Fundertaker
El Dandy
Hideo Kojima should direct every ending ever!
Posts: 8,937
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Post by Fundertaker on Sept 4, 2015 10:41:45 GMT -5
Actually Nakamura is really tall for a Japanese guy. Not Takayama/Nagao/Baba/Taue tall, but still pretty tall. Okada is tall too. The thing is that they don't have big masses of muscle so they seem smaller in comparison to many american wrestlers. Like, go watch Wrestle Kingdom 2 and see how bloated Nakamura was there. Much prefer him to be this nimble, rubber like guy he is now.
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Post by basicdugganomix on Sept 4, 2015 10:47:45 GMT -5
I have been on the nakamura train since he first won the iwgp title
I like how the landslide is his burning hammer move that he busts out in big time matches
What i am saying is smaller guys can main event and i want to see guys like Kushida go up against shibata. I want makabe to go heads up with kenny omega.
I mean aj styles is a small guy and he's been iwgp champ twice.
Tanahashi isn't that big either.
So yeah i mean the jr heavy title can exist why not. But the jr tag in this tag scene makes zero sense.
The combination blooms each tag division which has been lacking since the nineties.
You combine the divisions you get more bang for your buck, you inter mingle both rosters.
I mean the bucks are taller than aj
Ishii is a very small dude, but they let him be seen as competitive with big names.
A jr tag division makes no sense for the lack of teams and everybody already winning the titles.
I would think two guys who have made the already story driven njpw and american friendly njpw into a more wwe like product even havin women matches. Something unheard of (besides chyna/chono)
I love how jado/gedo are breaking down the dumb traditions in puro
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PL23
AC Slater
Posts: 101
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Post by PL23 on Sept 5, 2015 4:54:03 GMT -5
I'd hate to see the tag belts unified. It would be another spit in the face of Japanese tradition by Jado and Gedo. There are weight limits for a reason in Japan. If you made the Junior division anywhere near relevant, it would alleviate the issue. Nah, stupid idea. It's probably pretty difficult to do when Japanese tradition dictates that junior divisions are completely inferior to the heavyweight ones, to the point where reaching a heavyweight stature is considered a graduation. It doesn't though, that's just something that happened post 2000 when Choshu booked Liger to demolish the entire division (including squashing Kanemoto in 6 minutes at the Dome) before himself being soundly beaten by the then IWGP Champion Kensuke Sasaki. It ruined the standing of the division in the fans eyes. Historically, in New Japan, the Jr. division does mean something. In the 90's, they were so good, and were such a draw that New Japan were able to do Jr. Heavyweight standalone shows.
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Post by berlynwright on Sept 5, 2015 6:13:21 GMT -5
The Young Bucks (Nick & Matt) were on observer few days ago.
- Okada recommended them to NJPW when they were looking for Jr.Tag team due to their acquaintance in TNA (Okada was Okato & Bucks were Gen.Me) - the reDRagon match at G1 final was their favorite with them in NJPW - they spent good chunk of minutes discussing AJ Styles and 6 man tags - they don't think they will ever be in WWE
Also spoke in length about PWG, which unfortunately i have no idea since i don't follow it.
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chrom
Backup Wench
Master of the rare undecuple post
Posts: 84,928
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Post by chrom on Sept 5, 2015 7:06:40 GMT -5
Due to a Neck injury he suffered during the G1, Yujiro has been pulled from all shows including the Destruction events
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Post by basicdugganomix on Sept 5, 2015 13:39:29 GMT -5
It's probably pretty difficult to do when Japanese tradition dictates that junior divisions are completely inferior to the heavyweight ones, to the point where reaching a heavyweight stature is considered a graduation. It doesn't though, that's just something that happened post 2000 when Choshu booked Liger to demolish the entire division (including squashing Kanemoto in 6 minutes at the Dome) before himself being soundly beaten by the then IWGP Champion Kensuke Sasaki. It ruined the standing of the division in the fans eyes. Historically, in New Japan, the Jr. division does mean something. In the 90's, they were so good, and were such a draw that New Japan were able to do Jr. Heavyweight standalone shows. Jr matches are mostly preliminary matches that really don't mean much The tag belts were created in 97 and have never meant anything I want the talent to mix it up. Hell tanahashi wants to work with redragon. You never read about chono wanting to work koji kanemoto I want the barriers down Aj is shorter than the young bucks and is a cruierweight. He is njpw's main event heel. The juniors haven't meant anything since the 90s.
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PL23
AC Slater
Posts: 101
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Post by PL23 on Sept 5, 2015 13:40:50 GMT -5
Both tag divisions are weak because of the divide. Also this would clear more contenders for the jr title itself. As far as modern product i do believe noah, new japan, and dragon gate have shown cruiserweights can mix it up with heavies. I mean Okada isn't that big of a guy. Neither is nakamura. Kenta and MARUfuji main evented noah. Ibushi graduated to heavyweight. The tag division is weak. The divide with jrs and heavies makes for less of a mixup in the talent. I would love to see guys like Omega face off with Ishii. The comedy tag of Taguchi and Honma would be so great The use of jrs in preliminary roles is ok, but the point of a smaller team is that they have the speed advantage over the heavies. Like a match of Meiyu Tag vs REdragon would be mucho bueno Okada is a 'big guy' though in terms of his height. That kind of stuff means something in Japan historically. It's all 'size' not just bulk. Nakamura is definitely a big guy because of his height. He'd be a heavyweight in any era. KENTA and Marufuji main evented NOAH in one of the worst Budokan shows that company ever ran. They were not, and never proved to be a draw at all. Two Jr.'s fighting for the GHC Heavyweight Title devalued that belt, at a point where it was already questionable. Also, you really can't quote Dragon Gate when talking about meaningful wrestling. It does not follow tradition, and has a very different 'fanbase' to other companies. It's also barely wrestling. I understand the idea because in American wrestling this would be fine, but it just doesn't fly in Japan.
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PL23
AC Slater
Posts: 101
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Post by PL23 on Sept 5, 2015 13:50:15 GMT -5
Jr matches are mostly preliminary matches that really don't mean much The tag belts were created in 97 and have never meant anything I want the talent to mix it up. Hell tanahashi wants to work with redragon. You never read about chono wanting to work koji kanemoto I want the barriers down The tag belts have meant something. They meant a lot around 2003 when the super team of Liger and Kanemoto were defending them in the feud against NOAH in some fantastic Jr. matches. Now the Jr. matches are preliminary matches, but it wasn't always this way. Jr. wrestling in Japan draws when done properly and treated as important. Michinoku Pro-Wrestling ran Sumo Hall in the 90's, which is ridiculous for an indy of M-Pro's size. Jr. Heavyweights were the best thing in Japanese wrestling in the 1990's. Liger, Kanemoto, Sasuke, Delfin, Naniwa, Togo, Minoru, Ultimo, Hayabusa. It's literally a who's who from the decade. That's only some of them as well. I would bet money on Chono wanting to work with Kanemoto, how on Earth would you read about that? These are not 'barriers', this is tradition, and it means a lot in Japan. I do not know one instance of a Jr. Heavyweight winning a Heavyweight Title ever doing any good. By that logic, Liger would be a 10 time IWGP Heavyweight Champion, because he was so popular. The Jr's meant something again during Devitt's rise to acedom. Unfortunately, Bullet Club happened, and it happened badly. AJ Styles is a heavyweight in terms of bulk. You can't put him in the same bracket as the Bucks. Riki Choshu was short and stocky too, was he a Junior?
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Post by Mondai Rogue on Sept 5, 2015 14:27:59 GMT -5
Both tag divisions are weak because of the divide. Also this would clear more contenders for the jr title itself. As far as modern product i do believe noah, new japan, and dragon gate have shown cruiserweights can mix it up with heavies. I mean Okada isn't that big of a guy. Neither is nakamura. Kenta and MARUfuji main evented noah. Ibushi graduated to heavyweight. The tag division is weak. The divide with jrs and heavies makes for less of a mixup in the talent. I would love to see guys like Omega face off with Ishii. The comedy tag of Taguchi and Honma would be so great The use of jrs in preliminary roles is ok, but the point of a smaller team is that they have the speed advantage over the heavies. Like a match of Meiyu Tag vs REdragon would be mucho bueno Also, you really can't quote Dragon Gate when talking about meaningful wrestling. It does not follow tradition, and has a very different 'fanbase' to other companies. It's also barely wrestling. Dragon Gate isn't "barely wrestling". It's pretty good if you enjoy that style. Backyard stuff is barely wrestling, Dragon Gate is just a different style than what is on offer in the likes of NJPW & NOAH.
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Post by Starshine on Sept 5, 2015 16:15:36 GMT -5
Both tag divisions are weak because of the divide. Also this would clear more contenders for the jr title itself. As far as modern product i do believe noah, new japan, and dragon gate have shown cruiserweights can mix it up with heavies. I mean Okada isn't that big of a guy. Neither is nakamura. Kenta and MARUfuji main evented noah. Ibushi graduated to heavyweight. The tag division is weak. The divide with jrs and heavies makes for less of a mixup in the talent. I would love to see guys like Omega face off with Ishii. The comedy tag of Taguchi and Honma would be so great The use of jrs in preliminary roles is ok, but the point of a smaller team is that they have the speed advantage over the heavies. Like a match of Meiyu Tag vs REdragon would be mucho bueno Also, you really can't quote Dragon Gate when talking about meaningful wrestling. It does not follow tradition, and has a very different 'fanbase' to other companies. It's also barely wrestling. Oh please. You're welcome to have different opinions. But actually have a clue about what you're talking about.
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Post by TOK Hehe'd Around & Found Out on Sept 5, 2015 17:22:42 GMT -5
Also, you really can't quote Dragon Gate when talking about meaningful wrestling. It does not follow tradition, and has a very different 'fanbase' to other companies. It's also barely wrestling. Oh please. You're welcome to have different opinions. But actually have a clue about what you're talking about. How is DragonGate not wrestling? Granted I've never really gotten into it, but its more along the lines of Lucha than Puro.
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Post by basicdugganomix on Sept 6, 2015 2:49:32 GMT -5
The tradition of puro has always been broken by new japan
Their best drawing champ in years is a small cruiserweight named aj styles
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Post by Magic knows Black Lives Matter on Sept 6, 2015 9:14:00 GMT -5
I've decided to join the New Japan Master Race and finally got a subscription to New Japan World.
Man, this site is confusing the hell out of me, haha. Even on the English version of the site, I'm having trouble figuring out what's where. I THINK I'm watching the latest show now. This is gonna take some adjusting to.
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PL23
AC Slater
Posts: 101
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Post by PL23 on Sept 6, 2015 10:19:42 GMT -5
Oh please. You're welcome to have different opinions. But actually have a clue about what you're talking about. Fair enough. To me it's just not Toryumon, and all the fun and uniqueness of that promotion was sucked out into neverending faction warfare, and the matches are very flippy with a distinct lack of proper selling. That's my opinion though, you are more than entitled to yours. I'm a huge fan of shoot style, and that is definitely an acquired taste. Still though, I will maintain you can't really apply Dragon Gate to the example of mixing heavyweights and Jr.'s, when it was started by Ultimo Dragon, and has been almost entirely Jr. Heavyweights throughout its history. It also exists on it's own island somewhat, it isn't 'mainstream' puroresu (I don't mean that as an insult). The best example of weight mixing would be UWFi, but that was booked as legit fighting, rather than professional wrestling, and that promotion went out of business long ago. HUSTLE is another example, and that.... didn't go well. No it hasn't. Sure they've pushed the boat out with angles such as nWo Japan in the past, but they've stuck to the traditions, and through good booking drew by far the biggest crowds in the 1990's. When they did break tradition when Inoki lost his mind, the company almost collapsed.
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Post by basicdugganomix on Sept 6, 2015 15:01:37 GMT -5
The fact is junior tag duvision is 3 teams and the heavy division is just bullet club
You combine it and the tag scene goes to the races
Small guys can main event
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chrom
Backup Wench
Master of the rare undecuple post
Posts: 84,928
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Post by chrom on Sept 8, 2015 13:03:38 GMT -5
For those interested, here's a documentary on the New Japan Dojo and renovations that has been made to it.
Liger loves his Godzillas
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chrom
Backup Wench
Master of the rare undecuple post
Posts: 84,928
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Post by chrom on Sept 10, 2015 10:44:00 GMT -5
Match listing for tomorrow's show on New Japan World
Yohei Komatsu vs David Finlay
Jushin Thunder Liger and Tiger Mask vs Jay White and Sho Tanaka
Blue Justice, Mascara Dorada, Ryusuke Taguchi, and Juice Robinson vs RPG Vice, Gedo, Yoshi-Hashi, and Toru Yano
Kazuchika Okada and Kazushi Sakuraba vs Cody Hall and Tama Tonga
Tencozy, Kushida, and Hiroshi Tanahashi vs Doc Gallows, Karl Anderson, Kenny Omega, and Bad Luck Fale
Katsuyori Shibata and Togi Makabe vs Kota Ibushi and Tetsuya Naito
Tomoaki Honma and Hirooki Goto vs Tomohiro Ishii and Shinsuke Nakamura.
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chrom
Backup Wench
Master of the rare undecuple post
Posts: 84,928
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Post by chrom on Sept 12, 2015 7:19:13 GMT -5
Ayumi Nakamura will be performing a live rendition of Minoru Suzuki's theme, Kaze Ni Nare, next week for his entrance for his Title Defense of The GHC Heavyweight title against Takashi Sugiura.
This is not the first time she's performed it live as she's also previously done it before the most recent at his WK7 match against Yuji Nagata.
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Fundertaker
El Dandy
Hideo Kojima should direct every ending ever!
Posts: 8,937
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Post by Fundertaker on Sept 13, 2015 11:14:55 GMT -5
Ayumi Nakamura will be performing a live rendition of Minoru Suzuki's theme, Kaze Ni Nare, next week for his entrance for his Title Defense of The GHC Heavyweight title against Takashi Sugiura. This is not the first time she's performed it live as she's also previously done it before the most recent at his WK7 match against Yuji Nagata. Best non Shinskewl entrance in WK history.
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Post by The Kevstaaa on Sept 13, 2015 17:55:19 GMT -5
Enjoyed the Road to Destruction shows. Nothing groundbreaking since they were house shows, but still fun. It's the first time I've been exposed to their house shows being aired since I got NJPW World after Dominion. I also had it for a month for WK9. Really loving it and have been reviewing a bunch of stuff.
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