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Post by Clash, Never a Meter Maid on Jun 18, 2018 9:55:50 GMT -5
So say you've got a promotion that specializes in intergender wrestling. There's an Intercontinental, or some equivalent of a mid-card title that all the performers can compete for, and it's held by a female wrestler.
A male heel wrestler comes out to make a challenge for the belt, and she accepts. Over the next few weeks, the buildup isn't based around the genders of either wrestler at all. The female face is treating this heel like any other competitor. The heel isn't saying anything chauvinistic, or really anything to imply that he's better because he's male. But they are talking a lot of "you're a chump/you can't beat me/I'm gonna whip your ass/I'm the better wrestler" smack towards each other. The press conferences are heated. There are back-and-forth shoves, officials have to separate them. They've gotten into each other's heads.
When it's time for the big title defense, there's no feeling out period, it just opens with a slugfest. Think along the lines of Bret/Austin at WM13. They fight into the crowd, and there are big spots in the ring. She whacks him in the back with a chair, he gets a powerbomb on her through a table. There's a double down spot. Eventually, she retains, but she wages an absolute war to pull it off.
Now, if the announcers sold them as equals, if they didn't freak out over the female wrestler's safety, and they didn't pat themselves on the back for how progressive they were being, and it was just treated as a classic encounter....could this possibly get over with a large audience? At least on a scale bigger than CHIKARA or Lucha Underground's intergender stuff?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2018 10:14:53 GMT -5
I hope not. I know a lot of people enjoy intergender stuff and its seen as (and likely is) highly progressive, but any man on woman violence makes me deeply, exceptionally uncomfortable. I would likely stop watching/avoid the whole promotion for a long time.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2018 10:44:28 GMT -5
It can work, but only with an audience that is "open minded enough" to accept it from a creative standpoint. In other words, not on a national level. What CZW did with the Mia Yim vs. Greg Excellent feud several years ago worked for what it was as a male vs. female blood feud and series of matches for that audience.
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kidkamikaze10
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Post by kidkamikaze10 on Jun 18, 2018 11:15:39 GMT -5
Hailey Hatred had one back in the day, as did Nicole Matthews with Bishop.
It works and it can be really good.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2018 11:32:50 GMT -5
There's a Necro Butcher/ Lufisto death match that they worked pretty evenly. Most people can't take and sell a beating like Necro, though.
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pegasuswarrior
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Post by pegasuswarrior on Jun 18, 2018 11:45:23 GMT -5
Bill Alfonso and Beulah McGillicutty ... on paper, this doesn’t seem like it would work. But the feud—BLOOD FEUD AT THAT—and match was amazing.
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Post by rnrk supports BLM on Jun 18, 2018 12:12:23 GMT -5
I absolutely think Taya could pull this off with the right opponent.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2018 13:05:27 GMT -5
I mean, I know you mentioned them in the post as a small scale example of it but Lucha Underground could definitely pull this off.
Heck, they sort of did with Penta and Lotus looking to hurt each other.
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Jun 18, 2018 17:19:46 GMT -5
Not anymore. Proof of that was the negative reaction Chris Dickinson got by doing a chair shot spot with a female.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2018 18:29:10 GMT -5
Not anymore. Proof of that was the negative reaction Chris Dickinson got by doing a chair shot spot with a female. I remember that. Not only did you have Chris Dickinson in a Speedo beating up a girl half his size with a chair. He give her a botch razor edge/border toss into a ringbell then he pin her in a sexually position.
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Post by 06vwgti on Jun 18, 2018 18:50:57 GMT -5
The USWA stuff had quite a bit of man on women violence, but I don't recall any blood feud with say jacqueline/miss texas?
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Jun 18, 2018 19:04:02 GMT -5
The USWA stuff had quite a bit of man on women violence, but I don't recall any blood feud with say jacqueline/miss texas? I may be wrong but I don't remember Miss Texas ever blading there
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Jun 18, 2018 19:08:59 GMT -5
Not anymore. Proof of that was the negative reaction Chris Dickinson got by doing a chair shot spot with a female. I remember that. Not only did you have a Chris Dickinson in a Speedo beating up a girl half his size with a chair. He give her a botch razor edge/border toss into a ringbell then he pin her in a sexually position. And that's why we can't have nice things lol, yeah not a good look for Dickinson or the promotion. It's the wrong kind of heat. I'll give another example, shortly after Benoit killed his wife in 07, pwg did an angle about Human Tornado beating up his former valet Candice Lerae, Candice even bladed, HTizzle gave her an uncomfortable looking beating even using weapons, he even put Candice on the crossface... Well pwg had to apologize on their own YouTube channel and put a disclaimer that it was a storyline gone wrong. PWG was the same company that had Super Dragon legit try to kill Steen...
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Post by 06vwgti on Jun 18, 2018 22:22:38 GMT -5
The USWA stuff had quite a bit of man on women violence, but I don't recall any blood feud with say jacqueline/miss texas? I may be wrong but I don't remember Miss Texas ever blading there One of the USWA episodes I was watching advertised a first blood match with Luna, but it was never televised, Im guessing memphis shenanigans occurred
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Cranjis McBasketball
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Jun 19, 2018 1:48:27 GMT -5
Not really. Be in that moment for real. I was at the bar with my buddy, he's far more reactionary than I. It's a local bar, so a busy night is like 20 people. Anyway, this girl said something to my buddy that upset him. He was furious. He gave me her details in his rage. I said, "What are you gonna do? Go fight a 18 year old girl?" We were like 30 at the time. We left the bar at his instance, whereupon he punched a stop sign.
Nobody wants to see a girl get hit.
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Jun 19, 2018 2:26:55 GMT -5
Not on a national level.
Especially in places like the WWE where Nia Jax probably the largest Woman they have... is still shorter than most of the roster.
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Post by Ronny Rayguns Is All Elite on Jun 19, 2018 6:50:05 GMT -5
Bill Alfonso and Beulah McGillicutty ... on paper, this doesn’t seem like it would work. But the feud—BLOOD FEUD AT THAT—and match was amazing. I came in to mention this, oddly enough this mainly worked because it looked like two people who didn't know how to work and just went out there awkwardly wailing on one another.
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Post by eJm on Jun 19, 2018 7:36:46 GMT -5
Not anymore. Proof of that was the negative reaction Chris Dickinson got by doing a chair shot spot with a female. There’s a lot more context to that outrage, considering part of it was him doing some of those without consent or way tougher than intended (don’t remember the full reasoning, it was a while ago). It is kind of like saying men and women can’t fight each other in blockbusters because people didn’t like a vivid domestic abuse scene in a Hallmark movie. The context between the two is as wide and deep as the Grand Canyon. Like anything, context is needed.
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Jun 19, 2018 8:52:29 GMT -5
Not anymore. Proof of that was the negative reaction Chris Dickinson got by doing a chair shot spot with a female. There’s a lot more context to that outrage, considering part of it was him doing some of those without consent or way tougher than intended (don’t remember the full reasoning, it was a while ago). It is kind of like saying men and women can’t fight each other in blockbusters because people didn’t like a vivid domestic abuse scene in a Hallmark movie. The context between the two is as wide and deep as the Grand Canyon. Like anything, context is needed. This ain't a blockbuster movie, this rasslin and the op asked if a violent intergender program could work. It can't, Bubbah Ray can't powerbomb women anymore through a table. In a post Benoit post Rihanna's pictures, death match intergender matches are a dead brand.
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Post by eJm on Jun 19, 2018 9:05:10 GMT -5
There’s a lot more context to that outrage, considering part of it was him doing some of those without consent or way tougher than intended (don’t remember the full reasoning, it was a while ago). It is kind of like saying men and women can’t fight each other in blockbusters because people didn’t like a vivid domestic abuse scene in a Hallmark movie. The context between the two is as wide and deep as the Grand Canyon. Like anything, context is needed. This ain't a blockbuster movie, this rasslin and the op asked if a violent intergender program could work. Sure, but your example makes the same amount of sense as my example, hence me saying it. In WWE sure, but I've known for a fact shows have sold out in the past few years alone on inter-gender deathmatches. Hell, this past weekend Evil Uno and Jimmy Havoc were in a Lego Deathmatch against Rhia O'Rielly and Addy Starr. Many posters here who watch the indies could probably name dozens and dozens of matches that happen Post Benoit. It's a much more growing brand than you think it is, at least on the indies. Now whether it'll happen in the next 5 years in WWE, probably not. 10? I wouldn't rule it out.
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