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Post by bmfjules on Mar 6, 2015 18:26:30 GMT -5
Let's assume in an alternative universe that WCW is overlooked in the AOL merger and they are basically just left alone and continue on in the same way they had been going. It's post boom period, post Russo period. They are basically at the popularity level of TNA (when TNA was "hot"....) but they have the WCW legacy and library to bank on, and they are in the process of slowly establishing and pushing some younger talent to compliment their established guys like Sting, Luger, Steiner, DDP, Booker T etc...
Anyway with the roster they had at the time (and any likely acquisitions within the realm of possibility), how long do you think it would take before Nitro could go back to being neck and neck with Raw?
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Bub (BLM)
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Post by Bub (BLM) on Mar 6, 2015 18:42:00 GMT -5
If the Triple H reign of terror still happened and with no second brand, I could see it.
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Post by MichaelMartini on Mar 6, 2015 18:42:42 GMT -5
I think it could have if not when Rock and Austin left, certainly during Cena's megapush when half the crowds were booing. They would've tuned into WCW (so long as they weren't pushing someone worse).
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Post by CATCH_US IS the Conversation on Mar 6, 2015 18:51:40 GMT -5
If DX jumped to WCW and drove a tank to RAW.
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Post by Cela on Mar 6, 2015 18:53:38 GMT -5
Of course, they just would have had to tone down the shit and have a good straight show.
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Post by bigjohnsons on Mar 6, 2015 19:33:03 GMT -5
RUSSO Swerve : the DX tank jumps to WCW and invades RAW !!!!!
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Post by Diamond Cutter Out of Nowhere! on Mar 6, 2015 19:34:37 GMT -5
If you take out all the Russo swerve nonsense, I think WCW could. WWE has this revisionist history that makes it sound like WCW was just the worst thing on Earth at that time and to be fair, it was bad, but it wasn't nearly as bad as what WWE is now. They could have come back.
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Post by Gravedigger's Biscuits on Mar 6, 2015 19:40:42 GMT -5
Yeah, I think they could have.
Although Nitro had fallen considerably from it's peak, it was still hovering around the 2.5 mark. RAW's ratings began to drop off in the fall of 2000 and by the end of 2002 it averaged out to around a 3.5 rating.
If WCW had been able to hold on and rebuild, they could definitely have been within touching distance of WWE's ratings.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2015 19:42:40 GMT -5
Maybe if they had one creative vision that they were committed to, rotating between Russo, Bischoff, Nash and Sullivan quarterly wasn't going to work for anyone.
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chazraps
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Post by chazraps on Mar 6, 2015 19:44:50 GMT -5
If you take out all the Russo swerve nonsense, I think WCW could. WWE has this revisionist history that makes it sound like WCW was just the worst thing on Earth at that time and to be fair, it was bad, but it wasn't nearly as bad as what WWE is now. They could have come back. WWE now is infinitely better than WCW 2000. Like, it's the worst any nationally televised wrestling promotion has ever, ever been. It's past the point where taste becomes subjective, you have a disorganized mess suffering from the product to the presentation. The worst moments of any promotions can be attributed to bad booking, but at least with those poor booking choices you can sort of see a train of (albeit faulty) logic. WCW 2000 is just an insultingly aimless clusterbutt. |
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Post by giraffe4hire on Mar 6, 2015 19:46:33 GMT -5
I think the better question is, would TNA have ever beat RAW if TNA was under the WCW brand name with the same roster and booking it had through the 2000s.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2015 19:52:30 GMT -5
They key is to look at who would jump ship at that time. March 2001 had the following in my mind who would've jumped to WCW if they were in better shape:
Triple H (reunite with his boys)
Shawn Michaels (jumps with HHH)
X-Pac (would follow both)
Eddie Guererro (If they released him sooner, he jumps back)
Test (WCW and Shane did want him as their champion if htat rumor is true)
Albert (big hoss gets the Mike Awesome push)
Too Cool (pushed aside for the Hardys/Dudleys/E&C)
Tazz (I thought the WWE was going to release him anyways)
Chyna (On the outs anyways)
Hardcore Holly (Needed something fresh)
Billy Gunn (Ditto)
Essa Rios (Crusierweight division addition)
Steve Blackman (Added to WCW's hardcore division)
So not much talent that would move the needle, except if HHH really wanted to reunite with the boys and take over WCW and hang out with Ric Flair. It would take at least a year to establish the rest of that crop if they jumped.
I wouldn't have been surprised if the Radicalz jumped ship back with new management in 2002-2003.
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Post by MichaelMartini on Mar 6, 2015 20:09:40 GMT -5
They key is to look at who would jump ship at that time. March 2001 had the following in my mind who would've jumped to WCW if they were in better shape: Triple H (reunite with his boys) Shawn Michaels (jumps with HHH) X-Pac (would follow both) Eddie Guererro (If they released him sooner, he jumps back) Test (WCW and Shane did want him as their champion if htat rumor is true) Albert (big hoss gets the Mike Awesome push) Too Cool (pushed aside for the Hardys/Dudleys/E&C) Tazz (I thought the WWE was going to release him anyways) Chyna (On the outs anyways) Hardcore Holly (Needed something fresh) Billy Gunn (Ditto) Essa Rios (Crusierweight division addition) Steve Blackman (Added to WCW's hardcore division) So not much talent that would move the needle, except if HHH really wanted to reunite with the boys and take over WCW and hang out with Ric Flair. It would take at least a year to establish the rest of that crop if they jumped. I wouldn't have been surprised if the Radicalz jumped ship back with new management in 2002-2003. I don't think HHH would jump because he was dating Steph by then and if Michaels didn't jump in the 90s I don't think he ever would. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2015 20:28:32 GMT -5
They key is to look at who would jump ship at that time. March 2001 had the following in my mind who would've jumped to WCW if they were in better shape: Triple H (reunite with his boys) Shawn Michaels (jumps with HHH) X-Pac (would follow both) Eddie Guererro (If they released him sooner, he jumps back) Test (WCW and Shane did want him as their champion if htat rumor is true) Albert (big hoss gets the Mike Awesome push) Too Cool (pushed aside for the Hardys/Dudleys/E&C) Tazz (I thought the WWE was going to release him anyways) Chyna (On the outs anyways) Hardcore Holly (Needed something fresh) Billy Gunn (Ditto) Essa Rios (Crusierweight division addition) Steve Blackman (Added to WCW's hardcore division) So not much talent that would move the needle, except if HHH really wanted to reunite with the boys and take over WCW and hang out with Ric Flair. It would take at least a year to establish the rest of that crop if they jumped. I wouldn't have been surprised if the Radicalz jumped ship back with new management in 2002-2003. I don't think HHH would jump because he was dating Steph by then and if Michaels didn't jump in the 90s I don't think he ever would. But if Austin and Rock were still around full-time, I'm sure Vince would favor them BOTH of HHH in terms of drawing money. So HHH might be frustrated and jump because of that. |
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Post by Nickybojelais on Mar 6, 2015 20:33:22 GMT -5
I think a lot of damage was done to the WCW brand by that point. I also don't see WWF/E getting as complacent and half-arsing their product as much if WCW was still around, thus not giving WCW a chance to fight back.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2015 20:46:41 GMT -5
If you take out all the Russo swerve nonsense, I think WCW could. WWE has this revisionist history that makes it sound like WCW was just the worst thing on Earth at that time and to be fair, it was bad, but it wasn't nearly as bad as what WWE is now. They could have come back. Just curious were you watching WCW at the time? the last year and a half or so is possibly the worst wrestling product that I've ever seen. Current WWE is nowhere near as bad as late era WCW. Not even close not even in the same stratosphere. |
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Post by Diamond Cutter Out of Nowhere! on Mar 6, 2015 20:58:29 GMT -5
If you take out all the Russo swerve nonsense, I think WCW could. WWE has this revisionist history that makes it sound like WCW was just the worst thing on Earth at that time and to be fair, it was bad, but it wasn't nearly as bad as what WWE is now. They could have come back. Just curious were you watching WCW at the time? the last year and a half or so is possibly the worst wrestling product that I've ever seen. Current WWE is nowhere near as bad as late era WCW. Not even close not even in the same stratosphere. Oh yeah, I was watching. I went down with the ship. I still don't consider it as bad as what I'm seeing now. Tastes are different, so take what I say with a huge grain of salt. |
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Post by Mozenrath on Mar 6, 2015 21:05:15 GMT -5
If you take out all the Russo swerve nonsense, I think WCW could. WWE has this revisionist history that makes it sound like WCW was just the worst thing on Earth at that time and to be fair, it was bad, but it wasn't nearly as bad as what WWE is now. They could have come back. Just curious were you watching WCW at the time? the last year and a half or so is possibly the worst wrestling product that I've ever seen. Current WWE is nowhere near as bad as late era WCW. Not even close not even in the same stratosphere. Agreed. Even without Russo, you'd still have people with contracts that made it extremely difficult to book with any amount of freedom, everyone having a multitude of bosses, and AOL Time Warner exerting a tremendous amount of pressure on them. Even though I am sure they could have potentially repaired some things, they would have had major problems. Beyond that, even the money they did make, Time Warner wouldn't exactly funnel back into the company, so you could have a good angle or something and sell some PPVs, only to be in the same hole you were already in. |
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Post by MichaelMartini on Mar 6, 2015 21:54:13 GMT -5
I don't think HHH would jump because he was dating Steph by then and if Michaels didn't jump in the 90s I don't think he ever would. But if Austin and Rock were still around full-time, I'm sure Vince would favor them BOTH of HHH in terms of drawing money. So HHH might be frustrated and jump because of that. HHH was pushed as their equals, going over both of them ever since 1999 so I doubt HHH would have any problems. He was the first heel to stand tall at the end of a Wrestlemania in 2000. |
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Post by ritt works hard fo da chickens on Mar 6, 2015 22:54:10 GMT -5
But if Austin and Rock were still around full-time, I'm sure Vince would favor them BOTH of HHH in terms of drawing money. So HHH might be frustrated and jump because of that. HHH was pushed as their equals, going over both of them ever since 1999 so I doubt HHH would have any problems. He was the first heel to stand tall at the end of a Wrestlemania in 2000. I know that's the standard WWE line but technically Austin was the first heel to stand tall at the end of x7. Trips was the first to enter heel champ and leave heel champ but even that's only on the technicality that they added that impromptu match to 9. As for WWE losing in the ratings again. I'd say entirely possible. Eventual the old guys would have come back and Vince loves his nostalgia. He'd happily book part timers over his day to day guys for the big shows. Also he'd still do stuff like Rosie/Trump to entertain his good friend the Donald. However instead of fans chanting TNA, who couldn't capitalize on a winning lottery ticket, they'd probably chant WCW and more importantly probably change the channel. |
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