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Post by Some Baritone guy IS REDEEMED! on Jan 23, 2014 17:50:20 GMT -5
I've watched a couple of theses recently and I've been wondering a few things.
1.) In the Colt Cabana Bryan Danielson match (Which is severely underrated if you ask me) they made sure to specify in the ring introductions that if one man had a fall and the other didn't by the time the time limit expired they would win the title, Is that not usually the case?
2.) Can a title change hands if one of the falls is won by DQ?
Also what are some good 2/3 falls matches you'd reccomend
I'm again going to say Colt Cabana vs Bryan Danielson
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Post by Oh Cry Me a Screwball on Jan 23, 2014 17:52:39 GMT -5
Generally, these rules are dependent on whatever the promotion says.
I know there are some late 80s WWF matches where titles did not change hands because one of the falls was a DQ, but I'm certain there are examples of the inverse out as well.
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AdamAFL was sooooo wrong
Hank Scorpio
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Post by AdamAFL was sooooo wrong on Jan 23, 2014 18:24:53 GMT -5
Sheamus won his 2/3 Falls match with Dragon at Extreme Rules after winning the first fall by DQ (an intentional DQ on Bryan's part too, which I loved) - not sure if there's ever been a match where the decisive fall has been a DQ though. I believe there was also an intentional DQ in the Lesnar/Angle SD Ironman match from '03-ish but obviously that's not a 2/3 Falls match. Same principle though.
As for 2/3 Falls matches I'd recommend:
- The aforementioned Sheamus/Daniel Bryan match
- Triple H vs. Stone Cold (No Way Out '01 - called a 3 Stages of Hell match which is basically just a glorified 2/3 Falls Match)
- Flair vs. Steamboat - Clash of the Champions VI (I believe but don't quote me on that)
- London vs. Dragon - The Epic Encounter
Struggling to think of any others that were particularly great to be honest. It is one of my favourite match types but it's all about how the wrestlers approach it. For example, Danielson and McGuinness had a 2/3 Falls match which, while it wasn't bad, was poor by their ridiculously high standards because they seemed to stall for a lot of the match and it was quite easy to tell they were going to go to a 60-minute draw fairly early on. On the other hand Austin and HHH paced it perfectly for their Three Stages of Hell match and it was magnificent, even the ending - as maligned as it was at the time - seemed spot on to me (although, as a kid, I was devastated Austin lost at the time).
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chazraps
Wade Wilson
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Post by chazraps on Jan 23, 2014 18:26:25 GMT -5
I'm again going to say Colt Cabana vs Bryan Danielson I adore this match so very, very much. Absolute perfection, brought out the best in both men in front of one of the all time great ROH crowds. That entire event is bell-to-bell outstanding and is probably overshadowed because it was a transitional event between the year's two biggest storylines. As for the your questions: 1) I'm pretty sure that rule might have just been for that match to add to the story going into it. I could be very wrong though. 2) Usually no. There was a Dolph-Kofi where Kofi won the final fall by DQ but didn't get the belt. I think it might usually come down to what the final determining fall is. |
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chazraps
Wade Wilson
Better have my money when I come-a collect!
Posts: 27,986
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Post by chazraps on Jan 23, 2014 18:27:25 GMT -5
Oh, and of course, the Sami Zayn 2/3 fall matches this year in NXT are among the all time best.
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Post by HisRoyalGreeness on Jan 23, 2014 19:19:25 GMT -5
To answer your second question, apparently a title can change hands when one fall is a DQ. This happened in WCW when Dustin Rhodes won the US title from Steve Austin. Austin won the first fall. Rhodes won the second fall when Austin threw him over the top rope. Rhodes went on to win the third fall. Austin contested that he shouldn't have lost the title but ultimately Rhodes kept the belt.
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Capt Lunatic
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Post by Capt Lunatic on Jan 23, 2014 20:45:18 GMT -5
To answer your second question, apparently a title can change hands when one fall is a DQ. This happened in WCW when Dustin Rhodes won the US title from Steve Austin. Austin won the first fall. Rhodes won the second fall when Austin threw him over the top rope. Rhodes went on to win the third fall. Austin contested that he shouldn't have lost the title but ultimately Rhodes kept the belt. Flip that. Austin won the title from Rhodes. First fall was Rhodes DQ'd for throwing Austin over the top, then pinned him for the 2nd. It seems if the heel wins by dg/countout they win the title. If the face wins that way it does not count. |
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Post by HisRoyalGreeness on Jan 23, 2014 20:54:51 GMT -5
To answer your second question, apparently a title can change hands when one fall is a DQ. This happened in WCW when Dustin Rhodes won the US title from Steve Austin. Austin won the first fall. Rhodes won the second fall when Austin threw him over the top rope. Rhodes went on to win the third fall. Austin contested that he shouldn't have lost the title but ultimately Rhodes kept the belt. Flip that. Austin won the title from Rhodes. First fall was Rhodes DQ'd for throwing Austin over the top, then pinned him for the 2nd. It seems if the heel wins by dg/countout they win the title. If the face wins that way it does not count. My bad. I really thought I remembered that correctly. The rule does change depending on who's doing the booking really. |
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Post by Some Baritone guy IS REDEEMED! on Jan 23, 2014 21:00:17 GMT -5
I'm again going to say Colt Cabana vs Bryan Danielson I adore this match so very, very much. Absolute perfection, brought out the best in both men in front of one of the all time great ROH crowds. That entire event is bell-to-bell outstanding and is probably overshadowed because it was a transitional event between the year's two biggest storylines. As for the your questions: 1) I'm pretty sure that rule might have just been for that match to add to the story going into it. I could be very wrong though. 2) Usually no. There was a Dolph-Kofi where Kofi won the final fall by DQ but didn't get the belt. I think it might usually come down to what the final determining fall is. Reason I loved it so much is 1. Cabana looked like an absolute beast, and 2. Danielson managed to put on a really good match with a seperated shoulder for about 50 minutes. |
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Post by britishbulldog on Jan 24, 2014 1:03:17 GMT -5
WWF used to do it a lot with tag matches. Bulldogs had a ton.
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Post by lildude8218 on Jan 24, 2014 1:05:08 GMT -5
The Brain Busters won the tag titles in a 2 out of 3 falls match and one of the falls had a DQ in it.
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Post by HMARK Center on Jan 24, 2014 10:16:03 GMT -5
Agreed with all the love 2/3 falls matches get. It opens up so many avenues for wrestlers/bookers to get creative within a match-type that effectively demands excellence, and doesn't feel as constrictive as an Iron Man match.
The Cabana/Dragon match reminds me of how happy I was that they went out of their way to announce that. I wish in more storylines they'd have the wrestlers who are facing each other in a title match try to manipulate the stipulations; after all, if the whole idea is that they have to sign a contract to have the match at all, why not play into it that each man might want something different? So if Bryan Danielson knows he's great at taking a match to 60 minutes, he'd see fit to work in the "must get two falls before 60 minutes" stip added in.
From ROH, it makes me think of the Aries vs. Dragon 75 minute 2/3 falls match, and the streak the Briscoes went on where they never seemed to lose a fall.
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