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Post by Digital Witness on Mar 13, 2014 21:16:23 GMT -5
That's interesting. I knew that Dibiase was originally supposed to win, but I didn't know they originally had a different bracket. Assuming Rude/Roberts would have still ended in a draw and the Hogan/Andre would have ended with the same double DQ, was the original plan for Dibiase to face Don Muraco in the Finals? That would have sucked, because surely no one would have believed that Muraco could be WWF champion at that time, maybe 4 or 5 years prior, but not in 1988. Supposedly, the plan was for Hogan to beat Andre and then either Rude or Bravo in the semi's, while Dibiase would advance to the finals through cheating, buying wins and just plain lucky bye's. Then a relatively fresh Dibiase would beat an exhausted Hogan for the title at the end. That sounds like a damn good idea. I never much cared for the epic superman face business that the WWF was into at the time. I'd rather there have been a balance of face and heel champions, and DiBiase would have been the perfect heel to begin that. I'd have given DiBiase the strap at Wrestlemania IV, have him hold the belt for a year or two which was perfectly acceptable at the time while buying wins and buying heels off to pick his opponents off before the title match. Then Warrior or another face (maybe Dusty?) knocks off Dibiase and then we get either the Macho Man/Warrior or Macho Man/Dusty feud for the title which is where Savage gets his run. End Fantasy Booking.
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Post by The Varsity Club on Mar 15, 2014 2:42:36 GMT -5
Supposedly, the plan was for Hogan to beat Andre and then either Rude or Bravo in the semi's, while Dibiase would advance to the finals through cheating, buying wins and just plain lucky bye's. Then a relatively fresh Dibiase would beat an exhausted Hogan for the title at the end. That sounds like a damn good idea. I never much cared for the epic superman face business that the WWF was into at the time. I'd rather there have been a balance of face and heel champions, and DiBiase would have been the perfect heel to begin that. I'd have given DiBiase the strap at Wrestlemania IV, have him hold the belt for a year or two which was perfectly acceptable at the time while buying wins and buying heels off to pick his opponents off before the title match. Then Warrior or another face (maybe Dusty?) knocks off Dibiase and then we get either the Macho Man/Warrior or Macho Man/Dusty feud for the title which is where Savage gets his run. End Fantasy Booking. so dibiase didn't win the belt bc vince hated a heel winning belt at WM? Even if that was the case why couldn't of they had him win it at SummerSlam or next big ppv? What was the reason they never gave dibiase the belt at all. Also, did Savage and Steamboat also have a rematch at WMIV, if so how was the match. I don't remember it but I know it wasn't a classic like the previous year...strange the two best matches from WM3 were rematches the following year.
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Post by RowdyRobbyPiper on Mar 15, 2014 3:10:59 GMT -5
Steamboat jobbed to Greg Valentine in the first round so there was no Savage/Steamboat rematch on PPV.
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Cranjis McBasketball
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Mar 15, 2014 22:33:11 GMT -5
I can't get behind the idea or the logic that Savage won the top tier title because the midcard title holder refused to job. 1. Did Honky Tonk have the stroke to pull a power play like that? 2. How does one go from a planned IC title reign to winning the biggest championship in the company at a time when the average reign was several years long with guys like Hogan and Andre in the main event scene in a tournament that involved said main eventers on the biggest show of the year? That makes zero sense. Don't know the answer to the first. The IC was actually a pretty big deal back then. Savage probably would have played the challenger roll to DiBiase while Hogan was filming No Holds Barred. I think the issue, in addition to HTM not wanting to job to Savage, was that Vince hated having the heels go over on a PPV, especially Wrestlemania. Look at those early PPVs, how many times did a main event end with the heel winning. It took until Wrestlemania 16 before the WWF had a heel win the Main Event. Not exactly true, Andre's team went over Hogan's in the original Survivor Series main event. WM 2000 was the next time before a heel went over in the main.
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Post by OGBoardPoster2005 on Mar 15, 2014 22:46:33 GMT -5
Don't know the answer to the first. The IC was actually a pretty big deal back then. Savage probably would have played the challenger roll to DiBiase while Hogan was filming No Holds Barred. I think the issue, in addition to HTM not wanting to job to Savage, was that Vince hated having the heels go over on a PPV, especially Wrestlemania. Look at those early PPVs, how many times did a main event end with the heel winning. It took until Wrestlemania 16 before the WWF had a heel win the Main Event. Not exactly true, Andre's team went over Hogan's in the original Survivor Series main event. WM 2000 was the next time before a heel went over in the main. Flair in the 1992 Royal Rumble? Yokozuna in the 1993 Royal Rumble? Shawn Michaels in the 1995 Royal Rumble? British Bulldog at In Your House IV? Vader/Owen/Bulldog at IYH: International Incident? Sid at Survivor Series 1996? Sid at In Your House: It's Time? The Hart Foundation at In Your House: Canadian Stampede? Bret Hart at Summerslam 1997? Shawn Michaels at Bad Blood 1997? Shawn Michaels at Survivor Series 1997? Shawn Michaels at Royal Rumble 1998? Kane at King of the Ring 1998? The Rock at Survivor Series 1998? Vince McMahon at Royal Rumble 1999? The Undertaker at In Your House: Over the Edge 1999? The McMahons at King of the Ring 1999? Triple H at Unforgiven 1999? Triple H at No Mercy 1999? Triple H at Armaggedon 1999? Triple H at No Way Out 2000?
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Cranjis McBasketball
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Mar 15, 2014 22:51:06 GMT -5
Not exactly true, Andre's team went over Hogan's in the original Survivor Series main event. WM 2000 was the next time before a heel went over in the main. Flair in the 1992 Royal Rumble? Yokozuna in the 1993 Royal Rumble? Shawn Michaels in the 1995 Royal Rumble? British Bulldog at In Your House IV? Vader/Owen/Bulldog at IYH: International Incident? Sid at Survivor Series 1996? Sid at In Your House: It's Time? The Hart Foundation at In Your House: Canadian Stampede? Bret Hart at Summerslam 1997? Shawn Michaels at Bad Blood 1997? Shawn Michaels at Survivor Series 1997? Shawn Michaels at Royal Rumble 1998? Kane at King of the Ring 1998? The Rock at Survivor Series 1998? Vince McMahon at Royal Rumble 1999? The Undertaker at In Your House: Over the Edge 1999? The McMahons at King of the Ring 1999? Triple H at Unforgiven 1999? Triple H at No Mercy 1999? Triple H at Armaggedon 1999? Triple H at No Way Out 2000? And these.
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Post by Milkman Norm on Mar 16, 2014 0:16:59 GMT -5
I can't get behind the idea or the logic that Savage won the top tier title because the midcard title holder refused to job. 1. Did Honky Tonk have the stroke to pull a power play like that? 2. How does one go from a planned IC title reign to winning the biggest championship in the company at a time when the average reign was several years long with guys like Hogan and Andre in the main event scene in a tournament that involved said main eventers on the biggest show of the year? That makes zero sense. 1. *allegedly* HTM threatened to walk with the belt and go work for Jim Crockett the day of the show if the finish wasn't changed. He had the power because The Main Event was literally the first live prime time wrestling on national broadcast television. As the show was a two match show having 1/4 of your talent threaten to walk give him quite a bit of power in that moment. 2. Giving the belt to Savage wasn't that big of a stretch. He was really over as a face at the time.
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Post by lildude8218 on Mar 16, 2014 0:53:49 GMT -5
I always had fantasy booking where DiBiase wins at WM4 and then Savage essentially chases him for a year, with Hogan out of the spotlight working on No Holds Barred. then Savage wins at WM5 and the Mega Powers split up doesn't happen until 6.
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Post by RowdyRobbyPiper on Mar 16, 2014 1:15:40 GMT -5
I can't get behind the idea or the logic that Savage won the top tier title because the midcard title holder refused to job. 1. Did Honky Tonk have the stroke to pull a power play like that? 2. How does one go from a planned IC title reign to winning the biggest championship in the company at a time when the average reign was several years long with guys like Hogan and Andre in the main event scene in a tournament that involved said main eventers on the biggest show of the year? That makes zero sense. 1. *allegedly* HTM threatened to walk with the belt and go work for Jim Crockett the day of the show if the finish wasn't changed. He had the power because The Main Event was literally the first live prime time wrestling on national broadcast television. As the show was a two match show having 1/4 of your talent threaten to walk give him quite a bit of power in that moment. . If anybody doubts the story, it was also confirmed by DiBiase.
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Post by Milkman Norm on Mar 16, 2014 11:36:35 GMT -5
To give a better answer to the second part of thedualityofman's question regarding changing the booking I could imagine that after HTM refused to drop the strap to Savage and since Savage was already part of the plans for the main event scene with The Mega Powers he was going to move along beyond the IC title program sooner than latter anyway. Warrior's reign was laid out so I think that Savage was going to win on TME to have one babyface go over on live TV but then he was probably going drop the belt back to HTM or another heel or a house show taping so he could move on to the Main Event full time. I've read that the original plan for WM IV was DiBaise winning the title and Hogan getting back at the first Summerslam. But after the Honky thing I think that Vine and co decided to lay out the long term Mega Powers angle with Savage winning the belt and then he and Hogan slowly falling out leading to his heel turn and Hogan winning the belt back.
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Post by Tiger Millionaire on Mar 16, 2014 11:37:25 GMT -5
Not exactly true, Andre's team went over Hogan's in the original Survivor Series main event. WM 2000 was the next time before a heel went over in the main. Flair in the 1992 Royal Rumble? Yokozuna in the 1993 Royal Rumble? Shawn Michaels in the 1995 Royal Rumble? British Bulldog at In Your House IV? Vader/Owen/Bulldog at IYH: International Incident? Sid at Survivor Series 1996? Sid at In Your House: It's Time? The Hart Foundation at In Your House: Canadian Stampede? Bret Hart at Summerslam 1997? Shawn Michaels at Bad Blood 1997? Shawn Michaels at Survivor Series 1997? Shawn Michaels at Royal Rumble 1998? Kane at King of the Ring 1998? The Rock at Survivor Series 1998? Vince McMahon at Royal Rumble 1999? The Undertaker at In Your House: Over the Edge 1999? The McMahons at King of the Ring 1999? Triple H at Unforgiven 1999? Triple H at No Mercy 1999? Triple H at Armaggedon 1999? Triple H at No Way Out 2000? Which ones of those were Wrestlemania? Should have been clearer and said Wrestlemania.
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Post by 2 time pro bowler Fred Dryer on Mar 16, 2014 13:49:31 GMT -5
To give a better answer to the second part of thedualityofman's question regarding changing the booking I could imagine that after HTM refused to drop the strap to Savage and since Savage was already part of the plans for the main event scene with The Mega Powers he was going to move along beyond the IC title program sooner than latter anyway. Warrior's reign was laid out so I think that Savage was going to win on TME to have one babyface go over on live TV but then he was probably going drop the belt back to HTM or another heel or a house show taping so he could move on to the Main Event full time. I've read that the original plan for WM IV was DiBaise winning the title and Hogan getting back at the first Summerslam. But after the Honky thing I think that Vine and co decided to lay out the long term Mega Powers angle with Savage winning the belt and then he and Hogan slowly falling out leading to his heel turn and Hogan winning the belt back. I remember hearing that Savage threatened to go out on live TV, and legit beat the hell out of HTM, after learning that the finish was changed at the last minute. He was then promised the WM 4 win to placate him. Don't know if it's true, but it doesn't seem too far fetched.
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JoDaNa1281
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Post by JoDaNa1281 on Mar 16, 2014 14:05:42 GMT -5
I think it was wise to go the route they did. If they were sticking to DiBiase in the final, then DiBiase beating Andre wouldn't have made any sense at all and you knew they weren't putting DiBiase over Hogan. I think it added heat to DiBiase having the easier road to get to the final Only other logical way I could have seen this going down if the field is the exact same, is that DiBiase does the job to Don Muraco who then falls to Andre who wins via shenanigans and then we have a Macho Man/Andre final. As good as The Magnificent One is, I don't see him beating the Million Dollar Man in 1988. Having looked at the bracket, that was a weirdly planned bracket. Was there a story as to why Andre and Hogan both received first round byes? I also don't really understand why Rude/Roberts was a time limit draw. Hogan and Andre were the two guys embroiled in the original title controversy, and technically the last two champions; hence, they were automatically put in the quarters, ala Hogan and 'Taker both getting to pick between 21-30 in the 1992 Rumble since they were the champs leading up to the Survivor Series '91/Tuesday in Texas controversy. I always just assumed that Rude vs. Roberts went the way it did to further their feud; plus it put One Man Gang automatically in the semi's, so that Savage would have to overcome a fresh big guy after having fought his way through the first two rounds. They also did the same thing for the Deadly Games tournament at Survivor Series '98, with Taker/Kane automatically getting byes to the quarterfinals because of the finish of their title match the previous ppv.
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Mac
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Post by Mac on Mar 16, 2014 21:13:10 GMT -5
This PPV was poorly booked and all the matches were smoldering hot garbage.
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