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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Jun 13, 2017 14:08:48 GMT -5
Probably surpass if they continue to be on teams stacked with future hall of famers while Lebron finds himself in the position of having to carry teams on his back. So now we find ourselves with this tired argument once again. Nothing is ever enough for LeBron James. He could join a team with Magic Johnson at point guard, Michael Jordan at shooting guard, Tim Duncan at power forward, and Shaquille O'Neal at center and it still wouldn't be enough for precious LeBron. I hate this retconning of LeBron James' career. The only team you could say that he carried to The Finals and had no chance of winning with were the 2007 Cavaliers. Every other team he's played on that has advanced to the championship round has been plenty good enough to win it all. He had Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh on the Heat teams, and both of them are surefire Hall of Famers. He's had Kyrie Irving on this Cavaliers team, who, as long as he continues to progress as he is, will be enshrined in Springfield. Kevin Love probably will be a Hall of Famer, too, but that's largely because the Basketball Hall of Fame is a laughingstock. But don't tell me this Cavaliers team wasn't good enough. Just because they faced off with a historically-loaded Warriors team doesn't mean LeBron James was the only player carrying the Cavaliers. And maybe, if this squad wasn't good enough, LeBron James should look in the mirror and blame the guy he sees for it being constructed this way. He's the one who said it was going to take patience and time and then immediately gave the thumbs-up to trading Andrew Wiggins for Kevin Love, hiring Tyronn Lue and canning David Blatt, and suffocating the Cavs' cap space when he implored the front office to give his buddies Tristan Thompson and J.R. Smith a combined $139 million. This team was good enough to win the championship and LeBron James didn't have to carry it. He had enough of a supporting cast to win. The Warriors were better. Just because Golden State is better than Cleveland doesn't suddenly make the Cavs paupers who had no right to advance to The Finals and only did so because LeBron willed them to it. Cavs constructed as they are, are still the best team in the east It's just hard being second place
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BRV
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Post by BRV on Jun 13, 2017 14:12:59 GMT -5
Cavs constructed as they are, are still the best team in the east It's just hard being second place And what's unfortunate is that here we are, some 352 days until the start of the 2018 NBA Finals, and unless there's some seismic shift in the NBA's power structure or unless a major injury occurs, we know for a lock-it-in, guaranteed fact that the 2018 Finals will yet again be Cleveland versus Golden State. And that's a problem with the NBA, that a full four months before the season even begins, it's been rendered irrelevant in 28 of 30 markets.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Jun 13, 2017 14:22:30 GMT -5
Cavs constructed as they are, are still the best team in the east It's just hard being second place And what's unfortunate is that here we are, some 352 days until the start of the 2018 NBA Finals, and unless there's some seismic shift in the NBA's power structure or unless a major injury occurs, we know for a lock-it-in, guaranteed fact that the 2018 Finals will yet again be Cleveland versus Golden State. And that's a problem with the NBA, that a full four months before the season even begins, it's been rendered irrelevant in 28 of 30 markets. Yes that's the biggest unfortunate circumstance unless someone like Paul George go to Boston or Washington. For as much doom and gloom Cavs fans are acting right now, as constructed they are still the best team in the East without question. It's a two prong attack essentially, you have to first be better than the Cavs and then you are still ways behind Golden State unless they lose majority of their bench this offseason
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Ben Wyatt
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Post by Ben Wyatt on Jun 13, 2017 14:25:46 GMT -5
Probably surpass if they continue to be on teams stacked with future hall of famers while Lebron finds himself in the position of having to carry teams on his back. So now we find ourselves with this tired argument once again. Nothing is ever enough for LeBron James. He could join a team with Magic Johnson at point guard, Michael Jordan at shooting guard, Tim Duncan at power forward, and Shaquille O'Neal at center and it still wouldn't be enough for precious LeBron. I hate this retconning of LeBron James' career. The only team you could say that he carried to The Finals and had no chance of winning with were the 2007 Cavaliers. Every other team he's played on that has advanced to the championship round has been plenty good enough to win it all. He had Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh on the Heat teams, and both of them are surefire Hall of Famers. He's had Kyrie Irving on this Cavaliers team, who, as long as he continues to progress as he is, will be enshrined in Springfield. Kevin Love probably will be a Hall of Famer, too, but that's largely because the Basketball Hall of Fame is a laughingstock. But don't tell me this Cavaliers team wasn't good enough. Just because they faced off with a historically-loaded Warriors team doesn't mean LeBron James was the only player carrying the Cavaliers. And maybe, if this squad wasn't good enough, LeBron James should look in the mirror and blame the guy he sees for it being constructed this way. He's the one who said it was going to take patience and time and then immediately gave the thumbs-up to trading Andrew Wiggins for Kevin Love, hiring Tyronn Lue and canning David Blatt, and suffocating the Cavs' cap space when he implored the front office to give his buddies Tristan Thompson and J.R. Smith a combined $139 million. This team was good enough to win the championship and LeBron James didn't have to carry it. He had enough of a supporting cast to win. The Warriors were better. Just because Golden State is better than Cleveland doesn't suddenly make the Cavs paupers who had no right to advance to The Finals and only did so because LeBron willed them to it. www.youtube.com/watch?v=UGAi3yTjmXQ
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Crimson
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Post by Crimson on Jun 13, 2017 14:43:23 GMT -5
Probably surpass if they continue to be on teams stacked with future hall of famers while Lebron finds himself in the position of having to carry teams on his back. So now we find ourselves with this tired argument once again. Nothing is ever enough for LeBron James. He could join a team with Magic Johnson at point guard, Michael Jordan at shooting guard, Tim Duncan at power forward, and Shaquille O'Neal at center and it still wouldn't be enough for precious LeBron. I hate this retconning of LeBron James' career. The only team you could say that he carried to The Finals and had no chance of winning with were the 2007 Cavaliers. Every other team he's played on that has advanced to the championship round has been plenty good enough to win it all. He had Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh on the Heat teams, and both of them are surefire Hall of Famers. He's had Kyrie Irving on this Cavaliers team, who, as long as he continues to progress as he is, will be enshrined in Springfield. Kevin Love probably will be a Hall of Famer, too, but that's largely because the Basketball Hall of Fame is a laughingstock. But don't tell me this Cavaliers team wasn't good enough. Just because they faced off with a historically-loaded Warriors team doesn't mean LeBron James was the only player carrying the Cavaliers. And maybe, if this squad wasn't good enough, LeBron James should look in the mirror and blame the guy he sees for it being constructed this way. He's the one who said it was going to take patience and time and then immediately gave the thumbs-up to trading Andrew Wiggins for Kevin Love, hiring Tyronn Lue and canning David Blatt, and suffocating the Cavs' cap space when he implored the front office to give his buddies Tristan Thompson and J.R. Smith a combined $139 million. This team was good enough to win the championship and LeBron James didn't have to carry it. He had enough of a supporting cast to win. The Warriors were better. Just because Golden State is better than Cleveland doesn't suddenly make the Cavs paupers who had no right to advance to The Finals and only did so because LeBron willed them to it. Yep, this was the same conversation we were having last year when the Cavs found themselves down 3-1. For good or bad, this is the team Lebron constructed around him, playing for the coach that he specifically lobbied for. Sucks that the stars aligned in the perfect way where Golden State will have a stranglehold on the finals for the foreseeable future, the Cavs lineup is still a creation of his own making. So if the argument is really going to fall back to "Lebron doesn't have the right support" then frankly, that falls back on Lebron.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Jun 13, 2017 14:57:39 GMT -5
So now we find ourselves with this tired argument once again. Nothing is ever enough for LeBron James. He could join a team with Magic Johnson at point guard, Michael Jordan at shooting guard, Tim Duncan at power forward, and Shaquille O'Neal at center and it still wouldn't be enough for precious LeBron. I hate this retconning of LeBron James' career. The only team you could say that he carried to The Finals and had no chance of winning with were the 2007 Cavaliers. Every other team he's played on that has advanced to the championship round has been plenty good enough to win it all. He had Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh on the Heat teams, and both of them are surefire Hall of Famers. He's had Kyrie Irving on this Cavaliers team, who, as long as he continues to progress as he is, will be enshrined in Springfield. Kevin Love probably will be a Hall of Famer, too, but that's largely because the Basketball Hall of Fame is a laughingstock. But don't tell me this Cavaliers team wasn't good enough. Just because they faced off with a historically-loaded Warriors team doesn't mean LeBron James was the only player carrying the Cavaliers. And maybe, if this squad wasn't good enough, LeBron James should look in the mirror and blame the guy he sees for it being constructed this way. He's the one who said it was going to take patience and time and then immediately gave the thumbs-up to trading Andrew Wiggins for Kevin Love, hiring Tyronn Lue and canning David Blatt, and suffocating the Cavs' cap space when he implored the front office to give his buddies Tristan Thompson and J.R. Smith a combined $139 million. This team was good enough to win the championship and LeBron James didn't have to carry it. He had enough of a supporting cast to win. The Warriors were better. Just because Golden State is better than Cleveland doesn't suddenly make the Cavs paupers who had no right to advance to The Finals and only did so because LeBron willed them to it. Yep, this was the same conversation we were having last year when the Cavs found themselves down 3-1. For good or bad, this is the team Lebron constructed around him, playing for the coach that he specifically lobbied for. Sucks that the stars aligned in the perfect way where Golden State will have a stranglehold on the finals for the foreseeable future, the Cavs lineup is still a creation of his own making. So if the argument is really going to fall back to "Lebron doesn't have the right support" then frankly, that falls back on Lebron. It's a mixed bag. I don't hear a lot of fans complaining about LBJ having "lack of support" as much as it has been before. I think the media will put this all on the bag of his team with the qualification of LBJ averaged a triple double and the rest of ya'll didn't do shit. LBJ and Lue should get blame on this simply because they refused to change. This is a team that LBJ wanted and got. Cavs could of been a position to get a Paul George if they kept Wiggins and didn't proceed to overpay their players based upon Lebrons recommendation. Highest team payroll in the league and they are paying 20-30 million in penalty taxes. It's going to be hard to get veterans to except that minimum salary especially when Golden State is right there
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Jun 13, 2017 15:38:10 GMT -5
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Crimson
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Post by Crimson on Jun 13, 2017 16:04:23 GMT -5
I know Windhorst likes to Stan for Lebron, but that is such a terrible comparison for him to make. The problem with that article is Windhorst is citing a season where Jordan played less than quarter or the regular season after not playing Basektball for close to two-years.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Jun 13, 2017 16:10:55 GMT -5
I know Windhorst likes to Stan for Lebron, but that is such a terrible comparison for him to make. The problem with that article is Windhorst is citing a season where Jordan played less than quarter or the regular season after not playing Basektball for close to two-years. It's grasping at unnecessary straws. No matter what Lebron does he will not be perfect like MJ so comparing that aspect of the two is futile. If you want to make a case for Lebrons legacy it can be just as simple as hey what will people say if Lebron goes to the finals 13 times and won 6 rings. End of the day LBJ is not going to care he's 6-7 in the finals but the fact he's got 6 rings to show for a long career. Even Lebron passing MJ numbers is "hollow" in the sene when you considered MJ missed months playing baseball and spent time in college. Comparing them Stat to Stat is just futile. Lebrons legacy when compared to Jordan is in rings and he will not get the benefit of doubt when his team is 1A behind the the best team. He doesn't have a bunch of scrubs and hasn't in over 7 years
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Crimson
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Post by Crimson on Jun 13, 2017 16:23:01 GMT -5
I know Windhorst likes to Stan for Lebron, but that is such a terrible comparison for him to make. The problem with that article is Windhorst is citing a season where Jordan played less than quarter or the regular season after not playing Basektball for close to two-years. It's grasping at unnecessary straws. No matter what Lebron does he will not be perfect like MJ so comparing that aspect of the two is futile. If you want to make a case for Lebrons legacy it can be just as simple as hey what will people say if Lebron goes to the finals 13 times and won 6 rings. End of the day LBJ is not going to care he's 6-7 in the finals but the fact he's got 6 rings to show for a long career. Even Lebron passing MJ numbers is "hollow" in the sene when you considered MJ missed months playing baseball and spent time in college. Comparing them Stat to Stat is just futile. Lebrons legacy when compared to Jordan is in rings and he will not get the benefit of doubt when his team is 1A behind the the best team. He doesn't have a bunch of scrubs and hasn't in over 7 years I definitely agree there. I think once people step back and actually evaluate his career, they'll finally come to accept just how dominate of a player he really was, to the point where a 73-9 Warriors team had to go out and recruit Durant just to finally cement the edge over him.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Jun 13, 2017 16:27:00 GMT -5
It's grasping at unnecessary straws. No matter what Lebron does he will not be perfect like MJ so comparing that aspect of the two is futile. If you want to make a case for Lebrons legacy it can be just as simple as hey what will people say if Lebron goes to the finals 13 times and won 6 rings. End of the day LBJ is not going to care he's 6-7 in the finals but the fact he's got 6 rings to show for a long career. Even Lebron passing MJ numbers is "hollow" in the sene when you considered MJ missed months playing baseball and spent time in college. Comparing them Stat to Stat is just futile. Lebrons legacy when compared to Jordan is in rings and he will not get the benefit of doubt when his team is 1A behind the the best team. He doesn't have a bunch of scrubs and hasn't in over 7 years I definitely agree there. I think once people step back and actually evaluate his career, they'll finally come to accept just how dominate of a player he really was, to the point where a 73-9 Warriors team had to go out and recruit Durant just to finally cement the edge over him. Yes. Assuming Golden State reign last another 3 years and they win 2 more titles in that span than people will go back and see the fact that the best player in the world was the only one to beat them. Was their circumstances that lead to them losing a 3-1 lead, yes but he still defeated them. LBJ is smart enough at this point in his career to not fret over the record as of right now. Now if he goes to 2 more finals and losses than it hurts him a bit in sort of the way it hurt Jerry West.
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andrew8798
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Post by andrew8798 on Jun 13, 2017 18:55:14 GMT -5
Lebron trying to say he never played on a super team.
Come on now man
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Jun 13, 2017 19:05:10 GMT -5
Lebron trying to say he never played on a super team. Come on now man This guy. At least for every step backwards he always takes 2 steps forward
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Post by Cyno on Jun 13, 2017 19:13:07 GMT -5
Lebron trying to say he never played on a super team. Come on now man Uh yeah, The Lebron Heat was very much a superteam. Not as stacked with talent up and down the roster like Golden State and they certainly had their weaknesses, but Lebron and Wade are future hall-of-famers and Chris Bosh was a very solid third man, though his career sadly got sidelined by health issues out of his control. Add in some role players that stepped up at the right times during those two title runs, like a past-his-prime but still quite good Ray Allen and Mike Miller and they were quite super.
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BRV
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
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Post by BRV on Jun 13, 2017 19:25:47 GMT -5
Lebron trying to say he never played on a super team. Come on now man Who is LeBron James trying to fool? The 2010-11 Miami Heat invented the modern-day model of a superteam. Or do regular everyday teams hold garish celebrations with pyrotechnics and pomp and circumstance where they declare they're going to win "not four...not five...not six.." championships? Although this is probably brilliant strategy by LeBron James, he can say he never played on a superteam and since we're in the middle of the LeBronistas retconning his entire career, they'll probably go back and say, "Y'know, he's right! Dwyane Wade wasn't that good! Chris Bosh was a role player at best!" Also, if I'm Dwyane Wade, Chris Bosh, Kyrie Irving, or Kevin Love right now, I'm looking at LeBron James like "F**k you, man." Not only is the article a pathetic laughingstock, I'd imagine Brian Windhorst probably had the entire thing written before Game 1 of The Finals even began and ran it by LeBron a few times just to make sure it was to his liking. I wonder if Windhorst has lost all sense of pride or does the paycheck he cashes from the Worldwide Leader wash away whatever woes he may have about his career being LeBron James' media sock puppet.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Jun 13, 2017 19:29:59 GMT -5
Lebron trying to say he never played on a super team. Come on now man Who is LeBron James trying to fool? The 2010-11 Miami Heat invented the modern-day model of a superteam. Or do regular everyday teams hold garish celebrations with pyrotechnics and pomp and circumstance where they declare they're going to win "not four...not five...not six.." championships? Although this is probably brilliant strategy by LeBron James, he can say he never played on a superteam and since we're in the middle of the LeBronistas retconning his entire career, they'll probably go back and say, "Y'know, he's right! Dwyane Wade wasn't that good! Chris Bosh was a role player at best!" Also, if I'm Dwyane Wade, Chris Bosh, Kyrie Irving, or Kevin Love right now, I'm looking at LeBron James like "F**k you, man." I would say the Boston Celtics created the modern day super team more or less but that was through trades. I agree with everything else you said tho. It's hypocritical on his part and this is on the heels of him saying the other day he has no problems with superteams. If you have no problem, why don't you admit you was on one. Why did ya'll throw that big ass parade in Miami after you signed? Did he forget his comments of "not four", "not five" etc... in regards to how many rings they could win Shit like this is always bugs me with him Considering Windhorst has followed Lebron every where he has went and was the reason Draymond got suspended last year after he showed LBJ the footage, I would assume so.
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Post by Toilet Paper Roll on Jun 13, 2017 20:53:06 GMT -5
I love the buzz about what Cleveland can do to beat GS next season and a lot of talk of dumping Love's contract and trading him to Indiana for a year of Paul George and one last run at a title in Cleveland for Lebron.
This doesn't make Cleveland markedly better if better at all, and after next season Cleveland becomes abandoned again and left to rot.
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andrew8798
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Post by andrew8798 on Jun 13, 2017 20:56:24 GMT -5
It be funny if Bron leaves the Cavs next year if they don't win
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Jun 13, 2017 20:58:26 GMT -5
It be funny if Bron leaves the Cavs next year if they don't win If Lakers become good fast I wouldn't put it past him
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Jun 13, 2017 21:12:08 GMT -5
Another article from WindhorstThis time it's about who the Cavs should target to close the gap against the Warriors. A Paul George mention is in there. One executive joked "Hire Tonya Harding's ex-husband," and another one said "Sign Kevin Durant"
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