed Ali. Now, that's ALL a babyface does. Best in the world, better than you, the champ is here, all of it, it's self-agrandizing and a total heel move. The heel is supposed to tell you he's the cat's ass, then cheat to prove it. The babyface is supposed to say "I'll give it everything I have" then when he wins he puts over his opponent as worthy. WHen he loses, he says "well, it wasn't my day, I'll get them next time". Hogan was the first top babyface to NOT be like that, since he'd show anger and yes cheat if need be. Thus, when he turned heel the only difference was "screw the fans". Nothing else changed. Cena, frankly, is the same. He wins and it's "the champ is here" and ballyhoo galore. Look at when he beat the Rock and was told about the rematch clause. "I already beat him, what is this once in a lifetime best of 3?" So he loses clean, more tahn Hogan, but the big difference is he's around far more often. He loses clean to guys who, face or heel, are the same underlying character as him, with the only difference being are they "I love the fans" or "I hate the fans". He loses more than Hogan, more than Sammartino or anyone else, but he's not the same type of babyface, bu that's more about volume than "doing too many jobs". If I work one televised even every 2 months, and I don't lose for 2 years, the casual fans who don't keep track of house show results will be amazed by how long I went without losing, clean or not. Thing is, that's a 12 match winning streak. 2 years for Hogan without a loss is the same as 2 to 3 months for Cena at the absolute most. Hogan lost to Savage at Mania 4, then had a clean loss to Warrior at Mania 6. 2 years, but figure 4 PPV's and let's say 3 televised matches on free TV, just as a ballpark. 14 televised matches. So if Cena wins at Mania, then again at Payback, and has a few wins in between, he's half way to the Hogan number but does it in maybe 1/16 the time. Long ramble, not even sure it'll make sense, but throwing it up here because, well, I don't feel like delting it all.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 10, 2013 14:43:37 GMT -5
Shield did it.
|
|
|
Post by Cvslfc123 on Jul 10, 2013 15:30:20 GMT -5
Didn't Tensai beat him clean as a whistle on Raw last year? No, he spat mist in his eyes before hitting the Baldo Bomb.
|
|