Mecca
Wade Wilson
Posts: 25,097
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Post by Mecca on Apr 16, 2020 10:46:42 GMT -5
Well yea, it's pretty blatantly obvious where McMahons political views align. And I've seen some say stuff like this should spur on a union and hey that's a great idea in theory until you realize that in order for it to work you'd need the top guys to be on board and why would they be? If anything they'd make less money to help the little guys and wrestlers don't do that. Are wrestlers really that greedy? Well yes, one of the biggest reasons unions don't exist in wrestling is because of how backstabbing and cut throat it has always been. In a lot of ways it echos society, I probably shouldn't discuss that on this board unless a mod tells me it's light enough that I can give that view.
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Dub H
Crow T. Robot
Captain Pixel: the Game Master
I ❤ Aniki
Posts: 47,875
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Post by Dub H on Apr 16, 2020 10:48:01 GMT -5
Well yea, it's pretty blatantly obvious where McMahons political views align. And I've seen some say stuff like this should spur on a union and hey that's a great idea in theory until you realize that in order for it to work you'd need the top guys to be on board and why would they be? If anything they'd make less money to help the little guys and wrestlers don't do that. Are wrestlers really that greedy? Seth saidon how not any sort of hate or blame should go towards WWE.So yes. I feel like the odds today are much better in the past but there are still greedy assholed.
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Post by HMARK Center on Apr 16, 2020 10:51:06 GMT -5
No, they absolutely can, they opt not to. They do have legal obligations to stockholders, but are under no legal obligation to take already record profits and maximize them to an even more cartoonish level. I think you're right on a straight up level, but there's a reason all these companies on the stock market operate this way and do every little thing possible to maximize numbers. Honestly, there isn't a good reason for it: they do it to artificially drive up their stock value so that CEOs, board members, and high-level investors can make a lot of cash really quickly, but "get the stock price higher by any means necessary" creates the house of cards effect that has made the economy and the financial markets so unstable over the past few decades and susceptible to every little negative shock that hits the system, let alone something bigger like this. Doing so actually tends to have an adverse effect on a company's long-term survival and success, since decisions are made only with the next 6 months or so in mind instead of sustained long-term growth, and usually contributes to negative effects on the wider economy, as well, since it usually leads to putting a lot of people out of jobs (e.g. like Activision last year cutting thousands of employees despite record profits) and thus hurts consumer confidence and buying power. Basically, none of these companies need to do any of this, but they're all addicted to the short term mega-profits and prioritize that over taking the long view.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2020 10:51:25 GMT -5
I'm a bit behind on things, so only just saw these releases now and I'm honestly shocked at some of them. I would have thought someone like Heath Slater would have been kept on since I imagined he wasn't paid a lot compared to others and worked well as a jobber. Who knows? Maybe he was unhappy anyway, but I always thought Heath would be there for life if he desired to be and end up becoming a road agent/trainer once his in ring career was over. I know several legends have praised him for his work (especially his selling). He's like a really good utility player in baseball who can do all sorts of different things for you.
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Mecca
Wade Wilson
Posts: 25,097
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Post by Mecca on Apr 16, 2020 10:52:38 GMT -5
I think you're right on a straight up level, but there's a reason all these companies on the stock market operate this way and do every little thing possible to maximize numbers. Honestly, there isn't a good reason for it: they do it to artificially drive up their stock value so that CEOs, board members, and high-level investors can make a lot of cash really quickly, but "get the stock price higher by any means necessary" creates the house of cards effect that has made the economy and the financial markets so unstable over the past few decades and susceptible to every little negative shock that hits the system, let alone something bigger like this. Doing so actually tends to have an adverse effect on a company's long-term survival and success, since decisions are made only with the next 6 months or so in mind instead of sustained long-term growth, and usually contributes to negative effects on the wider economy, as well, since it usually leads to putting a lot of people out of jobs (e.g. like Activision last year cutting thousands of employees despite record profits) and thus hurts consumer confidence and buying power. Basically, none of these companies need to do any of this, but they're all addicted to the short term mega-profits and prioritize that over taking the long view. Our entire economy, from housing to the value of the dollar has been propped up and artificially driven since 2008...it's what the entire system is now, it's why anyone with half a brain realizes Corona or no Corona the entire bottom is going to fall out of this thing eventually.
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Bub (BLM)
Patti Mayonnaise
advocates duck on rodent violence
Fed. Up.
Posts: 37,742
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Post by Bub (BLM) on Apr 16, 2020 10:55:11 GMT -5
I feel like it's going to be really interesting when things get back to normal (or whatever the new normal will be after this). WWE isn't the only "team" in town anymore. AEW is now around and is this upstart company that from the outside looks extremely talent friendly. I could see them getting a bit of an uptick. Impact, from everything I have heard, has gotten better and might be able to take on some talent. As scummy as this was by WWE, is it possible in the long run, this move helps the wrestling industry as a whole? Maybe it's wishful thinking..... especially with how long this quarantine could last. I don't know.... just thinking out loud. I think it'll be great for people like Rusev and even Zack Ryder. They've each gotten themselves over multiple times in a company trying to bury them. They'll be snatched up and get a real chance. Gallows & Anderson have ties in AEW and NJPW. Pretty sure Impact as well. They're still valuable to the right audience, they'll be fine. There are also people like Erick Rowan and Peyton Royce, who have consistently improved year by year, and have strong ties inside AEW. I'm not so much worried for them either. But then there are the folks like Drake Maverick, MJ Jenkins, Sarah Logan. They're going to struggle right now. Promotions aren't going to be able to start signing prospects with future potential until they're turning a steady profit again. Any jobs will go to folks like Rusev and The Revival.
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Kyn
Don Corleone
Posts: 1,623
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Post by Kyn on Apr 16, 2020 10:56:14 GMT -5
Are wrestlers really that greedy? Seth saidon how not any sort of hate or blame should go towards WWE.So yes. (...) He did? Ugh. Seth's finely tuned moral compass, always guaranteed to point you a direct 180 degrees from where you should be headed.
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fw91
Patti Mayonnaise
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Tribe has spoken for 2024 Mets
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Post by fw91 on Apr 16, 2020 10:57:53 GMT -5
I'm kinda ignorant to business/stock market, but looking at everything that's changed and happened over the years, was there any incentive or positive gains for the WWE to go public?
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Post by HMARK Center on Apr 16, 2020 11:01:05 GMT -5
I'm kinda ignorant to business/stock market, but looking at everything that's changed and happened over the years, was there any incentive or positive gains for the WWE to go public? For Vince and for all other major stock holders? God, yes, they made a killing.
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thehottag
Don Corleone
We're here for one reason only: fame, fortune, & the World Wrestling Federation Tag Team Champions!
Posts: 1,668
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Post by thehottag on Apr 16, 2020 11:05:15 GMT -5
[Basically, none of these companies need to do any of this, but they're all addicted to the short term mega-profits and prioritize that over taking the long view. Wrestling promoters are very guilty of this. An act catches fire, so they ride the wave loooooong past the point where people care, never bothering to create a successor because they cannot fathom tinkering with the formula in any way. They live for tomorrow's ratings, tonight's ticket sales, & when things eventually do dive, it obviously has nothing to do with their action/inaction.
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Apr 16, 2020 11:10:20 GMT -5
A thing I find weird is the whole 'companies are like that, they're no more evil than xyz'.
I mean fine, but other people being awful doesn't excuse awful acts from someone else.
If we were on a Pillsbury messageboard and their profits and yeast continued to rise and they had tons of dough (heh) and then they cut the Doughboy outta nowhere we'd be rightfully angry there.
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Post by HMARK Center on Apr 16, 2020 11:10:38 GMT -5
For what it's worth, Open Secrets has the McMahons as having put in $3 million of their own money into the Super PAC Linda McMahon is running. Dana White also gave it $1 million, minimum contributions have been $25,000 a pop. A thing I find weird is the whole 'companies are like that, they're no more evil than xyz'. I mean fine, but other people being awful doesn't excuse awful acts from someone else. If we were on a Pillsbury messageboard and their profits and yeast continued to rise and they had tons of dough (heh) and then they cut the Doughboy outta nowhere we'd be rightfully angry there. I think people have a bad habit of taking the world they were born into and just assuming "Well, this is just how things are." I teach civics and history for a living, and I have a line I love to use in class: "Nothing comes from nothing." Especially in the realm of economics and social sciences, the structures we build around us aren't hardwired into the world; they're not the hard sciences like biology or chemistry or physics, they're not immutable laws of the universe. Businesses, companies, markets, regulations or lack thereof, none of those are naturally occurring, despite what many have argued over the years about the "invisible hand"; they're 100% man-made, and, as such, humankind has the ability to alter, adjust, abolish, or otherwise tinker with them so that they do the most good for the societies we build. It does us no good to accept things like stock market manipulation, mass layoffs, or CEO greed as unavoidable facts of life, but we allow them to be, for many stupid reasons.
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dav
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 6,037
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Post by dav on Apr 16, 2020 11:13:57 GMT -5
I'm a bit behind on things, so only just saw these releases now and I'm honestly shocked at some of them. I would have thought someone like Heath Slater would have been kept on since I imagined he wasn't paid a lot compared to others and worked well as a jobber. Who knows? Maybe he was unhappy anyway, but I always thought Heath would be there for life if he desired to be and end up becoming a road agent/trainer once his in ring career was over. I know several legends have praised him for his work (especially his selling). He's like a really good utility player in baseball who can do all sorts of different things for you. Yeah, seemed like a lifer for me as well, considering how much they trusted him with things like the legends matches a few years back. Would have thought he'd be kept around due to how well he worked in that role.
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mattperiolat
King Koopa
Thank you, Brodie... for everything.
Posts: 11,445
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Post by mattperiolat on Apr 16, 2020 11:14:56 GMT -5
It’s a tough situation really. We can be somewhat confident that people I care about who are top tier - Bryan, Kofi, Edge, Taker - are hopefully safe. But I dread what is to come. And what happens if I’m wrong.
One thing for sure - anything happens to those four, I’m gone. Dead serious. That’s my break point with Vince McMahon.
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Mecca
Wade Wilson
Posts: 25,097
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Post by Mecca on Apr 16, 2020 11:17:35 GMT -5
For what it's worth, Open Secrets has the McMahons as having put in $3 million of their own money into the Super PAC Linda McMahon is running. Dana White also gave it $1 million, minimum contributions have been $25,000 a pop. A thing I find weird is the whole 'companies are like that, they're no more evil than xyz'. I mean fine, but other people being awful doesn't excuse awful acts from someone else. If we were on a Pillsbury messageboard and their profits and yeast continued to rise and they had tons of dough (heh) and then they cut the Doughboy outta nowhere we'd be rightfully angry there. I think people have a bad habit of taking the world they were born into and just assuming "Well, this is just how things are." I teach civics and history for a living, and I have a line I love to use in class: "Nothing comes from nothing." Especially in the realm of economics and social sciences, the structures we build around us aren't hardwired into the world; they're not the hard sciences like biology or chemistry or physics, they're not immutable laws of the universe. Businesses, companies, markets, regulations or lack thereof, none of those are naturally occurring, despite what many have argued over the years about the "invisible hand"; they're 100% man-made, and, as such, humankind has the ability to alter, adjust, abolish, or otherwise tinker with them so that they do the most good for the societies we build. It does us no good to accept things like stock market manipulation, mass layoffs, or CEO greed as unavoidable facts of life, but we allow them to be, for many stupid reasons. You are exactly right...there is a great political quote from back in the day that sums up why everything that happens does.. Richard Wright. “Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.” That isn't meant to cause a political debate, it's why things don't change, people have really warped viewpoints about a lot of things.
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Post by Rolent Tex on Apr 16, 2020 11:19:09 GMT -5
The ad buy was for the 2020 presidential race, not the next governor’s race. And with getting that the governor gets money, campaign,power and support from the president. Yup...it’s all tied together. He pretty much won his race because he got the president’s stamp of approval. Now that he and his predecessor pretty much have pissed a large amount of the state off with their shenanigans the Super PAC Linda runs is stepping in to help out. Can’t risk losing the state in November. That AND Governor Dingus scratching their backs in return so USA and FOX can’t renegotiate their contracts when they don’t deliver the agreed amount of live programming.
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Bub (BLM)
Patti Mayonnaise
advocates duck on rodent violence
Fed. Up.
Posts: 37,742
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Post by Bub (BLM) on Apr 16, 2020 11:19:45 GMT -5
For what it's worth, Open Secrets has the McMahons as having put in $3 million of their own money into the Super PAC Linda McMahon is running. Dana White also gave it $1 million, minimum contributions have been $25,000 a pop. This is barely even politics anymore. It's disguised that way to fool the masses, but let's be honest - none of these people actually care about Red or Blue. They care about Green. And no, I don't mean the environment. I mean money. The current US President isn't a politician. Zero political background. He's a business tycoon with a shady as f*** reputation, and now other business tycoons with shady reputations are throwing everything they have at keeping him in power. If you think Vince McMahon doesn't love knowing he's got the POTUS in his back pocket, then you've probably got no idea what a "Vince McMahon" is. It's just insane to me. Vince McMahon deeply involved with the White House. Listen to the Brodie podcast and tell me that idea doesn't scare the f*** out of you.
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Post by HMARK Center on Apr 16, 2020 11:28:00 GMT -5
For what it's worth, Open Secrets has the McMahons as having put in $3 million of their own money into the Super PAC Linda McMahon is running. Dana White also gave it $1 million, minimum contributions have been $25,000 a pop. This is barely even politics anymore. It's disguised that way to fool the masses, but let's be honest - none of these people actually care about Red or Blue. They care about Green. And no, I don't mean the environment. I mean money. The current US President isn't a politician. Zero political background. He's a business tycoon with a shady as f*** reputation, and now other business tycoons with shady reputations are throwing everything they have at keeping him in power. If you think Vince McMahon doesn't love knowing he's got the POTUS in his back pocket, then you've probably got no idea what a "Vince McMahon" is. It's just insane to me. Vince McMahon deeply involved with the White House. Listen to the Brodie podcast and tell me that idea doesn't scare the f*** out of you. Honestly, the current POTUS wasn't even a business tycoon; not a political statement here, just that he basically has only been a brand name since the 80s, and then a game show host. But, yes, it's incredibly common for very wealthy people to spread their money around politically, since they want to be in good with whomever wins (e.g. this is why you'll see someone say things like "So-and-so was in THIS political party in the 90s, now they're in the other one!" Probably not; they likely simply gave more money in the 90s to whichever group was in power where they lived). They may have preferences, certainly, and a number of them are hardcore ideologues, but typically not the majority of them, so they're just on the look out to gain access and influence to try and shape policymaking to their financial benefit.
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Bub (BLM)
Patti Mayonnaise
advocates duck on rodent violence
Fed. Up.
Posts: 37,742
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Post by Bub (BLM) on Apr 16, 2020 11:29:22 GMT -5
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Dub H
Crow T. Robot
Captain Pixel: the Game Master
I ❤ Aniki
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Post by Dub H on Apr 16, 2020 11:31:33 GMT -5
Of course the first thing the asswipe says sets the tone: He doesnt want unity,he wants people to back off WWE. You know who wont unite and band together?WWE. We need to press WWE and pressure then otherwise things will never change. In the ends ,whether he meant as it or not,his message was: Be subservient to the WWE.
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