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Post by bmfjules on Jan 7, 2015 18:22:07 GMT -5
A long time complaint on many Network releases, and something that bothers me so much on some matches that I'd still rather hunt down original copies on youtube or VHS, is the issue with WWE muzak replacing songs Vince is too cheap to buy the rights to.
Now, I support them being fiscal but if you could secure the rights to any song to restore the original music to one wrestler on all network releases, who would it be?
For me I would restore the Rocky 3 theme to Hogan, as IMO, all of that early stuff with that thumping music and those swelling crowd reactions is just pure magic and having to overdub, even with the equally great Real American music is almost tantamount to vandalism, especially since you also lose some of the crowd noise in there too which is a shame.
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Post by Oh Cry Me a Screwball on Jan 7, 2015 18:57:15 GMT -5
All the WCW music getting replaced is annoying, especially because most of it was intact before the Network.
DDP's is especially grating, because the Nirvana ripoff is borderline iconic for the guy.
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Post by James Fabiano on Jan 7, 2015 19:01:47 GMT -5
Can I just say anything ECW (in many cases, music WAS ECW)? I can watch individual matches but not full shows. I watched a CoD version of an WCW: Saturday Edition episode from 1987, and it was pretty jarring there too. Midnight Express with no Chase or NWA ripoff? No thanks!!!!!
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Post by James Fabiano on Jan 7, 2015 19:03:12 GMT -5
All the WCW music getting replaced is annoying, especially because most of it was intact before the Network. DDP's is especially grating, because the Nirvana ripoff is borderline iconic for the guy. Hmmmm....unless something changed, some of the early WCW PPVs seem to have kept the original stock music in them, some of which was banned from DVDs and CoD. They just eliminate the blatant Jimmy Hart Versions, don't they? This was an issue for a while with the Michael Hayes written music, including Slam Jam I, but they cleared that.
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Post by Oh Cry Me a Screwball on Jan 7, 2015 19:06:16 GMT -5
All the WCW music getting replaced is annoying, especially because most of it was intact before the Network. DDP's is especially grating, because the Nirvana ripoff is borderline iconic for the guy. Hmmmm....unless something changed, some of the early WCW PPVs seem to have kept the original stock music in them, some of which was banned from DVDs and CoD. They just eliminate the blatant Jimmy Hart Versions, don't they? This was an issue for a while with the Michael Hayes written music, including Slam Jam I, but they cleared that. Well, I watched Great American Bash 2000 last night, and there was one instance that caught my ear, where they overdubbed Shane Douglas's Perfect Strangers ripoff, with a different Perfect Strangers ripoff that wasn't any less of a ripoff than the one before. So, I'm not sure it's entirely just because they are ripoffs.
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Post by James Fabiano on Jan 7, 2015 19:08:05 GMT -5
Hmmmm....unless something changed, some of the early WCW PPVs seem to have kept the original stock music in them, some of which was banned from DVDs and CoD. They just eliminate the blatant Jimmy Hart Versions, don't they? This was an issue for a while with the Michael Hayes written music, including Slam Jam I, but they cleared that. Well, I watched Great American Bash 2000 last night, and there was one instance that caught my ear, where they overdubbed Shane Douglas's Perfect Strangers ripoff, with a different Perfect Strangers ripoff that wasn't any less of a ripoff than the one before. So, I'm not sure it's entirely just because they are ripoffs. I wonder....having not seen this version, would this be J.W. Storm's theme music from 1990? (Which was basically the opening riffs to Perfect Strangers played slowly and looped over a drum beat)
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cjh
Hank Scorpio
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Post by cjh on Jan 7, 2015 19:20:41 GMT -5
Hmmmm....unless something changed, some of the early WCW PPVs seem to have kept the original stock music in them, some of which was banned from DVDs and CoD. They just eliminate the blatant Jimmy Hart Versions, don't they? This was an issue for a while with the Michael Hayes written music, including Slam Jam I, but they cleared that. Well, I watched Great American Bash 2000 last night, and there was one instance that caught my ear, where they overdubbed Shane Douglas's Perfect Strangers ripoff, with a different Perfect Strangers ripoff that wasn't any less of a ripoff than the one before. So, I'm not sure it's entirely just because they are ripoffs. It shouldn't be an issue as Jimmy Hart made it, and WWE, prior to the Network, not only would leave it in on WCW shows but also used it as the replacement for the real song in ECW footage of Douglas. In fact, if you watch ECW WrestlePalooza 1998, Douglas has an in-ring segment with Taz, and on the Network, "Perfect Strangers" is dubbed over with the WCW knockoff version (the very same one now being replaced on WCW footage). For some reason, when the Network started, they stopped using certain WCW themes (that WWE used for years) that are based on real songs (with the strange exception of Sid's 1999-2001 theme, which WWE continues to use despite being a blatant knockoff of Sid's music when he was part of the Skyscrapers, "China White" by the Scorpions). You can also tell that certain people in production put together WCW pay-per-views for the Network, others did the Clashes, and others did the 1995/1996 Nitros because of the inconsistencies with the music. Public Enemy's WCW theme, done by Jimmy Hart, is dubbed over on Nitro shows but is intact on pay-per-views. Rick Rude's 1991-92 generic theme music (not "Simply Ravishing") is included on all the PPVs from that time but replaced on the Clash shows.
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Post by bmfjules on Jan 7, 2015 19:51:26 GMT -5
Can I just say anything ECW (in many cases, music WAS ECW)? I can watch individual matches but not full shows. I watched a CoD version of an WCW: Saturday Edition episode from 1987, and it was pretty jarring there too. Midnight Express with no Chase or NWA ripoff? No thanks!!!!! The Sandman and The Midnight Express (not subjects that get mentioned in the same breath often) are both very noticeable. At least with MX you still have great matches.... Sandman is just completely devoid of appeal now though. His music was everything.
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MiLB Fan
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Post by MiLB Fan on Jan 7, 2015 21:08:38 GMT -5
WWE replacing "Together" and "I'll Be Your Hero" from SummerSlam '91 and '93, respectively, is a real head-scratcher. Jim Johnston wrote both songs, they were published by Stephanie Music (a WWE subsidiary) and they appeared on Disc One of the Anthology set. You can buy both songs on iTunes. Heck, WWE has the video and original song for the latter on its YouTube channel!
This one doesn't really bug me, I just find it amusing. When WWE added Saturday Night's Main Event, everyone expected music changes because of the show's heavy use of mainstream 80s artists. Except that when WWE ran a commercial promoting the addition of SNME, you could hear Animotion's "Obsession" loud and clear. Funny that WWE would license the song for a 30-second ad, but not for the show itself.
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Reflecto
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Post by Reflecto on Jan 7, 2015 21:46:49 GMT -5
This one doesn't really bug me, I just find it amusing. When WWE added Saturday Night's Main Event, everyone expected music changes because of the show's heavy use of mainstream 80s artists. Except that when WWE ran a commercial promoting the addition of SNME, you could hear Animotion's "Obsession" loud and clear. Funny that WWE would license the song for a 30-second ad, but not for the show itself. But that makes some sense for ad purposes- you can legally use 20 seconds of a song without having to pay for licensing rights to it (the same reason they used just a 20-second loop of the hook for "The Memory Remains" for HHH/Taker II, so they wouldn't have to license the whole song.) As far as mine, the smallest one: Give Maven back his theme. There's bigger ones, but this one took out pretty much the only thing interesting about Maven and eliminated it.
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cjh
Hank Scorpio
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Post by cjh on Jan 7, 2015 22:02:19 GMT -5
This one doesn't really bug me, I just find it amusing. When WWE added Saturday Night's Main Event, everyone expected music changes because of the show's heavy use of mainstream 80s artists. Except that when WWE ran a commercial promoting the addition of SNME, you could hear Animotion's "Obsession" loud and clear. Funny that WWE would license the song for a 30-second ad, but not for the show itself. But that makes some sense for ad purposes- you can legally use 20 seconds of a song without having to pay for licensing rights to it (the same reason they used just a 20-second loop of the hook for "The Memory Remains" for HHH/Taker II, so they wouldn't have to license the whole song.) As far as mine, the smallest one: Give Maven back his theme. There's bigger ones, but this one took out pretty much the only thing interesting about Maven and eliminated it. That 20 second rule is either false or it's not known. On multiple occasions, I've seen some talk shows or roundtable discussion shows mention how if someone on the program were to simply sing some of the lyrics to a song, they'd be charged for it.
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Reflecto
Hank Scorpio
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Post by Reflecto on Jan 7, 2015 22:22:27 GMT -5
But that makes some sense for ad purposes- you can legally use 20 seconds of a song without having to pay for licensing rights to it (the same reason they used just a 20-second loop of the hook for "The Memory Remains" for HHH/Taker II, so they wouldn't have to license the whole song.) As far as mine, the smallest one: Give Maven back his theme. There's bigger ones, but this one took out pretty much the only thing interesting about Maven and eliminated it. That 20 second rule is either false or it's not known. On multiple occasions, I've seen some talk shows or roundtable discussion shows mention how if someone on the program were to simply sing some of the lyrics to a song, they'd be charged for it. It's not well-known, but again, it did come up for wrestling fans with the way the WWE used just 20 seconds of "The Memory Remains" (and for non-wrestling, it's why the game SongPop can be free-to-play, since it uses 15 seconds of the song.)
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cjh
Hank Scorpio
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Post by cjh on Jan 7, 2015 22:41:27 GMT -5
That 20 second rule is either false or it's not known. On multiple occasions, I've seen some talk shows or roundtable discussion shows mention how if someone on the program were to simply sing some of the lyrics to a song, they'd be charged for it. It's not well-known, but again, it did come up for wrestling fans with the way the WWE used just 20 seconds of "The Memory Remains" (and for non-wrestling, it's why the game SongPop can be free-to-play, since it uses 15 seconds of the song.) Where was it said for sure that WWE did not license the song? They constantly edit out copyrighted music even when it was played for less than 20 seconds. I'm sure it happens on Netflix, Amazon Video, or home video with old TV shows, too. For one particular example, the old sitcom "WKRP" was just released on DVD in a complete series box set, and they actually edited a scene where, originally, an instrumental version of "Take Me Out to the Ball Game" was heard in a video game for a few seconds. On the DVD, they actually changed the sound effects to generic beeps.
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Reflecto
Hank Scorpio
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Post by Reflecto on Jan 7, 2015 23:45:34 GMT -5
It's not well-known, but again, it did come up for wrestling fans with the way the WWE used just 20 seconds of "The Memory Remains" (and for non-wrestling, it's why the game SongPop can be free-to-play, since it uses 15 seconds of the song.) Where was it said for sure that WWE did not license the song? They constantly edit out copyrighted music even when it was played for less than 20 seconds. I'm sure it happens on Netflix, Amazon Video, or home video with old TV shows, too. For one particular example, the old sitcom "WKRP" was just released on DVD in a complete series box set, and they actually edited a scene where, originally, an instrumental version of "Take Me Out to the Ball Game" was heard in a video game for a few seconds. On the DVD, they actually changed the sound effects to generic beeps. I don't know where it was said, but I know I remember hearing that as the reason somewhere when it happened.
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chazraps
Wade Wilson
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Post by chazraps on Jan 8, 2015 0:15:07 GMT -5
This one doesn't really bug me, I just find it amusing. When WWE added Saturday Night's Main Event, everyone expected music changes because of the show's heavy use of mainstream 80s artists. Except that when WWE ran a commercial promoting the addition of SNME, you could hear Animotion's "Obsession" loud and clear. Funny that WWE would license the song for a 30-second ad, but not for the show itself. But that makes some sense for ad purposes- you can legally use 20 seconds of a song without having to pay for licensing rights to it (the same reason they used just a 20-second loop of the hook for "The Memory Remains" for HHH/Taker II, so they wouldn't have to license the whole song.) That's not true at all. If you use any part of a song in a promotional capacity, regardless of length, you HAVE to pay for it. WWE paid both Animotion and Metallica in those two instances. But paying for two thirty second spots that would air twice on television on two nights would be cheaper than licensing a song for on-demand subscription service usage in perpetuity.
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Post by thegame415 on Jan 8, 2015 1:58:58 GMT -5
Raven and Jericho being given WWF theme's. Also, I don't get why they gave Jericho his debut WWF theme.
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67 more
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Post by 67 more on Jan 9, 2015 5:04:58 GMT -5
Can I just say anything ECW (in many cases, music WAS ECW)? I can watch individual matches but not full shows. I watched a CoD version of an WCW: Saturday Edition episode from 1987, and it was pretty jarring there too. Midnight Express with no Chase or NWA ripoff? No thanks!!!!! The Sandman and The Midnight Express (not subjects that get mentioned in the same breath often) are both very noticeable. At least with MX you still have great matches.... Sandman is just completely devoid of appeal now though. His music was everything. At least his dubbed music does fit him, though, unlike his crappy WWE theme.
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CMWaters
Ozymandius
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Post by CMWaters on Jan 9, 2015 5:21:09 GMT -5
I still don't get why they have to dub over "Don't Go Messin' With A Country Boy".
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Post by Martin: #TeamBella Treasurer on Jan 9, 2015 7:16:24 GMT -5
WWE replacing "Together" and "I'll Be Your Hero" from SummerSlam '91 and '93, respectively, is a real head-scratcher. Jim Johnston wrote both songs, they were published by Stephanie Music (a WWE subsidiary) and they appeared on Disc One of the Anthology set. You can buy both songs on iTunes. Heck, WWE has the video and original song for the latter on its YouTube channel! Hmm the only suggestion I can think of is that maybe someone in WWE just doesn't like those themes, and was able to get it replaced, regardless of whether they own it or not. That's another reason behind editing that doesn't get mentioned often. They have dubbed over all instances of the Oddities entrance theme. I don't care that much for the stable, except Luna, but the theme always got a pop. I noticed this more during the 12 Days of Attitude where the 1998 Raw episodes featured them. Also, Edge's 2002 theme missing bugs me. I don't know if I am the only fan of his Rob Zombie theme, and I am too a fan of the OSW Review's interpretation... "Yeahhhhhh my Durango, Mambo Number 5"
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Post by MAD TITAN on Jan 9, 2015 9:03:18 GMT -5
Voodoo Child Rollin' is edited on some PPVs but it's left intact on others Not sure if American Bad Ass is edited but if it is that will annoy me to no end once the 2000 TV shows gets uploaded PPV theme songs from licensed bands are probably definitely dubbed
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