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Post by honsou on Jul 3, 2017 3:18:58 GMT -5
Yeah you don't go crazy. Could they sell out like...a college basketball arena in certain places that hold about 5 to 6k? Probably. But they should under no circumstances run a big arena.
The one exception I might make is if they made a plan to run NYC for one of their big events because that might get enough attention from their Japanese audience that they could get about 2 or 3k to fly out. I remember when they first announced G1 USA, basically every comment in Japanese either referenced NYC or MSG so take that for what you will
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Post by eJm on Jul 3, 2017 5:00:45 GMT -5
I really don't think they could. I'm sorry but it remains to be seen if this US expansion is a longterm thing in terms of interest. Of course interest was super high for these shows because it was the first set. No way you take a gamble and book a huge expensive building like that when there's no guarantee of the novelty still being profitable and big. so what would you propose my good sir?? Go for venues at the same size and go from there. If there is the same level of demand, you figure out a venue slightly bigger to go to for the next time. It's basic business logic. Don't try going big before you're ready, just slowly grow and progress, get people talking and see what happens. Heck, if the WWE tries to cut you off at points, you're probably doing something right at that point.
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Post by honsou on Jul 3, 2017 5:47:57 GMT -5
I mean we basically know what NJPW's business plan is. Have a dojo in the US, run a regular touring group that is 20% Japanese/other 80% American and runs in smaller buildings, then see where it goes from there.
I think how that actually works out will be interesting. There seems to be a decent amount of interest in a big NJPW show but on a regular basis what will attendance and hype look like? Management seems to think that they can get 500ish at a show and that seems reasonable enough with the right mix of talent. I would think in addition to that they could run 2 big shows a year in America one around this time of year and one in mid winter that could keep people really interested in the product.
A lot of people accuse NJPW right now to be shooting for the moon but from what I've seen they seem to understand where they are at and have achievable goals for the future. Probably the most out there goal is getting 100k subscribers to NJPW World but that doesn't seem too nuts
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Big Poppa Pumpkin
Dennis Stamp
I'll be in the back polishing............ my belt.
Posts: 4,987
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Post by Big Poppa Pumpkin on Jul 3, 2017 6:27:45 GMT -5
Damn shame they didn't put the IC strap on the Ass Man
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Post by 1 Free Moon-Down with Burger on Jul 3, 2017 9:54:13 GMT -5
I really don't think they could. I'm sorry but it remains to be seen if this US expansion is a longterm thing in terms of interest. Of course interest was super high for these shows because it was the first set. No way you take a gamble and book a huge expensive building like that when there's no guarantee of the novelty still being profitable and big. so what would you propose my good sir?? Maybe a slightly bigger building next time or the same size. Run similar sized shows for awhile until you've established yourself on firm ground. Not going from 20 to a million. I just remember the first 3 Dragon Gate USA shows where everyone is jazzed and super excited. Then the novelty wore off.
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Post by The Kevstaaa on Jul 3, 2017 10:27:25 GMT -5
NJPW G1 Special in USA July 1st, 2017 | Long Beach Convention Center in Long Beach, California | Attendance: 2,370
NJPW made their big debut in the United States. The show needed to deliver and sell well to make things a success. They sold out quickly and now it was up to the quality of the show itself. This was an ambitious move for NJPW and one that could prove to be one of the most pivotal in recent wrestling history. An IWGP Heavyweight Title match and a tournament to crown an unneeded (I’m with you Naito) US Champion awaited.
After a pretty cool video package, Jim Ross and Josh Barnett handled commentary. The setup for the arena felt way too much like Ring of Honor. I understand why, but I’d have liked something a bit more original.
Bad Luck Fale, Marty Scurll, Yujiro Takahashi and IWGP Jr. Heavyweight Tag Team Champions The Young Bucks vs. The Briscoes, Roppongi Vice and Will Ospreay Ah, Bullet Club vs. CHAOS will never die, huh? Bullet Club are ridiculously popular in the States (I’ll never understand why they still are), so opening with them was wise. A famous rivalry started things when Ospreay and Scurll went at it. Shortly after their interaction, things broke down with everyone going at it and the spots just kept coming, capped by an Ospreay SSP to the outside. I’m glad I didn’t do play-by-play, because this moved too quickly for it at times. Beretta continued his trend of taking big bumps in 2017, when he took a Bad Luck Fall onto a group of competitors outside. In the end, the Meltzer Driver was cut off, allowing Rocky to roll Matt up and win in 9:21. Exactly what I expected and what it needed to be. It got the crowd going, gave everyone a chance to shine and was a wild, fast-paced match. Plus, Rocky getting the win was cool since he apparently played a role in them coming to Long Beach. [***¼]
Hiromu Takahashi and NEVER Openweight Six Man Tag Team Champions BUSHI, EVIL and SANADA vs. Dragon Lee, Jushin Thunder Liger, Titan and Volador Jr After some announcement gaffes in the opener, there was another production issue with Hiromu’s theme here. JR blatantly admitted to not knowing the difference between BUSHI and EVIL. The LIDJ unit was way over, as was Liger. It’s awesome that Liger got to be part of this historic event. JR said the first time he saw Liger was against Brian Pillman in 1992 (that match is great, by the way). Liger took a short heat before we got a quick renewal of the amazing Lee/Takahashi rivalry. LIDK brought chairs into play on Titan, leading to Hiromu getting the win with Time Bomb at 6:44. While the opener had lots of energy, this fell flat. It might be the first time ever that a Bullet Club tag bested an LIDJ one. It wasn’t bad at all, just a solid little sprint. [**¼]
IWGP United States Heavyweight Championship Tournament Quarterfinals: Hangman Page vs. Jay Lethal Page jumped Lethal during his entrance. Lethal had his ribs taped and was selling an injury from ROH’s most recent PPV. That became the focus as Page wore him down and used moves like the abdominal stretch. If that doesn’t sound exciting in written form, believe me when I say it wasn’t much better in physical form. Lethal’s comeback wasn’t too great either. He ended things with a bad looking Lethal Injection at 8:30. Most people expected this to be the worst match of the tournament, yet it was still a disappointment. It was clunky, Page’s heat segment was dull and it never connected. I say this as someone who has been impressed by Page. [*½]
IWGP United States Heavyweight Championship Tournament Quarterfinals: Juice Robinson vs. Zack Sabre Jr. Unlike the previous outing, the crowd was invested in this throughout. Sabre immediately took to the mat, put the focus on Juice’s arm and proceeded to twist him like a pretzel. Juice’s rallies were well done, as it always felt like he was using fire and energy to combat the fact that Sabre was simply better. Each time Juice seemed to get something going, Sabre found an escape and got right back in control. When Juice powered out of an armbar and hit a powerbomb, it got one of the best pops of the night. Sabre excellently countered Pulp Friction into an Octopus Hold. Juice did everything to escape, but Sabre found ways to pull each arm away from the ropes and into more pain, causing Juice to submit at 10:04. The best thing on the show so far. Sabre as a controlling asshole always works, while Juice continued to portray one of the best natural underdog babyfaces in wrestling. [***½]
Billy Gunn, Sho Tanaka, Yohei Komatsu and YOSHITATSU vs. David Finlay, IWGP Intercontinental Champion Hiroshi Tanahashi, Jay White and IWGP Jr. Heavyweight and ROH World Television Champion KUSHIDA It’s great seeing White, Tanaka and Komatsu back in an NJPW ring. Not so much for YOSHITATSU. Komatsu working with KUSHIDA made for a fun exchange that was probably the highlight of this one. Gunn got major heat. The fans were not interested in seeing this old WWE guy in a New Japan ring. To be honest, I’ve never seen the appeal with Billy, even in his prime. They did a Gunn/Tanahashi faceoff to build to tomorrow’s title match. Tanahashi’s hot tag got a positive response before they Gunn flubbed a relatively easy spot. The finish saw a frenzy of offense (some better than others) and White get the win with a Flatliner on TATSU in 9:40. Outside of the KUSHIDA/Komatsu stuff and White getting the win, none of this worked for me. Gunn looked horrible, dropping Tanahashi and barely being able to take bumps. [*¾]
IWGP Tag Team Championship No Disqualifications Match: The Guerrillas of Destiny (c) vs. War Machine Before the bell, War Machine asked to make this No DQ since GOD cheated to beat them last time. That’s very American of them. There was a lot of brawling from the start. Some of it was dull and felt like time killing, but some of it was fun. GOD was alright, but War Machine was impressive again. Japan loves their brute like gaijins and War Machine fits that bill well. When it looked like they would win, Chase Owens made a run-in with a chair. Nobody seemed to recognize him, INCLUDING COMMENTARY! They barely mentioned it. Roa had the funniest moment, popping up after a series of moves, only to fall after a knee while remaining confident. War Machine won back their titles with Fallout through a table at 11:06. That table was tiny. This was alright. The weapons helped it stand out on this card, at least. The run-in was poorly done and another Tag Title change continues to make those belts seem pointless. [**¾]
IWGP United States Heavyweight Championship Tournament Quarterfinals: Tetsuya Naito vs. Tomohiro Ishii With Shibata done, I’d say Ishii and Naito have the best chemistry in all of wrestling. I’ve never given one of their matches less than four stars. Last year their New Japan Cup match got ****1/4 from me and the title match at Wrestling Dontaku got ****1/2. Another production gaffe when Ishii’s music played, then instantly turned to Naito’s. Naito started with a cheap shot and taunted. Like their NJC match last year, Naito was disrespectful, leading to Ishii kicking his ass for it. There were moments where we saw how well they know one another, countering signature moves. Ishii stopping a Naito rebound attack with a headbutt was great. the crowd loved Naito during his entrance, they got pulled into rooting for babyface Ishii. Ishii’s just so good in that role. There was a rare flub, as Naito botched the tornado DDT twice, but stayed with it and hit it on the third try. Both guys came close down the stretch, but Ishii continued to have Destino well scouted. Naito kicked out of two lariats, but couldn’t do the same after a brainbuster, losing in 15:51. Great, hard hitting match. It’s what the show needed. Their chemistry is top notch and, outside of the DDT spot, they nailed everything. Naito was a total dick who unmercifully went after the head, but Ishii was too tough for it to keep him down. This is somehow their worst match I’ve seen together. [****]
Ishii gets Sabre in the next round. We’ll also see it in the G1. Same for Ishii/Naito. And Omega/Elgin. So, yea.
IWGP United States Heavyweight Championship Tournament Quarterfinals: Kenny Omega w. The Young Bucks vs. Michael Elgin Last year, I gave their matches a lower score each time. **** for Road to Wrestling Dontaku, ***1/2 for the Dominion ladder match and ***1/4 for the G1 Climax. JR claimed Elgin never lost to Omega in a singles match, but he did in their first match last year. Omega had some fun with the Bucks and the referee early, but Elgin was all business. He looked focused and his strategy to overwhelming Omega with his power worked. Kenny used a series of counters to swing the momentum and nearly win via countout. From there, they proceeded to throw bombs at one another. Omega brought his best and still bumped and sold like an ace for Elgin. He completely folded when taking a wild German suplex on the apron. Not done, Elgin followed it with a middle rope crucifix bomb for one of the best near falls of the year. Out of desperation, Omega got an inside cradle for two, before trading strikes with Elgin. His hands weren’t gonna do it, so Omega started in with V-Trigger after V-Trigger. One came after Elgin dared him to bring it. On his second attempt, he hit the One Winged Angel to advance at 22:31. A wild match that was exactly what I wanted. It started slow, like a lot of big NJPW matches, but didn’t have the nonsense segment where limb work is done for the sake of it. They didn’t want to have the limb work effect the back half of the match, so they never went to it. Brilliant. That limb stuff has affected some big NJPW matches for me this year. This was their best match together. Just balls to the wall action, with Omega doing a fantastic job making Elgin’s offense look even better than usual. [****¼]
IWGP Heavyweight Championship: Kazuchika Okada (c) w/ Gedo vs. ROH World Champion Cody w/ Brandi Commentary did a good job selling how Okada is in enemy turf, which is rare. Cody added to it with an elaborate entrance, including his wife being decked out in an American flag dress. Though he wasn’t at home in Japan, Okada had the crowd behind him. Early on, this reminded me of Cody/Daniels. Cody did a lot of the stalling tactics we’ve seen, but I liked it more here. He took time to play into how much the crowd was against him. While Cody’s matches since leaving WWE have been consistently good (and far from great), the one thing he’s always excelled at is character work. Another production mistake came when they messed up the Rainmaker pose camera zoom. Kenny Omega arrived to add to the drama. Cody tried throwing in the towel for him at Dominion, so Kenny was gonna do it here. The Bucks stopped him and they argued while he tried to make Brandi do it, but she declined. Okada is tremendous at finishing stretches, which helped Cody here. Cody hit his own Rainmaker for a big near fall. He didn’t just want to win, he wanted to show up Omega. He tried the One Winged Angel, but Okada slipped out and hit a German. A Tombstone and Rainmaker later and Okada retained in 27:12. Possibly the best match of Cody’s career. It wasn’t a carry job either, like some would say. Cody was the star in the early stages (the part of Okada matches that tend to lack), while Okada made the finishing stretch work. The story of the Cody/Omega drama added a lot to the end, as Cody’s obsession with outplaying Omega cost him. [***¾]
Post-match, Omega cut a promo about how this is Okada’s night but he’ll beat him in the G1.
Overall: 7.5/10. I’d call this a successful debut for NJPW in the States. They delivered some quality New Japan matches, sprinkled in with some showcase stuff. To get the bad out of the way, I wasn’t a fan of Lethal/Page, the LIDJ tag (which shocked me) or the Tanahashi tag. Juice/Sabre was quietly awesome, while Naito/Ishii delivered the greatness we expect from them. Elgin/Omega ruled and was their best match ever, while Cody and Okada put on a quality main event that furthered the Bullet Club angle. Throw in a fun opener and a show that, despite being four hours, mostly flew by, and it gets a thumbs up.
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ronin705
Dennis Stamp
All Might
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Post by ronin705 on Jul 3, 2017 11:33:44 GMT -5
But what would be some similar sized venues in LA??
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Post by HMARK Center on Jul 3, 2017 11:38:04 GMT -5
Ok, a bit more detailed write up while we get ready to head for Long Beach airport:
-Again, the crowd on night one was a bit more annoying than might have come across on TV; not "hijacking the show" bad by any stretch, but a few too many people trying to get over chanting "10!" every time the ref started a count out, or making other pointless WWE references to try and get themselves over, or trying to imitate high pitched Japanese women voices yelling the wrestlers' names...which was funny for only the first 63 or so times somebody did it (poorly). Plus, yeah, there are no bleachers, but people in the first 7 or so rows kept feeling entitled to stand up and block everybody else's view of both the ring area AND the big screen that folks could've turned to look at if need be.
And yet...again, they weren't THAT bad (I think it bugged my girlfriend more, she's not as used to pro wrestling shows, though she says it did remind her of some of the more annoying folks she's seen at game/anime conventions), and they were red hot for the entirety of the weekend, plus they were a LOT more fun on Night 2; maybe everybody just needed a chance to get the annoying stuff out of their system on the first night. Still had issues with people standing during the main events, though; seriously, I get it, it's hard to resist when you get excited about what's happening, but try to have some consideration for the people around you.
-The crowd crapping all over Yoshitatsu was tongue-in-cheek and hilarious. I know Yoshi got next to nobody at his merch table during the meet and greet, but he was out and about during intermission and a lot of folks were going up to him to say thanks and to take pictures. Dude knows American crowds, he knows what was up.
-I had to watch Ishii/Sabre from the beer line due to a holdup there...and it was still epic from there. Kenny was spectacular in this tournament, but a great argument could be made that Ishii was the MVP, with three 4+ star matches.
-Cody and Billy Gunn got tons of heat, but Billy had fun with it and Cody heeled it up something fierce, so no harm in that. I did laugh that I got to see a straight up "Tana wins, LOL" match layout in person, though.
-HAKUUUUUUU!!!
-I got back from the bathroom just in time to mark out more than I could have imagined: as I got to my seat, people were chanting "WE WANT FALE! WE WANT FALE!" YOU'RE DAMN RIGHT YOU WANT FALE, THE GOLDEN SMILE OF THIS MAN.
-Again: Okada is a mega star. I don't know what to say to anybody who doubts him. Doesn't mean he has to be your favorites or that you can't find flaws, but man-oh-man.
-Didn't think Cody got "dominated" the way others might have, but yeah, Cody's not the guy you go to for a "dream match", he's storyline-dependent...which is fine, but will always have some issues in Japan given that he's not bilingual.
-Okada is a mega star, but Kenny is right there with him. Oozes charisma in person.
-Loved the RPG soft breakup, was afraid Trent would turn heel or something. Loved they did it that way, and loved how a lot of spots in that match made more sense once you realized it was the end of the road for RPG Vice.
-War Machine strapped up again...not going to WWE?
-I know some people dislike the 6, 8, or 10 man tags, but they were just pure fun, and the crowd ate them up. NOTICE! Dave Finlay got the pin in one of them, and Jay White got the pin in TWO of 'em. Big things on the horizon for those plus the Tempura Boyz, I think, especially as they pointed to KUSHIDA's belts.
-Huge markout for Ricochet's appearance, but still super sad that things have soured so badly between him and Lucha Underground.
-If we're doubting NJPW's ability to fill a big venue, just remember: the demand this year on Ticketmaster's servers indicated they likely could've sold enough seats to justify using the 13,000 seat arena attached to the Long Beach Convention Center. Doesn't guarantee they'd do it again, and yes, there' a novelty to being at the first show like this, but if they're only in the states once or twice a year? I think they have a legitimate shot there.
Great time, glad to have spent time here, and maybe we'll see them back here next year.
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Post by 1 Free Moon-Down with Burger on Jul 3, 2017 12:27:23 GMT -5
But what would be some similar sized venues in LA?? They could just run the same building honestly.
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chrom
Backup Wench
Master of the rare undecuple post
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Post by chrom on Jul 3, 2017 17:55:15 GMT -5
Lineup for Lion's Gate 7 which looks promising
Ren Narita debut vs Shota Umino
Tetsuhiro Yagi vs Taka Michinoku
Hiroyoshi Tenzan and Dinosaur Takuma vs Manabu Nakanishi and Katsuya Kitamura
Hirai Kawato vs Dick Togo
Satoshi Kojima vs Tomoyuki Oka
Yoshi Hashi vs Koji Iwamoto
Yuji Nagata vs Go Asakawa
Ayato Yoshida, who New Japan seemed to be high on and was going to be offering a contract soon it appeared, suffered a fractured jaw which is sidelining him for the next couple months so Go is filling in for him.
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Post by honsou on Jul 3, 2017 20:01:10 GMT -5
The fact that they are trusting Kawato to against Togo just shows how much they think of Kawato. That match is going to be great!
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StuntGranny®
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Not Actually a Granny
Posts: 16,099
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Post by StuntGranny® on Jul 3, 2017 23:00:29 GMT -5
Okada was backstage at Raw tonight (7/3). Let the speculation/panic/depression commence.
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Post by 1 Free Moon-Down with Burger on Jul 3, 2017 23:09:19 GMT -5
Okada was backstage at Raw tonight (7/3). Let the speculation/panic/depression commence. Ah it's only a 5 hour drive to Phoenix. That said. He's totally interrupting Cena on tuesday. 100%.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 4, 2017 0:11:03 GMT -5
They released the dm....
Truly a historic day in prowrestling.
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Post by ________ has left the building on Jul 4, 2017 5:21:32 GMT -5
Okada was backstage at Raw tonight (7/3). Let the speculation/panic/depression commence. He was visiting friends but last time he hang around a WWE show namely Wrestlemania, Bushiroad gave him a huge pay raise to keep Okada in NJPW and did a special multi year contract to insure that.
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chrom
Backup Wench
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Post by chrom on Jul 4, 2017 7:44:11 GMT -5
LG7 was a good show. Ren looked alright in his debut and the main event was fun. So was Oka vs Kojima and Hashi vs Iwamoto.
Nagata after the show announced his intention of reviving The Young Lion's Cup, which was last held in 05 and won by Goto.
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Post by HMARK Center on Jul 4, 2017 10:14:26 GMT -5
I did mean to add before:
On Saturday my girlfriend and I drove out to the La Brea Tar Pits and museum (I grew up a huge dinosaur/fossil fan, and being a little kid in the 80s and liking fossils meant always hearing about it, so I had to see it with my own eyes), but it was when we got back to the hotel to eat lunch that we pulled up and saw a random guy standing in the street, seemingly blocking our entrance. That was annoying, but it turned out he was probably with, yep, Tetsuya Naito, who was standing near the front door of the hotel with a small suitcase that probably had his wrestling gear. Took me a good three seconds for my brain to finally click and go "Um...that's Naito."
We parked in the deck next to the hotel, step out, and sure enough there's the rest of LIJ, all getting ready to load into a car to head down the street to the venue to get ready. For anybody wondering, EVIL was wearing all black, Sanada's hair was not yet spiked and looked perfectly normal, we couldn't recognize BUSHI quickly enough without his mask, and Hiromu was already wearing his multi-colored suit of insanity AND carrying Daryl the Cat/Mochineko around outside his bags. Did find it kind of hilarious that it worked out that way.
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Post by ________ has left the building on Jul 4, 2017 12:03:31 GMT -5
New Japan is missing out on big money by not making Daryl dolls.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Jul 4, 2017 13:22:58 GMT -5
Okada was backstage at Raw tonight (7/3). Let the speculation/panic/depression commence. He was visiting friends but last time he hang around a WWE show namely Wrestlemania, Bushiroad gave him a huge pay raise to keep Okada in NJPW and did a special multi year contract to insure that. Yea Okada is not going anywhere, anytime soon as NJPW made sure of that. Besides that Okada is the true ace of the company and he has no real reason to leave until the next young one is coming up to surpass him (which won't be for a good while) and as seen with Nak it's never too late to make that jump
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Post by 1 Free Moon-Down with Burger on Jul 4, 2017 13:31:37 GMT -5
He was visiting friends but last time he hang around a WWE show namely Wrestlemania, Bushiroad gave him a huge pay raise to keep Okada in NJPW and did a special multi year contract to insure that. Yea Okada is not going anywhere, anytime soon as NJPW made sure of that. Besides that Okada is the true ace of the company and he has no real reason to leave until the next young one is coming up to surpass him (which won't be for a good while) and as seen with Nak it's never too late to make that jump Yeah. Okada has no reason to leave at all. Nakamura was third on the pecking order and getting older. He was right to bounce.
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