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Post by Joe Neglia on Jul 21, 2019 1:17:43 GMT -5
Alfred Konuwa is a sportswriter who covers pro wrestling for Forbes (yes, apparently, this is a real job) and was interviewed by NPR radio regarding the WWE's drop in ratings. Nothing new here really, and we even have to deal with the "fake?" trope, but it's interesting to see that this is not happening in a bubble and that entities like Forbes and NPR are turning some amount of attention to this. www.npr.org/2019/07/20/743709270/once-a-juggernaut-wwe-sees-its-ratings-tank
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 21, 2019 1:23:06 GMT -5
I'm really glad that he went out of his way to shoot down that, "You know, a lot of these people think this is real," stupidity.
But yeah, is an interesting read, although not really any new information. Do definitely agree though that at this point WWE would struggle hard with trying to make themselves look cool no matter what they do because they've just worn being out of date, tired, and corporate for too long at this point.
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Post by Limity (BLM) on Jul 21, 2019 2:15:49 GMT -5
I heard this this morning on my way home from work. He's mostly right, from what I read on here.
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Post by The Legendary Ring Troll {BLM} on Jul 21, 2019 2:21:39 GMT -5
I read a Forbes article the other day about WWE. The third sentence started with “Speaking with SportsKeeda ....”, which was the entirety of their source for the article, so I stopped reading. Forbes needs to up their game.
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Post by Aceorton on Jul 21, 2019 2:26:07 GMT -5
You have to wonder what the McMahons think of this kind of coverage from legit news outlets. This has now gone way beyond internet fans grumbling and the occasional crowd hijacking in a "smart" city. This is the WWE's creative machine being outed as a suckfest by people in the larger TV and entertainment industries, with Vince himself identified as one of the main obstacles to his own company's success. You can't just chest-puff and keep doing things the same way at this point, especially if you're a publicly traded company. Or maybe, if you're Vince, you're so arrogant that you believe you can do exactly that.
I don't think WWE is quite into MySpace territory where they're beyond turning things around. I mean, look at the WWF in 1994. It was so uncool it hurt. Three years later, they ditched most of the cartoon crap and caught fire. But it's because they realized their survival was at stake against WCW and knew they needed to change. Here, I think they don't realize it yet because they're not financially in the same dire straits. But how soon until that noose tightens? It seems unavoidable unless Vince backs off the overscripting and starts giving fans more of what they want, or unless the rest of the family can muscle him out somehow.
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Post by eJm on Jul 21, 2019 2:30:56 GMT -5
You have to wonder what the McMahons think of this kind of coverage from legit news outlets. This has now gone way beyond internet fans grumbling and the occasional crowd hijacking in a "smart" city. This is the WWE's creative machine being outed as a suckfest by people in the larger TV and entertainment industries, with Vince himself identified as one of the main obstacles to his own company's success. You can't just chest-puff and keep doing things the same way at this point, especially if you're a publicly traded company. Or maybe, if you're Vince, you're so arrogant that you believe you can do exactly that. I don't think WWE is quite into MySpace territory where they're beyond turning things around. I mean, look at the WWF in 1994. It was so uncool it hurt. Three years later, they ditched most of the cartoon crap and caught fire. But it's because they realized their survival was at stake against WCW and knew they needed to change. Here, I think they don't realize it yet because they're not financially in the same dire straits. But how soon until that noose tightens? It seems unavoidable unless Vince backs off the overscripting and starts giving fans more of what they want, or unless the rest of the family can muscle him out somehow. It might be a bit of a cop out to say “We’ll find out in 5 years” but...well, after the TV deals come up for renewal...we’ll find out in 5 years. Like, right now they’re making the TV money regardless (whether FOX or USA approve of that amount or not, that’s their bed to lay in) and we’ll be 6-7 years into a Saudi deal which’ll mean WWE might have to rely on that more for cash. But US TV is their bread and butter and whether they’ve turned it around or kept going down will determine their future going into the last few years of the Saudi deal. There are a tonne of variables here but also the fact that even if Vince were to pass on at that time, you still have to have a transition period of what direction things are going in, who will lead the company, who will they have around them, big stuff like that.
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Bo Rida
Fry's dog Seymour
Pulled one over on everyone. Got away with it, this time.
Posts: 23,643
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Post by Bo Rida on Jul 21, 2019 6:04:26 GMT -5
Nintendo or Disney animation seem better comparisons?
First name many think of in their respective fields. Decades long history of beloved output/characters. Have gone through various slumps before bouncing back. Remained financially healthy with lots of popular elements even in slumps.
You can't compare decades old companies with healthy foundations with one that had a brief period on top.
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Post by Alice Syndrome on Jul 21, 2019 6:44:08 GMT -5
You have to wonder what the McMahons think of this kind of coverage from legit news outlets. This has now gone way beyond internet fans grumbling and the occasional crowd hijacking in a "smart" city. This is the WWE's creative machine being outed as a suckfest by people in the larger TV and entertainment industries, with Vince himself identified as one of the main obstacles to his own company's success. You can't just chest-puff and keep doing things the same way at this point, especially if you're a publicly traded company. Or maybe, if you're Vince, you're so arrogant that you believe you can do exactly that. I don't think WWE is quite into MySpace territory where they're beyond turning things around. I mean, look at the WWF in 1994. It was so uncool it hurt. Three years later, they ditched most of the cartoon crap and caught fire. But it's because they realized their survival was at stake against WCW and knew they needed to change. Here, I think they don't realize it yet because they're not financially in the same dire straits. But how soon until that noose tightens? It seems unavoidable unless Vince backs off the overscripting and starts giving fans more of what they want, or unless the rest of the family can muscle him out somehow. It might be a bit of a cop out to say “We’ll find out in 5 years” but...well, after the TV deals come up for renewal...we’ll find out in 5 years. Like, right now they’re making the TV money regardless (whether FOX or USA approve of that amount or not, that’s their bed to lay in) and we’ll be 6-7 years into a Saudi deal which’ll mean WWE might have to rely on that more for cash. But US TV is their bread and butter and whether they’ve turned it around or kept going down will determine their future going into the last few years of the Saudi deal. There are a tonne of variables here but also the fact that even if Vince were to pass on at that time, you still have to have a transition period of what direction things are going in, who will lead the company, who will they have around them, big stuff like that. Yeah, they got significantly worse while the ink was still wet on the FOX deal, this could be a delayed reaction f***up if AEW steals a chunk of the audience and maintains it.
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Post by Citizen Snips on Jul 21, 2019 6:48:30 GMT -5
So AEW's gonna sell all my information and expose my personal info to hackers? Pass.
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Post by Sir Woodrow on Jul 21, 2019 8:11:47 GMT -5
So AEW's gonna sell all my information and expose my personal info to hackers? Pass. The Young Bucks are looking at all your family photos as we speak
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BorneAgain
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 20,312
Member is Online
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Post by BorneAgain on Jul 21, 2019 8:16:10 GMT -5
Does that make TNA Friendster or Google Plus in this analogy?
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nisidhe
Hank Scorpio
O Superman....O judge....O Mom and Dad....
Posts: 5,729
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Post by nisidhe on Jul 21, 2019 8:39:55 GMT -5
I'm quite glad that the issue with the promos came up in that interview. When you have 26 writers working on material blind (not in direct communication with the talent - where in fact it'd discouraged) and then filtering that material through Vince who then micromanages every aspect of his business, even in defiance of what fans may want, the frustration for audiences leads either to hate-watching or to simply turning it off or changing the channel. It's not that it's seen as this huge corporate structure - it's that it's come to ignore or even to go against the wishes of its audiences, thinking that the audiences will stick around no matter what.
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Post by thegame415 on Jul 21, 2019 10:53:09 GMT -5
Does that make TNA Friendster or Google Plus in this analogy? Xanga.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 21, 2019 10:58:10 GMT -5
there's so many hours of tv that each becomes less important
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Post by Cyno on Jul 21, 2019 11:00:18 GMT -5
Nintendo or Disney animation seem better comparisons? First name many think of in their respective fields. Decades long history of beloved output/characters. Have gone through various slumps before bouncing back. Remained financially healthy with lots of popular elements even in slumps. You can't compare decades old companies with healthy foundations with one that had a brief period on top. I've said it before but WWE is Disney in the Eisner-era. Eisner and McMahon are two people cut very much from the same cloth. Only real difference is that Eisner was forced out of his position eventually by a shareholders' revolt while I don't think that's possible with McMahon considering the way WWE's stock works. We also don't know if WWE has that Bob Iger figure that can take them out of the abyss and lead them into a new golden age.
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FinalGwen
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Particularly fond of muffins.
Posts: 16,440
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Post by FinalGwen on Jul 21, 2019 11:09:56 GMT -5
Except Vince insists on writing everyone's HTML code for their page. It's broken in several places, and includes several awful fonts in bad colours that don't contrast to the background, and autoplaying Downstait at maximum volume. Also parts of the code are just him yelling at the computer to do the things he wants in all caps?
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Post by 06vwgti on Jul 21, 2019 11:10:51 GMT -5
Always interesting to me when NPR covers something like this, while mainstream in a sense, they usually have articles like this before its covered by the ABCs, CNNs, etc. Love their articles and segments on pop culture and entertainment because of it. I think the transcript got the point across of the issues without going as deep as say this board and dedicated wrestling sites have. Though no mention of the elephant in the room of AEW, and how the various small indies are finding their niche
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Post by "Cane Dewey" Johnson on Jul 21, 2019 11:45:04 GMT -5
This was an interesting interview to read, but I think it focuses far too much on the content of WWE programming as the cause of the company's ratings woes. While I wouldn't dismiss WWE programming as a cause, the creative choices WWE has made over the past several years are symptomatic of the format of their live TV shows and even the PPVs.
The format of today's WWE TV programming is antithetical to how younger people consume their media.
One, younger people are less likely to have a cable TV subscription, maybe even a network TV package through a service provider, because they're a significant cord cutting group. So having TV shows that air on USA and Fox is already missing the mark (and missing "the mark").
Two, younger people watching YouTube videos that are 10, 20, or 30 minutes long. They binge-watch a Netflix show, then move on to the next thing. They watch 2-3 minute videos on Twitter and even shorter videos on Instagram. A 3-hour TV show, that runs every Monday night, that has been 3 hours long for 7 years, that feeds into another 2 TV show or a 4+ hour PPV that airs on the weekend, is not conducive to how young people watch content.
YouTube personalities and Instagram influencers are also of the younger demographic that WWE can't seem to reach. Perhaps there's a correlation that young people who don't watch WWE at the very least like to watch other younger people available on other new media. In this case, the current crop of WWE's younger stars are probably a bit too old. The next up-and-coming YouTuber will likely be 20 or 21, if not younger. The next big WWE star will probably be 28, 29, or 30. WWE seems really shy to push a younger adult in the role of a top star. Roman Reigns is 34. Finn Balor is 37. Becky Lynch is 32. WWE isn't going to make a 22 year old man or woman a world champion. Again, for a 12, 17, or 22 year old kid, what's the hook to watch WWE TV?
After all of this, then I think you can get into the issue of promos, characters, angles, booking, pushes, etc., that wrestling fans have (rightfully) complained about ad nauseam. Because WWE could do everything right that internet wrestling fans want when it comes to promos, angles, booking, and pushes, but it still probably wouldn't be enough to attract a newer audience segment that doesn't know, and, more likely, doesn't care about whatever it is that WWE produces.
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Post by abjordans on Jul 21, 2019 12:47:23 GMT -5
I don’t agree that WWE is MySpace, as I think their trendy, hipster audience is what keeps them afloat at this time.
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bob
Salacious Crumb
The "other" Bob. FOC COURSE!
started the Madness Wars, Proudly the #1 Nana Hater on FAN
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Post by bob on Jul 21, 2019 12:47:28 GMT -5
with the ratings plunge going back 5 years ---- isn't that about the time of the never ending Lesnar super push and forced Roman push?
it also didn't really help that Daniel Bryan was hurt during most of that time, and he was one of few never main event guys they didn't bury
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