JoDaNa1281
Crow T. Robot
Jackie Daytona, Regular Human Bartender. #BLM
Posts: 40,713
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Post by JoDaNa1281 on Oct 26, 2013 18:33:00 GMT -5
Considering Jeff Jarrett is suppose to bring 2 TNA guys with him to Wrestle-1, I wouldn't be shocked if Styles is one of the guys chosen. The point being is because of the rule TNA made about wrestlers not being able to work any promotion that does ippvs, dvds, and tv unless it's a dark match. Those previously mention companies live and die from dvd and ippv sales. AJ's price tag isn't cheap nor will pay itself off just for a dark match. Plus Styles' indy stock isn't as high as it used to be due to that rule by TNA. Years ago, it would be reality. Now, fantasy. Maybe TNA will let that rule go for this storyline, allowing AJ to work for promotions that do ippvs, tv, etc.(and I'm pretty sure they don't have a problem with their wrestlers doing dvds for other promotions, since some of their wrestlers have done them).
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Glitch
King Koopa
Not Going To Die; Childs, we're goin' out to give Blair the test. If he tries to make it back here and we're not with him... burn him.
Watching you.
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Post by Glitch on Oct 26, 2013 18:37:33 GMT -5
Considering Jeff Jarrett is suppose to bring 2 TNA guys with him to Wrestle-1, I wouldn't be shocked if Styles is one of the guys chosen. The point being is because of the rule TNA made about wrestlers not being able to work any promotion that does ippvs, dvds, and tv unless it's a dark match. Those previously mention companies live and die from dvd and ippv sales. AJ's price tag isn't cheap nor will pay itself off just for a dark match. Plus Styles' indy stock isn't as high as it used to be due to that rule by TNA. Years ago, it would be reality. Now, fantasy. Maybe TNA will let that rule go for this storyline, allowing AJ to work for promotions that do ippvs, tv, etc.(and I'm pretty sure they don't have a problem with their wrestlers doing dvds for other promotions, since some of their wrestlers have done them). If both parties in a contract agree to it, can't they basically do what ever they want? I mean, AJ defending the title in other places is part of the story set up by tna's booking. It's not like AJ himself is actually defying the company.
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Post by 01010010 01101001 01100011 on Oct 26, 2013 18:45:02 GMT -5
Maybe TNA will let that rule go for this storyline, allowing AJ to work for promotions that do ippvs, tv, etc.(and I'm pretty sure they don't have a problem with their wrestlers doing dvds for other promotions, since some of their wrestlers have done them). If both parties in a contract agree to it, can't they basically do what ever they want? I mean, AJ defending the title in other places is part of the story set up by tna's booking. It's not like AJ himself is actually defying the company. Yeah, it could be waived but ROH and TNA still don't get along, I don't know when Gabe's next show is but I don't see him booking or being allowed to book someone over (I mean in importance, not necessarily a match) the DGUSA champ and PWG isn't running again until Dec. so that goes back to the only options being micro-indies that no one knows about or maybe CZW.
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Post by ________ has left the building on Oct 26, 2013 18:47:28 GMT -5
Considering Jeff Jarrett is suppose to bring 2 TNA guys with him to Wrestle-1, I wouldn't be shocked if Styles is one of the guys chosen. The point being is because of the rule TNA made about wrestlers not being able to work any promotion that does ippvs, dvds, and tv unless it's a dark match. Those previously mention companies live and die from dvd and ippv sales. AJ's price tag isn't cheap nor will pay itself off just for a dark match. Plus Styles' indy stock isn't as high as it used to be due to that rule by TNA. Years ago, it would be reality. Now, fantasy. Maybe TNA will let that rule go for this storyline, allowing AJ to work for promotions that do ippvs, tv, etc.(and I'm pretty sure they don't have a problem with their wrestlers doing dvds for other promotions, since some of their wrestlers have done them). The rule change came into effect around the time Chavo Guerrero joined them. Chavo had to cancel an indy appearance because of that change. Even if TNA waived this for him, his booking price is going to way too high for most indy promotions. That's the reason why you don't see TNA guys taking many bookings during this they aren't on the road. Even a guy like Robbie E's price is higher than a mid range independent wrestler. The money spent on bringing in AJ to put him and TNA over could be spent on someone who won't cost you an arm and a leg. International promotions are money marks enough to play along. Mutoh's new company would do it. Ring Of Honor won't. Their parent company won't sign off on that.
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Reflecto
Hank Scorpio
The Sorceress' Knight
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Post by Reflecto on Oct 26, 2013 19:12:15 GMT -5
AJ styles sitting front row at Raw on the opposite side of the tv hard camera where he WOULD be seen I would not bet against this because whats to stop him from purchasing a ticket and just sitting front row and watching the show? of course in context we all know the reason this would be happening but I don't see anything preventing TNA from doin it and quite frankly would be the absoloute smartest thing they could do. They should do it and WWE should send Punk out to make fun of him for 10 minutes. And every commercial break. Even if they did, TNA would be smart to do that- but WWE's not exactly stupid either- they knew ECW's invasion storyline, plus WWE has talked a number of times about their contingency plan during the "DX invades Nitro" angle if WCW had some wrestlers do the same thing to Raw (merely invite them in and not mention it.) In all likeliness, WWE would be smart enough to show AJ Styles just enough to make it backfire on TNA, then quickly invite him backstage and get him off camera so he's not the story.
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AdamAFL was sooooo wrong
Hank Scorpio
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Post by AdamAFL was sooooo wrong on Oct 26, 2013 19:18:15 GMT -5
Maybe TNA will let that rule go for this storyline, allowing AJ to work for promotions that do ippvs, tv, etc.(and I'm pretty sure they don't have a problem with their wrestlers doing dvds for other promotions, since some of their wrestlers have done them). The rule change came into effect around the time Chavo Guerrero joined them. Chavo had to cancel an indy appearance because of that change. Even if TNA waived this for him, his booking price is going to way too high for most indy promotions. That's the reason why you don't see TNA guys taking many bookings during this they aren't on the road. Even a guy like Robbie E's price is higher than a mid range independent wrestler. The money spent on bringing in AJ to put him and TNA over could be spent on someone who won't cost you an arm and a leg. International promotions are money marks enough to play along. Mutoh's new company would do it. Ring Of Honor won't. Their parent company won't sign off on that. If it's part of the storyline I'd imagine TNA will pay a portion of AJ's fee in order to use snippets of footage on Impact so I don't think booking fees are going to be an issue. That is if they want to make this as legit as possible. The issue is how far are TNA prepared to go with this angle, and personally I don't think they'll go very far with it. Although I'd love them to, I mean AJ turning up at Glory By Honor tonight would be insane. Don't think it's going to happen though sadly.
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Post by jimmyjames on Oct 26, 2013 23:10:32 GMT -5
AJ styles sitting front row at Raw on the opposite side of the tv hard camera where he WOULD be seen I would not bet against this because whats to stop him from purchasing a ticket and just sitting front row and watching the show? of course in context we all know the reason this would be happening but I don't see anything preventing TNA from doin it and quite frankly would be the absoloute smartest thing they could do. They should do it and WWE should send Punk out to make fun of him for 10 minutes. And every commercial break. And that's why it isn't going to happen. Although Dixie seems to be of the "any publicity is good publicity" school, and let's be honest, any mention of anything TNA related on Raw would be the biggest publicity TNA is received in years, so never say never. If Punk did have a chance to crap on TNA with a live mic, it would make his confrontation with the fat guy in Anaheim seem like a greeting from a Wal-Mart greeter.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2013 23:19:33 GMT -5
Not going to lie AJ buying a ticket to Raw and sitting opposite the hard camera would be hilarious because a) most fans would have no clue who he is and b) he'd probably have the TNA title with him and JBL would make fan of that dopey looking hillbilly fan for being a belt mark at which point the King would make a crack about how he needs to mark for a better title.
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Glitch
King Koopa
Not Going To Die; Childs, we're goin' out to give Blair the test. If he tries to make it back here and we're not with him... burn him.
Watching you.
Posts: 12,722
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Post by Glitch on Oct 27, 2013 14:09:19 GMT -5
If AJ showed up in the audience of a Raw show, I wonder if Vince would be low enough to have security detain him, and take the title. Then have Orton toss the belt in a trash can and say "some audience brought garbage in here."
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Post by jrev1313 on Oct 27, 2013 14:32:17 GMT -5
If AJ showed up to RAW with the title, I'm guessing WWE would care so little that they'd more than likely just ignore it instead of giving TNA some actual free publicity. It would also depend on the market. If they did this in a more smark heavy market then that might be a problem but to me this would reek of Shane Douglas' idea that failed horribly and was embarrassing. If WWE can take away signs and cover up t-shirts without repercussions, then there's no point to this because they would find a way to make AJ keep his title down or throw him out and if he makes a commotion, I don't really think that's gonna do much of anything for TNA. I don't see AJ being that guy either.
As for this being a copycat gimmick. I think there's a difference between reusing a gimmick with your own twist and simply rehashing the same angle and the same roles but going one step further. Think of it like this, if you're at a talent show and see a performer on stage who is doing the same exact routine you saw a few acts ago but tosses in an extra spin, that's still the same act with something small thrown in not long after you just seen it. On the other hand, if it borrows one or two qualities but has a lot of it's own unique features that make it stand out, then it's not going to draw as many comparisons.
Someone brought up WWE copying some of WCW's angles but even when they did, the characters were drastically different and it wasn't done in the same exact way. Except the light heavyweight division but being fair, most wrestling fans never thought that compared to WCW's anyways so you can say that pretty much failed in trying to be a copycat (I don't quite agree but as far as I know a majority would). If Vince McMahon simply turned heel and joined a rebellious stable like DX, then they would have easily been ripping off WCW. Instead, the only similarities between Vince and Bischoff is that they were both heel authority figures. You can make a checklist of qualities of the Punk angle and in comparing it to AJ, most of the major qualities would be checked off from the contract expiring to him threatening to take the title with him to bashing the company and it's owner.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2013 14:53:40 GMT -5
This angle in particular is not one you can just re-do. It was built in large part due to CM Punk's perceived volatility, and the intrigue surrouding his seemingly imminent departure. When he won the triple threat match on Raw to get the title shot, and announced his contract was up the day after MITB, some people believed it. There had been rumors about his contract expiring dating back to the beginning of the year. Then when he delivered the shoot, it was so good that it felt real, or at least we wanted to believe it was real.
Even if AJ did a better job with the promos, it still wouldn't have any juice, because it's so obviously a re-hash of what was a very unique situation.
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Post by ________ has left the building on Oct 29, 2013 15:32:33 GMT -5
And the first stop on the Fall of Styles tour is AAA. He will defending it this Sunday against a opponent to be determined.
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Post by gnr123 on Oct 29, 2013 17:58:24 GMT -5
Here's the thing though, even though if he does go to another indy company, it's no going t crate as much buzz as the CM Punk storyline because the Punk storyline was big. And it was in WWE. Sure, TNA can have him wrestler in all the other indy companies, it still won't make a difference, nobody will care outside of TNA marks.
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Post by Djm Doesn't Find You Funny on Oct 29, 2013 21:49:52 GMT -5
Well, TNA did it, so it is therefore stupid and wrong as most would say.
That said, they are doing something a bit more bold and actually having AJ wrestle elsewhere, and in Mexico for that matter...that's risky.
Also, in the same way Punk was so anti-WWE-status-quo-narrative, AJ is so purely TNA against what Dixie, Hulk Hogan and Eric Bischoff have tried to do with the company, that it is an interesting twist. There is no one more identifiable with the positives of TNA than AJ Styles, so he's the guy to put the company back on the track people seem to want it on.
In that aspect, it works. But since it's TNA, it's stupid and sucks.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2013 22:45:39 GMT -5
I have a few problems with the angle.
First: The players involved. AJ Styles has been terrible on the mic during all of this, he's not Punk and more importantly, Dixie isn't Vince. It's like the Asylum mockbuster of the original story.
Second: Bound For Glory 2013 was no MITB 2011.
Third: It's 2013... The Summer Of Punk happened in 2011. Two years is not enough time for fans to separate the angles from each other.
Fourth: The idea of AJ Styles defending the TNA Title around the world isn't as compelling as Punk possibly doing the same with the WWE Title. The WWE is THE BUSINESS, they exist in their own realm high above every other wrestling promotion. The idea that Punk would take the most prestigious title in the world and the billion dollar entity that is WWE would be helpless to stop him, was truly fascinating. TNA isn't on the level to where this feels like a high stakes situation.
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Post by 01010010 01101001 01100011 on Oct 29, 2013 22:59:45 GMT -5
Well, TNA did it, so it is therefore stupid and wrong as most would say. That said, they are doing something a bit more bold and actually having AJ wrestle elsewhere, and in Mexico for that matter...that's risky. Also, in the same way Punk was so anti-WWE-status-quo-narrative, AJ is so purely TNA against what Dixie, Hulk Hogan and Eric Bischoff have tried to do with the company, that it is an interesting twist. There is no one more identifiable with the positives of TNA than AJ Styles, so he's the guy to put the company back on the track people seem to want it on. In that aspect, it works. But since it's TNA, it's stupid and sucks. How is it risky to have him wrestle for a company TNA is partnered with, where their part owner and head of talent relations still wrestles on occasion, against a former TNA wrestler in Mesias?
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Shark
Hank Scorpio
The world's only Samurai Ninja Pirate
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Post by Shark on Oct 29, 2013 23:16:01 GMT -5
While it does make a lot of sense and I am glad TNA is doing that as at least it makes their angle a little different then when WWE did it, the problem though is that it's not really going to mean anything. TNA can't really mention these matches without making it obvious this is a fake angle. Plus no one is really going to see these matches so it's not like this is really gonna give TNA more attention. It's a good idea, but because it's TNA, it's not gonna really mean anything.
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SOR
Unicron
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Post by SOR on Oct 30, 2013 6:56:14 GMT -5
It's easier to book someone else's angles in hindsight than come up with a new twist to an old standby. Let's face it, TNA has a problem of using other wrestling promotions storylines and just changing the names of the characters instead of rewriting the script. Aces and Eight was one of the long attempts by TNA to recreate the NWO. What made the Summer of Punk 2 worked because the lead character and supporting were interesting and involved in a situation rare in WWE. Punk made only one indy appearance in AIW and WWE pulled that footage of him putting over Gregory Iron. AJ Styles does not have the aura and acting chops to pull off this part of the storyline. Dixie Carter can't act for shit and should be nowhere out front as she is. Styles defends the belt in some small indy and then what? TNA going to air the footage or acknowledge it therefore killing he suppose to be rebelling and hated by Dixie. This is same exact copy but diluted and not as interesting. In what ways were Aces and Eights similar to nWo? They were both heel stables. Legitimately all I can think of.
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Post by ________ has left the building on Oct 30, 2013 7:14:12 GMT -5
It's easier to book someone else's angles in hindsight than come up with a new twist to an old standby. Let's face it, TNA has a problem of using other wrestling promotions storylines and just changing the names of the characters instead of rewriting the script. Aces and Eight was one of the long attempts by TNA to recreate the NWO. What made the Summer of Punk 2 worked because the lead character and supporting were interesting and involved in a situation rare in WWE. Punk made only one indy appearance in AIW and WWE pulled that footage of him putting over Gregory Iron. AJ Styles does not have the aura and acting chops to pull off this part of the storyline. Dixie Carter can't act for shit and should be nowhere out front as she is. Styles defends the belt in some small indy and then what? TNA going to air the footage or acknowledge it therefore killing he suppose to be rebelling and hated by Dixie. This is same exact copy but diluted and not as interesting. In what ways were Aces and Eights similar to nWo? They were both heel stables. Legitimately all I can think of. Both were super stables who tried to take over the host promotions, unveiled secret members who helped them infiltrate and gain power, used mass gang attacks, and increased the number of members to the point it became water downed. It would be one thing if A&8 just wanted to win titles. But they wanted to control TNA and rebuild it in their own image. Luckily, we never got to the point it was called TNA/AN8 Wrestling. The real difference between them and the NWO is the NWO had way more credible members before the pledge drive.
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Post by Djm Doesn't Find You Funny on Oct 30, 2013 7:24:19 GMT -5
A few questions.
1. Was anyone expecting CM Punk to defend the WWE Title outside of WWE? 2. Aside from "It's not WWE", why isn't AJ defending the title in a major promotion in Mexico being seen as significant? And again, I want an answer that is different from "Because it's not WWE", because that could be applied to any and every single thing TNA has ever done, does now, or will ever do, and if that's the case, nothing they do should even be discussed because they're not WWE. /discussion
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