Bruce: Vince cares if you're larger than life, not workrate

[héad.casé]

Conrad brings up what Bruce said in the Doink episode about the office thinking Doink could headline WrestleMania with a circus theme and how ridiculous that notion is to fans. He makes that comparison to why Vince thinks Honky Tonk Man was a good pairing for Billy. Bruce says he would go scout talent and tell Vince how good of a worker or talent certain guys were. Vince didn’t care. He just wanted to know if they could headline WrestleMania. When you scout talent from that perspective, you have to go through that exercise. There are a lot of guys who are good workers. Vince just doesn’t care. He wants them to be a good worker, be larger than life, and talk people into the building.

www.pwpodcasts.com/2017/11/14/written-podcast-recap-something-wrestle-bruce-prichard-new-age-outlaws-smoking-gunns-roadie-rockabilly-degeneration-x-invading-wcw-vince-likes-watch-tv-ep-72/

[Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-]]

And yet none of that still explains how Jinder Mahal: World Champion happened...

[segaz]

The office seriously tossed around Doink themed Wrestlemania? I hope it was as heel Doink

[eJm]

Considering they’ve done everything in their power to stop stars from being created in the last 10 years or so, I’m finding this harder to believe.

Even the simplest thing of your cheers being too loud seems to be treated like blasphemy.

[Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-]]

Nov 27, 2017 6:13:13 GMT -5 eJm said:

Considering they’ve done everything in their power to stop stars from being created in the last 10 years or so, I’m finding this harder to believe.

Even the simplest thing of your cheers being too loud seems to be treated like blasphemy.

That's because they cheer for the heels constantly because they're better written for the faces you're supposed to cheer for who are either bland, more overpowered than the Villains on a consistent basis, or they just constantly lose all the time so who the hell should care about their progression when it's a cliff? 

So when the Heels are cheered it's like a punishment for not doing their job correctly when in reality they're doing their job perfectly and that's what the crowd LIKES, because the other half of the coin is so shit. But instead stuff like Bad News Barrett dies, because being over doesn't register as making money regardless of the reaction apparently, especially when you're supposed to be an Evil British Person apparently...

My favorite is when a Wrestler is heatless as a Face, they turn them heel, they develop a personality, people love them, and instead of suddenly capitalizing on the fact they've immensely improved and suddenly got to the point you want them, they get stagnated and fed to the next bland face no one cares about.

This has quite frankly been the cycle since the definitive Orton/Cena Era of dudes, and the only thing that stops is is a Daniel Bryan level coup, and even when that happens, life gets in the way... and now we get the new rumors and articles about Vince not getting why Finn isn't over, or Vince doesn't see Finn as over or a main event Talent, or nobody could care about him, like it's his fault the booking and stories are terrible, and invests zero effort into why shit in NXT constantly works and his shit doesn't, almost IMMEDIATELY. 

We're literally at the point where Vince is reportedly telling a ref to stop pausing after saying "ONE FALL" because he sees it as the ref marking for himself and not the fans investing in it, that's how sad the state is right now, where that is what Vince sees when a reaction happens... and it's only seemingly gonna get worse if Mania goes as it is fearfully planned. 

[Oh Cry Me a Screwball]

Nov 27, 2017 5:56:36 GMT -5 Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-] said:

And yet none of that still explains how Jinder Mahal: World Champion happened...

Actually, I kind of get Jinder Mahal's push in this case. Jinder might not be much of a worker or a promo, but he does really carry himself as a "modern day Maharaja" in terms of his look and his confidence better than most of the actual main eventers.

[Bo Rida]

Then Braun should vanquish Brock at WM.

[Deleted]

Nov 27, 2017 6:29:29 GMT -5 Oh Cry Me a Screwball said:

Nov 27, 2017 5:56:36 GMT -5 Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-] said:

And yet none of that still explains how Jinder Mahal: World Champion happened...

Actually, I kind of get Jinder Mahal's push in this case. Jinder might not be much of a worker or a promo, but he does really carry himself as a "modern day Maharaja" in terms of his look and his confidence better than most of the actual main eventers.

Yeah this is an area he excels in. He's got the look and presence of a big deal now. Even in interviews outside of the company he's got that.

[The Thread Barbi]

Nov 27, 2017 5:56:36 GMT -5 Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-] said:

And yet none of that still explains how Jinder Mahal: World Champion happened...

Can't you tell?

[kidkamikaze10]

If there is one thing Mahal has, it's presence.

Problem is, in this day and age, that workrate/match story repetition problem sours fans on him.


I see Vince's point. But I also think his idea of larger than life is dated.

[OVO 40 hunched over like he 80]

Nov 27, 2017 6:03:33 GMT -5 segaz said:

The office seriously tossed around Doink themed Wrestlemania? I hope it was as heel Doink

It was Alabama Doink...

Back to what Bruce said, apparently McMahon when deciding a top guy, he tries to picture him doing press conferences and talking to reporters to see if he can become that main draw.

That being said, Vince is the absolute worst while judging talent, this is the same guy who didn't saw Steve Austin as a draw and didn't wanted to hire Mick Foley, while at the same time he thought that Marc Mero got a bigger contract than them.

Vince McMahon also thought the future of the company was Mark Henry not The Rock lol.

Vince is the greatest wrestling promoter of all time but when it comes to judging talent he's the absolute shits.

[thetower52]

Nov 27, 2017 7:29:04 GMT -5 The Thread Barbi said:

Nov 27, 2017 5:56:36 GMT -5 Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-] said:

And yet none of that still explains how Jinder Mahal: World Champion happened...

Can't you tell?

All natural

[Can you afford to pay me, Gah]

Nov 27, 2017 11:30:20 GMT -5 kidkamikaze10 said:

If there is one thing Mahal has, it's presence.

Problem is, in this day and age, that workrate/match story repetition problem sours fans on him.


I see Vince's point. But I also think his idea of larger than life is dated.

There are a couple problems I see here, The first is Vince or the WWE is they still to relying on stars from Ten years ago and to afraid to push anybody and keep that guy there to allow the time to become that mega star he looking for. You can't create your next big thing is your yo yo everyone who isn't a star you created Ten years ago. That fact for so many years Cena destroyed pushes on some of what could have been your next era of stars. I'm looking at Rusev who plenty of talent and a good look. Yet Cena came alone and killed it all.You had Bray Wyatt before that red hot going into a feud with Cena and boom falls down the ladder bounces up and faces the Undertaker post streak ending and falls down again.

The other thing is not listen to the fans responses, who is consistently over with the fans? Roman Reigns is his guy for whatever reason but fans boo him regardless what you do with him. So why still make the plans? Yet you got Braun who is over,great look, and a rare deal. Look over the indies and so forth. Finding a Giant is hard to fine. Big Show is on his way out. Braun is the next giant and shouldn't have lost to Brock clean after one finisher after Braun beat the hell out of him. That put him a step back, and that's my point. Work rate to a degree is true but you have to pay attention to who is getting the response. Braun to me is more the guy that Reigns. It's kind of like the Undertaker on how he should be booked in the scent of you do everything to put him out for good but he keeps coming. It's an easy formula that can work. Big guy goes around destroying people and looking like a psycho doing it. Making people fear him and do whatever they can to stop him. The best part outside of the ring, he seems to be a great PR guy. Nice guy which is what you want right?

Yes there is always a need for a work rate guy who is over. They have them and can make you non as talented workers look good. That is why AJ is over because he so damn good and what he does.

[The Blue Nova]

I agree with everything that is said in here. That is why I think Vince's comment about people not wanting to grab the brass ring is a bunch of bunk.I can name several wrestlers who got over on there own but never was pushed. So I think the only way to grab the brass ring or pushed is if Vince likes you.

[corndog]

This definitely covers many of Vince's decisions and pushes from the past. Hogan, Savage(even though he was a good worker), Ultimate Warrior, preferring Shawn to Bret, and even going to Cena who has the ability to talk people into the door. But it doesn't explain Roman Reigns, yeah he has the look, but he is much better worker than personality.

[Deleted]

Nov 27, 2017 12:39:23 GMT -5 corndog said:

This definitely covers many of Vince's decisions and pushes from the past. Hogan, Savage(even though he was a good worker), Ultimate Warrior, preferring Shawn to Bret, and even going to Cena who has the ability to talk people into the door. But it doesn't explain Roman Reigns, yeah he has the look, but he is much better worker than personality.

Exactly, he has the look.

Might also be a hard worker backstage, first to arrive, last to leave etc.

[Dub H]

Nov 27, 2017 12:39:23 GMT -5 corndog said:

This definitely covers many of Vince's decisions and pushes from the past. Hogan, Savage(even though he was a good worker), Ultimate Warrior, preferring Shawn to Bret, and even going to Cena who has the ability to talk people into the door. But it doesn't explain Roman Reigns, yeah he has the look, but he is much better worker than personality.

It comes to Vince definition of alrger than life.

Slight muscular,tanned, strong jaw, Long straight black hair.

I'm sure for Vince he looks like a top hollywood star(inb4 The Rock)

[thegame415]

I agree with Vince. Has workrrate ever sold huge? It’s a business, and if you don’t like what the business has, find another thing. Maybe you don’t like Subway, so try Jimmy John’s.

To me, the best wrestlers are good storytellers. They don’t just jump around and kick out of finishers for a 4 and 1/2 star rating. They don’t sit like a log, either.

Bret Hart, to me, was such a great storyteller. He knew strengths and weaknesses and could help his opponents telll a story.

Undertaker is a great storyteller. When they let him start telling more stories, and showed some vulnerability, he was better than ever.

[Dub H]

Nov 27, 2017 12:45:46 GMT -5 thegame415 said:

I agree with Vince. Has workrrate ever sold huge?

Bryan and Bret are pretty much workrate guys.

Honestly,telling a story IS part of a workrate,it is not just putting smooth moves.But it defitely helps

The things you are saying are pretty much the things Vince DOESN'T care. Hell,he told people to NOT sell if you are a face.This is what he is saying,he doesn't care if people tell a story or put a good match.(Suplex City for example).

He cares if you look and act like a superhero

Even ignoring most of the storytelling aspect,just look at Braun,he has the presence Vince loves,but what put him at another level is that he has workrate

[corndog]

Nov 27, 2017 12:43:03 GMT -5 Dub H said:

Nov 27, 2017 12:39:23 GMT -5 corndog said:

This definitely covers many of Vince's decisions and pushes from the past. Hogan, Savage(even though he was a good worker), Ultimate Warrior, preferring Shawn to Bret, and even going to Cena who has the ability to talk people into the door. But it doesn't explain Roman Reigns, yeah he has the look, but he is much better worker than personality.

It comes to Vince definition of alrger than life.

Slight muscular,tanned, strong jaw, Long straight black hair.

I'm sure for Vince he looks like a top hollywood star(inb4 The Rock)

I get what you are saying, but in the past it seemed like personality was a big factor as well.