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Post by Hit Girl on Jul 9, 2015 23:17:00 GMT -5
TNA's biggest problem is having a boss who doesn't know how to identify the problems with her company, let alone devise solutions to them.
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Jul 9, 2015 23:36:08 GMT -5
TNA's biggest problem is having a boss who doesn't know how to identify the problems with her company, let alone devise solutions to them. Saddest part is that she created those problems. She wanted to go live against WWE, she wanted to take Impact on the road, she hired Russo despite SPIKE ordered her not to do it, she send that email calling dummies the top guys at Destination America. Dixie looked awful when she returned to TV, all the stress did her in. She looked ancient, like she aged 10 years after the table bump.
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Post by xCompackx on Jul 9, 2015 23:56:05 GMT -5
TNA's biggest problem is having a boss who doesn't know how to identify the problems with her company, let alone devise solutions to them. Saddest part is that she created those problems. She wanted to go live against WWE, she wanted to take Impact on the road, she hired Russo despite SPIKE ordered her not to do it, she send that email calling dummies the top guys at Destination America. Dixie looked awful when she returned to TV, all the stress did her in. She looked ancient, like she aged 10 years after the table bump. The crazy thing about Dixie to me isn't so much that she keeps doing these things, but she always finds ways to top the previous mistake. Trying to compete with WWE directly with a live show was stupid, but trying to take Impact on the road when they didn't have nearly the amount of money needed to do so was even worse, and it just escalates with the Russo thing and now the email story. It's like she's either actively trying to f*** up TNA, or has so little business sense that she's just listening to every single person around her and picking the first idea they say.
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Welfare Willis
Crow T. Robot
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Post by Welfare Willis on Jul 10, 2015 0:35:25 GMT -5
See, here's the thing: what did TNA do wrong (or didn't do right)? Because if you think about it, there were people who said "If they just get this big name or that big name, they'll get ratings." And they didn't. Their ratings were the same all the time. They had TV, video games, action figures, publicity. But they could never take off. And I'm honestly wondering "Why"? Let me just say this: The only time I really watched TNA was during the fourth quarter of 2009. I was telling people, "You've just GOT to watch this!" And that's the best kind of advertising: word of mouth. (Then as soon as 2010 started, everything went down the drain.) Point being: I just don't see how this new promotion will be any different. Have all the wrestlers and TV deals you want, but unless word catches fire, I don't see it becoming any more than what TNA was. TNA faced a two-sided problem: -The first, and biggest problem, is that pro wrestling's popularity in North America has been on a steady downward slide for over 30 years now. Said it in other threads, but even as Hulk Hogan and Andre the Giant were selling 75,000-93,000 (whatever the actual number is) tickets at the Silverdome in '87, and even as Nitro and Raw were drawing a combined 8+ million viewers a week for a few months in 1998, the reality remained that less people were buying tickets to, or flat-out watching in any way, pro wrestling in those years than there had been before cable really took off and the territories died. WWE's numbers continue to plummet, the average age of wrestling viewers in the US continues to climb higher and higher (we're not being replaced by younger fans), and the trend isn't about to reverse any time soon. I'd like to get your thinking on this because I feel like the wrestling downfall as you describe is a downfall happening to really the television industry as a whole. People are going to other sources for entertainment. Vince likes to pretend wrestling is a sport, but Raw really doesn't feel like must see tv. Plus at three hours, people have other things to do. While Raw continues to be one of the most watched shows on cable it can't keep the status quo. As for the age issue you described I'm wondering if this because outside of Lucha Underground no wrestling company has tried to appeal to other demographics (in America). Vince is a 70 year old white male. The Vince/JR/Gail Kim news item that came out a day ago is interesting because it's seems like Vince couldn't grasp some men aren't interested the sterotypical blonde. I'm thinking of how the comic books industry has started to diversify. Maybe we do need more emphasis on women's wrestling and wrestlers who aren't white males. Hell, TNA actually used Bobby Lashley better than Vince. I have no doubt wrestling will remain a majority male viewed sport, but wrestling can try to do things to obtain a more diverse audience.
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Post by HMARK Center on Jul 10, 2015 0:49:02 GMT -5
TNA faced a two-sided problem: -The first, and biggest problem, is that pro wrestling's popularity in North America has been on a steady downward slide for over 30 years now. Said it in other threads, but even as Hulk Hogan and Andre the Giant were selling 75,000-93,000 (whatever the actual number is) tickets at the Silverdome in '87, and even as Nitro and Raw were drawing a combined 8+ million viewers a week for a few months in 1998, the reality remained that less people were buying tickets to, or flat-out watching in any way, pro wrestling in those years than there had been before cable really took off and the territories died. WWE's numbers continue to plummet, the average age of wrestling viewers in the US continues to climb higher and higher (we're not being replaced by younger fans), and the trend isn't about to reverse any time soon. I'd like to get your thinking on this because I feel like wrestling downfall as you describe is a downfall happening to really the television industry as a whole. People are going to other sources for entertainment. Vince likes to pretend Wrestling is a sport, but Raw really doesn't feel like must see tv. Plus at three hours, people have other things to do. While Raw continues to be one of the most watched shows on cable it can't keep the status quo. As for the age issue you described I'm wondering if this because outside of Lucha Underground no wrestling company has tried to appeal to other demographics. Vince is a 70 year old white male. The Vince/JR/Gail Kim news item that came out a day ago is interesting because it's become a joke that Vince is very out of touvh in terms of pop culture. I'm thinking of how recently the comic books industry has started to diversify. Maybe we do need more emphasis on women's wrestling and wrestlers who aren't white males. That's not going to happen in Vince's hands. I have no doubt Wrestling will remain a majority male viewed sport, but wrestling can try to do things to obtain a more diverse audience. I'm sure it's a slew of issues, and I can't claim to have done any sort of serious research into hard data and media trends that could nail the biggest factors down. However, I was thinking of adding to my original post that the splintering of media options and the rise of more entertainment options are definitely one of the factors that have hit all mainstream media; it's why the age of "everybody knew where they were when the Beatles were on Ed Sullivan", or "everybody went home and saw the new Michael Jackson video on MTV" are effectively over outside of rare annual/biannual events like a national election (and even THAT doesn't draw in nearly the viewers you'd think) or the Super Bowl. The big things that have gotten the ball rolling on wrestling's decline, I think, was first the consolidation of the industry under Vince's umbrella, which trained people to associate "pro wrestling" with "whatever WWE does", ignoring a long history of varied promotions that operated and booked in very different ways; and secondly the death of kayfabe really did a number, as a ton of people likely found themselves thinking "so why would I waste time with something that's fake?" I don't know if there's really any reversing that outside of hugely changing the entire modus operandi of the pro wrestling industry. Lucha Underground may be a first shot at that, as there are really no other wrestling shows like it, but it clearly doesn't have the exposure necessary to make a dent, and the further splintering of entertainment options means it isn't likely to get that exposure.
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Welfare Willis
Crow T. Robot
Pornomancer 555-BONE FDIC Bonsured
Game Center CX Kacho on!
Posts: 44,259
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Post by Welfare Willis on Jul 10, 2015 1:03:27 GMT -5
I'd like to get your thinking on this because I feel like wrestling downfall as you describe is a downfall happening to really the television industry as a whole. People are going to other sources for entertainment. Vince likes to pretend Wrestling is a sport, but Raw really doesn't feel like must see tv. Plus at three hours, people have other things to do. While Raw continues to be one of the most watched shows on cable it can't keep the status quo. As for the age issue you described I'm wondering if this because outside of Lucha Underground no wrestling company has tried to appeal to other demographics. Vince is a 70 year old white male. The Vince/JR/Gail Kim news item that came out a day ago is interesting because it's become a joke that Vince is very out of touvh in terms of pop culture. I'm thinking of how recently the comic books industry has started to diversify. Maybe we do need more emphasis on women's wrestling and wrestlers who aren't white males. That's not going to happen in Vince's hands. I have no doubt Wrestling will remain a majority male viewed sport, but wrestling can try to do things to obtain a more diverse audience. I'm sure it's a slew of issues, and I can't claim to have done any sort of serious research into hard data and media trends that could nail the biggest factors down. However, I was thinking of adding to my original post that the splintering of media options and the rise of more entertainment options are definitely one of the factors that have hit all mainstream media; it's why the age of "everybody knew where they were when the Beatles were on Ed Sullivan", or "everybody went home and saw the new Michael Jackson video on MTV" are effectively over outside of rare annual/biannual events like a national election (and even THAT doesn't draw in nearly the viewers you'd think) or the Super Bowl. The big things that have gotten the ball rolling on wrestling's decline, I think, was first the consolidation of the industry under Vince's umbrella, which trained people to associate "pro wrestling" with "whatever WWE does", ignoring a long history of varied promotions that operated and booked in very different ways; and secondly the death of kayfabe really did a number, as a ton of people likely found themselves thinking "so why would I waste time with something that's fake?" And that's the cross as wrestling fans we bear. Never mind everything is fake in the entertainment industry from the tits to the news. I'm not ready to say wrestling is dying because I feel like it's a form of storytelling that will have some value. However, I think people may be growing tired how Vince tells the stories. The answer may not be in Lucha Underground, ROH, or others yet, but someone may one day have the key.
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SUPES
Don Corleone
Posts: 1,373
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Post by SUPES on Jul 10, 2015 1:46:24 GMT -5
I don't buy PPV being a dead model at all. WWE and TNA relied way too much for YEARS getting quick-fix TV ratings to placate their masters, rather than find the balancing act of creating enough interest in the championships, roster, and narratives to consistently hook the audience into paying $30-50 for a card. UFC still thrives on PPV and I don't believe that it's because it's a shoot. It's because they know how to create narratives and superstar box-office draws.
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Jul 10, 2015 1:58:16 GMT -5
I don't buy PPV being a dead model at all. WWE and TNA relied way too much for YEARS getting quick-fix TV ratings to placate their masters, rather than find the balancing act of creating enough interest in the championships, roster, and narratives to consistently hook the audience into paying $30-50 for a card. UFC still thrives on PPV and I don't believe that it's because it's a shoot. It's because they know how to create narratives and superstar box-office draws. Well Dana White admitted that the wwe network hurt the ppv business, thankfully they have enough stars that they can have at least 8 shows that will draw great money. Another thing that the ufc does well is that if a fighter is charismatic and has talent, they'll promote the shit out of him, pro wrestling 101. That's TNA mistake that they never have and never will be interested in creating new stars. Think what the ufc would've done with a fighter with Monty Brown charisma, or how also the WWE markets new stars, they may not get to the top of the card, but Vince focus the camera on them. TNA just fed Monty Brown to Jeff Jarrett, or worst yet Hulk Hogan punking out every single member of fortune. TNA killed their own ppv business by killing their most bankable star in Samoa Joe and banking everything on former wwe superstars, and when the wwe rejects left, the tna guys who stayed couldn't draw because they were fed to the former wwe guys. Another thing that killed their ppvs was that they had free title changes continually on impact. Sometimes the week after the ppv.
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SUPES
Don Corleone
Posts: 1,373
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Post by SUPES on Jul 10, 2015 2:38:09 GMT -5
If Dixie ran UFC, she'd have PHIL's debut on FOX.
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Post by EoE: Well There's Your Problem on Jul 10, 2015 2:45:00 GMT -5
If Dixie ran UFC, she'd have PHIL's debut on FOX. If Dixie ran UFC, it wouldn't have lasted long enough for John McCain to get mad about it.
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Post by Jacy Derangement Syndrome on Jul 10, 2015 3:09:11 GMT -5
If Dixie ran UFC, she'd have PHIL's debut on FOX. If Dixie ran UFC, it wouldn't have lasted long enough for John McCain to get mad about it. If Dixie ran UFC, she'd respond to the human cock-fighting allegations by having UFC 9 main evented by two chickens named Ken Shamcock and Royce Gravy.
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Jul 10, 2015 3:15:13 GMT -5
If Dixie ran UFC, she'd have PHIL's debut on FOX. If Dixie ran UFC, it wouldn't have lasted long enough for John McCain to get mad about it. If someone send John McCain a tape of the reverse battle royal he would definitely ban TNA, because seeing that match causes brain damage, also the red bird cage that Homicide couldn't exit.
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Aya Reiko
Team Rocket
Judgement Day is here.
Posts: 783
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Post by Aya Reiko on Jul 10, 2015 3:59:45 GMT -5
So Eric Young shows up at a GFW show...
My God does it look pathetic.
The vid:
Crowd looks like about 50, and only about 20 looks like they're making any noise. (Wouldn't surprise me those marking out are paid plants by GFW.) This makes it bleedingly obvious they pumped in crowd noise for this. And the ring looks like a rental and cheap as hell, no GFW logos anywhere. Everything about it screams "generic".
I'll be amazed if either company lasts another year. They're both just vanity projects for Dixie and Jarrett now.
...
Hmmm.... "Generic"....
New name for GFW: Generic Farce Wrestling. 'Cause that's what it really is.
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SUPES
Don Corleone
Posts: 1,373
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Post by SUPES on Jul 10, 2015 4:28:01 GMT -5
LOLOLOLOLLLOLOLOLOLLOLLOOLLOLLL
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chrom
Backup Wench
Master of the rare undecuple post
Posts: 84,726
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Post by chrom on Jul 10, 2015 4:35:05 GMT -5
How embarassing, can you imagine Bullet Club's (Anderson and Gallows) reaction to performing in front of nearly 12,000 to wrestling in front of that many people in five days?
I don't see why on earth they think they can hold shows in places that seat thousands and get less than five percent of attendence. You are not making any money whatsoever doing that. And just what is wrong with doing shows in gyms and theaters that sit a hundred or so? The building maybe small but at least you won't look pathetic and an embarassment.
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Emmet Russell
King Koopa
Quieter
The best wrestler on earth.
Posts: 12,526
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Post by Emmet Russell on Jul 10, 2015 4:45:37 GMT -5
Wow, this invasion is exciting...
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jul 10, 2015 5:13:33 GMT -5
I have a friend who was at that show.
Claims at least 300 people where there and very smarky.
Seriously though...high school gyms would have looked more respectable than that.
I mean...OMEGA draws like 3000 people...
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Post by Jedi-El of Tomorrow on Jul 10, 2015 5:25:23 GMT -5
If Dixie ran UFC, she'd have PHIL's debut on FOX. If Dixie ran UFC she'd have Punk's first public appearance for the company, be showing up at WWE with Ronda Rousey, and agreeing to a tag match at Survivor Series, while asking for $1,500. She'd then somehow fire both of them.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 10, 2015 6:44:33 GMT -5
How embarassing, can you imagine Bullet Club's (Anderson and Gallows) reaction to performing in front of nearly 12,000 to wrestling in front of that many people in five days? I don't see why on earth they think they can hold shows in places that seat thousands and get less than five percent of attendence. You are not making any money whatsoever doing that. And just what is wrong with doing shows in gyms and theaters that sit a hundred or so? The building maybe small but at least you won't look pathetic and an embarassment. They're paid shows. Unless Jarrett can't budget at all, he's making a lot more money than he would running gyms and theaters. You're right about it being an awful visual. And nobody will pay him to do more of these shows but they are making money from these shows.
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Post by The Legendary Ring Troll {BLM} on Jul 10, 2015 7:49:44 GMT -5
Did Jarrett even ever main event a WWE PPV? For f***s sake, even Maven closed 1. I'll lower the bar: did he ever even main event an episode of RAW? That guy nailed it. He's a glorified Greg Gagne or Erik Watts. If his last name was Johnson, would he have ever made it out of Memphis? You mean the son of Rocky Johnson and brother of Duane "The Rock" Johnson?! A member of the great Samoan Dynasty?! He would be a multi time WWE Champion!
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