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Post by YAKMAN is ICHIBAN on Oct 7, 2019 9:09:19 GMT -5
Give me all the supernatural stuff in the world as long as it isn't shit.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2019 9:19:06 GMT -5
Nah, I'll take the wrestling mummies and Christmas tree monsters every time.
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Post by xCompackx on Oct 7, 2019 10:23:57 GMT -5
Nah, I’ll take supernatural gimmicks any day of the week over “bearded man vs. other bearded man”.
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Post by Milkman Norm on Oct 7, 2019 10:29:47 GMT -5
I don't get it either dude. Over the top personalites? Yes! People who do crazy over the top things? Yes. Claiming to have supernatural powers that are acknowledge as real with in the world of wrestling? No!
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Post by Tiger Millionaire on Oct 7, 2019 10:31:59 GMT -5
Matt Borne is pissed.
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fw91
Patti Mayonnaise
FAN Idol All-Star: FAN Idol Season X and *Gavel* 2x Judges' Throwdown winner
Tribe has spoken for 2024 Mets
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Post by fw91 on Oct 7, 2019 10:31:59 GMT -5
WRESTLING’S NOT FAAKKEEEE!
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Post by Toilet Paper Roll on Oct 7, 2019 11:49:24 GMT -5
Wrestling is stale as hell right now and has been for quite a while. Something like the Fiend character changes up the dynamic of Muscle Dude with Long Hair A fights Muscle Dude with Long Hair B.
We all know it’s fake, why not make it bizarre
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Post by Milkman Norm on Oct 7, 2019 11:56:38 GMT -5
Wrestling is stale as hell right now and has been for quite a while. Something like the Fiend character changes up the dynamic of Muscle Dude with Long Hair A fights Muscle Dude with Long Hair B. We all know it’s fake, why not make it bizarre You can be bizarre (Abby, Brody, etc) without using the supernatural crutch that removes the gimmick from the prism of an athletic contest.
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Post by sabretooth on Oct 7, 2019 12:34:34 GMT -5
What does The Fiend do that would be "supernatural"? I don't watch a lot lately, but I thought he was just a psychotic personality of Bray.
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Post by carp (SPC, Itoh Respect Army) on Oct 7, 2019 13:23:53 GMT -5
I would usually be 100% on board with how they haven't given much explaination to the character but every Firefly Fun House pretty much explains most of the character of Bray and the Fiend. He's using this as a way to make up for his misdeeds of the past, keeping them suppressed inside which is The Fiend. I'm usually the first person to jump on them for this stuff but in this case? It's all there. Huh, this actually is a pretty fundamentally different way of seeing the character from me. Funhouse Bray is being sarcastic, right? I completely don't buy it as a way to atone for the past, because he has creepy shit on his show all the time and he does stuff like mock Vince. And he's not scared of the Fiend, like he would be if he was suppressing... he's coy about the Fiend. "Uh oh, I hope that mean ol' Fiend doesn't come out!" And why does he let the Fiend have championship attempts, if he's trying to keep it suppressed? (and why does it have superpowers?) So I'm watching this looking for the REAL motivation. I can get some things, but I still can't fit the Fiend in. Also, it's disappointing because so much effort and talent was put into the presentation of the Fiend, but monster clown is the best they could do, really?
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Post by sportatorium on Oct 7, 2019 13:30:38 GMT -5
The Zombie mortician did pretty well with a supernatural gimmick
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FinalGwen
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Particularly fond of muffins.
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Post by FinalGwen on Oct 7, 2019 13:37:51 GMT -5
For me, part of the appeal of wrestling is that it's a world where anything is possible, where genres can collide. Where an undead zombie and his pyromancer brother can end up fighting against an anti-corporate everyman, and have it be considered a pinnacle of the genre. Where a hypnotist samurai who went through a ritual unmasking can be one of the biggest stars his country ever produced, only rivalled by a fat bloke who fell on people. Where cults of vampires or dinosaurs are as regular a part of a tag division as furniture fetishists.
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Post by Session Moth is over on Oct 7, 2019 13:42:52 GMT -5
Does it have to be that fake with the Fiend gimmick stuff how can you try to look serious as a company while having a gimmick like that? It makes the company look bad IMO. Wacky supernatural gimmicks should stay a thing of the past! You over 50s don't pull in any ratings, you do know that right? You do know he can have his own opinion right? Don't be a dick because you don't agree with him.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2019 13:47:20 GMT -5
As you yourself stated, Kayfabe is dead, and it isn't coming back.
Realism only works to a point. As someone else has said, NJPW is the closest to a legit sport feel you're ever going to get. Even they have a guy named EVIL who walks around with a scythe. In the UFC age, there's not even a chance in hell of Kayfabe ever coming back, either. Frankly, I'm okay with that.
All that being said, bending the laws of reality works provided that it's treated seriously from a story perspective. Lucha Underground has more supernatural than the WWE could ever dream of, but it actually works because they treat it seriously, and not as a joke.
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mrbananagrabber
King Koopa
Paul Heyman's unofficial joke writer
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Post by mrbananagrabber on Oct 7, 2019 14:00:28 GMT -5
The Fiend got a friend of mine who quit watching wrestling for two years to start watching again.
If it’s done well, I am all for supernatural stuff in wrestling. I’d sure as shit prefer it over tedious MMA-lite stuff.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2019 14:24:15 GMT -5
LU obeyed its rules they set and never betrayed them even though they could have even with all the problems that plagued season 4 but they didn't and it kept people invested because they clearly cared and thus the viewer cared for what they were watching and having to take in.
MURDER REINCARNATED DRAGONS...WITH NUNCHUCKS CANNIBALISIM FREAKIN TIME TRAVEL! DEATH AND LIFE HAVING A LITERAL FEUD Vampire pope and his student who was a ninja skeleton Gods inhabiting people Gods inhabiting dolls Undercover cops special ops soldiers
In order to somehow blend all of the above and make it work as a wrestling show to the point you can get even wrestling fans invested you have to be doing something right with a care and seriousness.
Which has and continues to be a massive problem in WWE...they have no consistency and don't treat anything they do with any type of seriousness the "care" they take to stories and characters are more flimsy and loose than a porn set.
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Post by Tenshigure on Oct 7, 2019 14:34:16 GMT -5
LU obeyed its rules they set and never betrayed them even though they could have even with all the problems that plagued season 4 but they didn't and it kept people invested because they clearly cared and thus the viewer cared for what they were watching and having to take in. MURDER REINCARNATED DRAGONS...WITH NUNCHUCKS CANNIBALISIM FREAKIN TIME TRAVEL! DEATH AND LIFE HAVING A LITERAL FEUD Vampire pope and his student who was a ninja skeleton Gods inhabiting people Gods inhabiting dolls Undercover cops special ops soldiers In order to somehow blend all of the above and make it work as a wrestling show to the point you can get even wrestling fans invested you have to be doing something right with a care and seriousness. Which has and continues to be a massive problem in WWE...they have no consistency and don't treat anything they do with any type of seriousness the "care" they take to stories and characters are more flimsy and loose than a porn set. LU arguably had some of the best story-telling in professional wrestling during the first few seasons as well (I didn't keep up after Season 2), all because their show had set guidelines and rules that were always followed no matter how 'out there' twists became. It honestly makes me shake my head how quickly any of the good storytelling is thrown out the window because the writers have no ability to write a proper finish, or Vince straight rewrites the book before anything can be done about it. Think of the COUNTLESS number of threads that are introduced and dropped within the blink of an eye, not even because the audience crapped all over it, but because Vince got bored of it. The Broken Universe never got a proper end, it just vanished off TV because Hardy took a break. When he came back, none of that was with him. When Balor got destroyed at Summerslam, he randomly shows up in NXT as if nothing happened and challenges for their main title. It's so old-hat at this point, and it's tiring having to always come up with our own theorycrafting to make the repetitive drivel they keep pumping out seem entertaining. I'm not convinced The Fiend is out of gas by any means, but they're risking destroying one of the few good must-see things they have on the show.
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Post by James Fabiano on Oct 8, 2019 18:02:53 GMT -5
Does it have to be that fake with the Fiend gimmick stuff how can you try to look serious as a company while having a gimmick like that? It makes the company look bad IMO. Wacky supernatural gimmicks should stay a thing of the past! Which is it, though? More wacky gimmicks or more guys in black tights with Name Generator names? Like most things, a balance is the best, IMO. As for the question of how this Bray can survive multiple finishes...I'm going to actually go back into my Fiend Theory Geek playbook again. The Fiend is Bray Wyatt, who is actually a (possibly ancient) symbiotic spirit, in a new and improved body, with full access to his powers to boot. Yep, he left Husky Harris for dead after possessing him...literally, given who's face is on the lantern now. Him not being at full power was because Husky's body wasn't ideal for him, plus he had Sister Abigail cutting off some of his power. Abigail was expunged during Final Deletion, but not eradicated. Luckily, Bray/Fiend had the Abby the Witch puppet to keep her in limbo. Anyway...when Bray disappeared after being part of the Deleter of Worlds, we can assume he finalized his transformation when he killed Husky and got a new host body. Without Abigail to answer to, this Bray is much more durable/powerful. Or if you choose, ignore the above and just sing the last verse of the MST3K theme song.
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Post by SeVeN: #TheBadGuy. on Oct 8, 2019 19:53:20 GMT -5
The only reason I'm not digging the fiend is because it looks like some tacky CAW from a smackdown game. The whole get up is too cartoony for me.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 8, 2019 20:01:24 GMT -5
Does it have to be that fake with the Fiend gimmick stuff how can you try to look serious as a company while having a gimmick like that? It makes the company look bad IMO. Wacky supernatural gimmicks should stay a thing of the past! You over 50s don't pull in any ratings, you do know that right? Well, that user's profile says he's in his 30's and WWE's core demographic over the last few years are people in their 50's.
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