How will the UFC cope with a lack of star power long-term?

[Deleted]

I mean, obviously they're fine for now so I'm not at all saying that there's any immediate danger, but it certainly seems like the writing is on the wall in terms of stars not being nearly as marketable as they used to be.

In sort of the "golden age" of MMA, to me, you had guys like Chuck Liddell, Tito Oritz, Randy Couture, BJ Penn, etc. on the UFC end, and Fedor, Cro Cop, Wanderlei Silva, Gomi, etc. on the PRIDE end, and seeing one or more of those names was enough to sell a card to a fairly casual audience.

Nowadays, I sort of feel like there is no star power left anymore. I don't know if it's simply due to the sport changing from being seen as "human cock fighting" to a more legit sport, or if it's because fighting styles and looks seem to be virtually the same with only a few minute differences here and there.

Either way, I feel like the last 2 big stars of the modern era are Rousey and Conor. One is out of the industry, and the other is a shell of himself.

[fw91]

I'd thrown in Jones with Rousey and Connor.

They oversaturated the market with too much programming and including more weight classes. When it was Lightweight, Welterweight, Middleweight, Light-Heavyweight and Heavyweight, it was easier to follow.


Also when I got into MMA (late 2000's/early 2010's) Their were unbeatables Penn, GSP, Silva, and even Jones. Nowadays there aren't many left, so there isn't much dominance to build a star aura around you.

[XIII]

I think that they’ll be fine overall as they are established as a legit sport, however there will no doubt be ebbs and flows depending on if a charismatic fighter catches fire or not. It’s closer to happening than Dana and the UFC would like as the fighters that talk the most have been getting laid out recently. Conor has another fight or two before he’s completely done, Masvidal was hot for a minute before Usman took his soul, same with Colby. I fully expect that if Jones ever fights at HW someone is going to take his scalp.

So eventually Dana is going to have to get all the way behind guys like Francis, Usman, and guys like them and get out of the way. Talented fighters that don’t talk a lot of trash but just go in there and beat people. The problem being that Dana is hot garbage that will always push a guy that talks better than he fights because it made so much money for him during the Conor era.

I will say that if a guy/corporation were to decide to create their own promotion with better pay for fighters Dana probably wouldn’t have much of a league left. That’s why he should send a guy over to KO Jake Paul to get him to stop talking about fighter pay. lol

[Mozenrath]

Buy rates are probably going to drop until someone else rises that they can spin. That they fumbled so hard on getting behind Nunes kind of makes me question if they'll even recognize it when they've got it, though.

If your marketing team thinks, "Hmm, queer fighter, has beaten Cyborg, Ronda Rousey, Holly Holm who had also beaten Ronda and had that hype... Nope, can't see any way to market this!" they might not be very good at their job.

[Deleted]

Jul 12, 2021 6:58:47 GMT -5 XIII said:

I think that they’ll be fine overall as they are established as a legit sport, however there will no doubt be ebbs and flows depending on if a charismatic fighter catches fire or not. It’s closer to happening than Dana and the UFC would like as the fighters that talk the most have been getting laid out recently. Conor has another fight or two before he’s completely done, Masvidal was hot for a minute before Usman took his soul, same with Colby. I fully expect that if Jones ever fights at HW someone is going to take his scalp.

So eventually Dana is going to have to get all the way behind guys like Francis, Usman, and guys like them and get out of the way. Talented fighters that don’t talk a lot of trash but just go in there and beat people. The problem being that Dana is hot garbage that will always push a guy that talks better than he fights because it made so much money for him during the Conor era.

I will say that if a guy/corporation were to decide to create their own promotion with better pay for fighters Dana probably wouldn’t have much of a league left. That’s why he should send a guy over to KO Jake Paul to get him to stop talking about fighter pay. lol

I completely agree, but I do think that not having a charismatic star and/or villain can hurt viewership even in actual sports. This is going to be the most bizarre comparison I've ever made in my entire life, but take NASCAR as an example. It's been on a relatively steady decline since Dale Earnhardt's untimely death in 2001, and I think that was accelerated by spending such a significant period of time with Jimmie Johnson, who is about as milquetoast as it gets, at the top of the sport. I think that's a huge reason why Kyle Busch has been cast as a villain so aggressively in recent years.

Even in the "mainstream" sports you've always got the running thread in the NFL of Tom Brady v. the world, in the NBA you have a lot of the same thing with LeBron. And in the MLB there's been a major push to promote the guys like Tatis and Soto who divisively flout the "rules of the game" to try and inject some life into a pretty stagnant sport.

[salz4life]

UFC will be fine, but I think they've hit their zenith. They are simply part of the sporting landscape now. I'm sure someone will come along that will buildup buyrates, but it's not going to be the juggernaut it was for a bit in the late 2000s to mid 2010s. The Fertitas and Dana sold off at the perfect moment.

["Evil Brood" Jackson Vanik]

They need to stop booking all these champions to go after other titles. It never works out well. Keep divisions separate for the most part and build up stars within them. Adesanya can still have star potential but having him unnecessarily go up to 205 wasn't the best idea.

[Deleted]

Jul 13, 2021 13:49:33 GMT -5 "Evil Brood" Jackson Vanik said:

They need to stop booking all these champions to go after other titles. It never works out well. Keep divisions separate for the most part and build up stars within them. Adesanya can still have star potential but having him unnecessarily go up to 205 wasn't the best idea.

To use a bit of wrestling terminology (Because fight promoting at the end of the day is just the cousin of pro-wrestling promoting, as far as I'm concerned), having a title holder go after a title in another division is just hotshot booking. It's good for a single buyrate, but hurts overall simply due to the fact that fighters can realistically only fight so many times a year, and then the belt is held up.

To put it simply, I think the UFC needs fresh blood and I don't just mean at a fighter level

[XIII]

Dana constantly setting up interim titles so that he can then do a lame ass champ v. Champ matchup needs to go too. That’s some dumb old bullshit.

[Kevin Hamilton]

They're supposed to create more. That's Dana's whole job. If they lack star power, it's his failure as a promoter.

[Gus Richlen Was Wrong]

Jul 13, 2021 20:10:56 GMT -5 Kevin Hamilton said:

They're supposed to create more. That's Dana's whole job. If they lack star power, it's his failure as a promoter.

He's Vince McMahon. Only stars he tries to make are the ones HE wants, for better or worse. And between Jones' regular manchild behavior, McGregor's alarming downward spiral, and Rousey deciding to NOPE out, he's done a lovely job.

And the reason the rest aren't stars is because they're clearly not controversial enough since those seem to be the ones he latches onto the hardest. So he'll probably try to make UFC the star power like Vince has tried to do with WWE and it'll probably go over just as well.

There's more parallels that can be drawn between Mr. McMahon and Uncle Dana but that'd require a full-blown blog writeup. One that's been forming in my brain all through work.

[Deleted]

Jul 13, 2021 20:09:45 GMT -5 XIII said:

Dana constantly setting up interim titles so that he can then do a lame ass champ v. Champ matchup needs to go too. That’s some dumb old bullshit.

Yet another MMA version of hotshotting.

As stated, it's Dana's job as a promoter to make stars. This is where MMA diverges from pro-wrestling. A fighter's job is to fight and fight to win. Nobody ever said Fedor was an interesting guy, but he was promoted like he was the Russian terminator coming for your soul.

Like WWE, I think Dana's goal is to make UFC the brand people tune in for instead of individual fighters. I'm not sure that's gonna work long term.

[karl100589]

Jul 12, 2021 8:34:10 GMT -5 Mozenrath said:

Buy rates are probably going to drop until someone else rises that they can spin. That they fumbled so hard on getting behind Nunes kind of makes me question if they'll even recognize it when they've got it, though.

If your marketing team thinks, "Hmm, queer fighter, has beaten Cyborg, Ronda Rousey, Holly Holm who had also beaten Ronda and had that hype... Nope, can't see any way to market this!" they might not be very good at their job.

I think they’ve done excessive amounts to promote her. They’ve given her multiple ppv headliners, had her co-main Jon Jones and Izzy undercards and had Dana White and Joe Rogan brown nose her non stop. And despite all this she’s the worst drawing champion of the modern era.

Whether rightly or wrongly, the everyday man on the street doesn’t care about watching her fight.

[lucas_lee]

Jul 14, 2021 0:25:23 GMT -5 karl100589 said:

Jul 12, 2021 8:34:10 GMT -5 Mozenrath said:

Buy rates are probably going to drop until someone else rises that they can spin. That they fumbled so hard on getting behind Nunes kind of makes me question if they'll even recognize it when they've got it, though.

If your marketing team thinks, "Hmm, queer fighter, has beaten Cyborg, Ronda Rousey, Holly Holm who had also beaten Ronda and had that hype... Nope, can't see any way to market this!" they might not be very good at their job.

I think they’ve done excessive amounts to promote her. They’ve given her multiple ppv headliners, had her co-main Jon Jones and Izzy undercards and had Dana White and Jon Jones brown nose her non stop. And despite all this she’s the worst drawing champion of the modern era.

Whether rightly or wrongly, the everyday man on the street doesn’t care about watching her fight.

Yeah it doesn't help her division is just not on her level either. Jones wasn't selling until his douchiness came out and thats a shame the casuals need a villian to watch fights.

[karl100589]

I don’t even think it’s the lack of competition. Ronda pulled 900k against Bethe Correia and Jon Jones pulled 700k against Anthony Smith. A big enough star can sell a fight against anyone.

[Natural Born Farmer]

Seems like most of the best boxers are Slavic/South Asian guys with unpronounceable names or vets way past their prime who mostly fight exhibitions, and they're still doing fine.

Reckon the UFC will be ok too.

[evilone]

I've been into UFC since 1994 via VHS tapes and to me no one will ever top Royce Gracie, Dan Severn, Ken Shamrock, Don Frye, Ken Shamrock, Mark Colman, Oleg, Couture, Ortiz and other early fighters to me. I just had a hard time finding anyone post 2010 as a superstar.

[salz4life]

Jul 13, 2021 20:09:45 GMT -5 XIII said:

Dana constantly setting up interim titles so that he can then do a lame ass champ v. Champ matchup needs to go too. That’s some dumb old bullshit.

100% this...... the interim heavyweight title fight he just booked is INSANELY stupid. I totally get it if the champ is going to be out for a long period of time (like Brock with diverticulitis, for example), but even then...... just strip the title from him and give him a title shot when he comes back (or give him a winnable warm up fight and then put him in a title fight). I know that would make the current champ sort of a paper champ, but that's no different than the Interim Champ. Stupid Colby Covington used as a prop and then still thinks he's champ. You feed into these dummies.

[salz4life]

I feel like they have a gold mine in Amanda Nunes. She's obviously a great fighter, but she also seems to be a great person. Her and her wife are an adorable couple and they have the cutest little girl (I follow them on instagram and the pictures of their little girl are absolutely adorable). She doesn't have those "model looks" but she's everything you look for in a star fighter to me. The problem seems to be there isn't anyone on her level (yet), but that's not her fault. She's also not American, but she has a good enough grasp of the English language that it shouldn't be a problem. I don't know.... this is why I don't work in marketing, of course. LOL

[Clash, Never a Meter Maid]

Jul 14, 2021 0:25:23 GMT -5 karl100589 said:

Jul 12, 2021 8:34:10 GMT -5 Mozenrath said:

Buy rates are probably going to drop until someone else rises that they can spin. That they fumbled so hard on getting behind Nunes kind of makes me question if they'll even recognize it when they've got it, though.

If your marketing team thinks, "Hmm, queer fighter, has beaten Cyborg, Ronda Rousey, Holly Holm who had also beaten Ronda and had that hype... Nope, can't see any way to market this!" they might not be very good at their job.

I think they’ve done excessive amounts to promote her. They’ve given her multiple ppv headliners, had her co-main Jon Jones and Izzy undercards and had Dana White and Joe Rogan brown nose her non stop. And despite all this she’s the worst drawing champion of the modern era.

Whether rightly or wrongly, the everyday man on the street doesn’t care about watching her fight.

Maybe UFC could switch the marketing up a little? Her being LGBTQ like Moz mentioned would be an allure to people who just really want that representation and are also new to combat sports? Just a thought, but that could lure in new demos.