Sooo is Big E leaving or something?

[polarbearpete]

Jan 22, 2022 0:05:47 GMT -5 Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-] said:

If E don't win the Rumble it feels like he's being snuffed out from the main event, just like Kofi was, but somehow with a worse world title run when all is said and done.

The fact he went from world champion to slumming it against Happy Corbin and Madcap Moss is... not great, it's downright embarrassing tbh, I get it's like a "New Day Reunion" and probably done out of necessity, but it still don't make the optics look any better.

Why shouldn’t main event talent work on the weekly shows with the midcard?

[Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-]]

Jan 22, 2022 1:08:32 GMT -5 polarbearpete said:

Jan 22, 2022 0:05:47 GMT -5 Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-] said:

If E don't win the Rumble it feels like he's being snuffed out from the main event, just like Kofi was, but somehow with a worse world title run when all is said and done.

The fact he went from world champion to slumming it against Happy Corbin and Madcap Moss is... not great, it's downright embarrassing tbh, I get it's like a "New Day Reunion" and probably done out of necessity, but it still don't make the optics look any better.

Why shouldn’t main event talent work on the weekly shows with the midcard?

Because when it was like 80 percent of Big E's main title reign, and now he's just instantly back to the midcard now that he lost the belt, it feels like they were worried about putting him in the main event from the start.

There's nothing inherently wrong with main event talent and midcard talent intermingling together, the issue is that WWE's booking makes it FEEL like a punishment, instead of feeling natural, and that's with years of treating the midcard like a secondary afterthought, instead of building it and its titles up more and more outside of a few examples and upper carders waiting for the main event to seemingly open back up again, or for Vince to forget there's a Brand Split... 

[CeilingFan]

If Big E doesn't win the Rumble or the Elimination Chamber, then forget about any future World Title reign.

[Mozenrath]

I am willing to be patient with Big E, but at some point, WWE needs to shut up and do its homework with some of its groomed main event talent. If they showed even 10 percent of the patience they showed in making Roman happen with some of these guys, they'd have an actual main event scene.

[chronocross]

I didn't watch SD last night, I read that he was in Kofi's corner but did he talk about the Rumble or his loss to Brock a few weeks ago?

[Legion]

Jan 22, 2022 7:29:35 GMT -5 chronocross said:

I didn't watch SD last night, I read that he was in Kofi's corner but did he talk about the Rumble or his loss to Brock a few weeks ago?

Nope, he's taken Drew's spot in the story with Corbin and Moss. He just progressed that slot in story, as WWE clearly wanted someone feuding with them from the main event scene.

[eJm]

Jan 22, 2022 5:52:17 GMT -5 Mozenrath said:

I am willing to be patient with Big E, but at some point, WWE needs to shut up and do its homework with some of its groomed main event talent. If they showed even 10 percent of the patience they showed in making Roman happen with some of these guys, they'd have an actual main event scene.

I mean, basically. Like, I do understand the idea of building to the next challenger by showing how they are compared to the previous champ (the Shohen philosophy) but if that previous champ wasn’t really much in the first place, it comes off like you’re knocking down the failed experiment.

[polarbearpete]

Jan 22, 2022 2:30:58 GMT -5 Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-] said:

Jan 22, 2022 1:08:32 GMT -5 polarbearpete said:

Why shouldn’t main event talent work on the weekly shows with the midcard?

Because when it was like 80 percent of Big E's main title reign, and now he's just instantly back to the midcard now that he lost the belt, it feels like they were worried about putting him in the main event from the start.

There's nothing inherently wrong with main event talent and midcard talent intermingling together, the issue is that WWE's booking makes it FEEL like a punishment, instead of feeling natural, and that's with years of treating the midcard like a secondary afterthought, instead of building it and its titles up more and more outside of a few examples and upper carders waiting for the main event to seemingly open back up again, or for Vince to forget there's a Brand Split... 

80% of his reign was feuding with midcard talent? During his reign, he had 14 singles or tag matches against Reigns, Lashley, Rollins, Styles, Owens, Lesnar or McIntyre.

It doesn’t feel like a demotion to partner with Kofi against Corbin and Moss on the road to the Rumble that they’re all in. Corbin also feuds with main event talent all the time. If he’s in the André battle royal come Mania, then I’d say that’s a demotion. If he can get a featured singles match then I’d say it’s a step up from where he’s been prior to his title reign.

[Clash, Never a Meter Maid]

Jan 13, 2022 1:25:06 GMT -5 EoE: Well There's Your Problem said:

Jan 11, 2022 18:43:43 GMT -5 @irontyger said:

...yes? I'm not booking them, so why would I want clean finishes if I think it hurts people I like and who I think would be damaged by them?

The issue for me is that I believe that it clashes with the blanket disdain the fanbase has towards dirty finishes, protected finishes and DQs/countouts. If you want those not to happen, then the only alternatives are clean finishes or draws.

If the issue is then “I don’t want my favourite guys to lose” then… Well, f***, that’s just being a fan, isn’t it? Everyone wants their favourites to win big matches and championship belts and have great storylines and whatnot, but it has to be balanced with the fact that A) Not everyone is a fan of the same wrestler you are B) You may not be a fan of a wrestler that someone else likes and C) Somebody has to lose for there to be literally any progression, otherwise what’s the reason for any of this?

I think the main alternative for WWE is to restructure their shows and stop giving away so many big matches on Raw and Smackdown. AEW already found a way around that issue by using enhancement matches to build towards feuds between midcarders without sacrificing them, and being way more patient with their feud progression between each Dynamite and Rampage. Seth and Big E don’t even need to face each other to get some shine, when they can easily just take out a local scrub and look like killers that way.

Plus they’re able to elevate these midcarders while also keeping their dirty finishes a lot rarer, so when there is a DQ it feels like a bigger deal.

[EoE: Well There's Your Problem]

Jan 22, 2022 8:53:03 GMT -5 Clash, Never a Meter Maid said:

Jan 13, 2022 1:25:06 GMT -5 EoE: Well There's Your Problem said:

The issue for me is that I believe that it clashes with the blanket disdain the fanbase has towards dirty finishes, protected finishes and DQs/countouts. If you want those not to happen, then the only alternatives are clean finishes or draws.

If the issue is then “I don’t want my favourite guys to lose” then… Well, f***, that’s just being a fan, isn’t it? Everyone wants their favourites to win big matches and championship belts and have great storylines and whatnot, but it has to be balanced with the fact that A) Not everyone is a fan of the same wrestler you are B) You may not be a fan of a wrestler that someone else likes and C) Somebody has to lose for there to be literally any progression, otherwise what’s the reason for any of this?

I think the main alternative for WWE is to restructure their shows and stop giving away so many big matches on Raw and Smackdown. AEW already found a way around that issue by using enhancement matches to build towards feuds between midcarders without sacrificing them, and being way more patient with their feud progression between each Dynamite and Rampage. Seth and Big E don’t even need to face each other to get some shine, when they can easily just take out a local scrub and look like killers that way.

Plus they’re able to elevate these midcarders while also keeping their dirty finishes a lot rarer, so when there is a DQ it feels like a bigger deal.

It might be something they'd have to bite the bullet on eventually. I always say "Networks aren't paying hundreds of millions of dollars for a show full of Wrestling Challenge squash matches", but they also aren't paying hundreds of millions of dollars for a steadily declining audience and a level of audience dissatisfaction that is only becoming more rusted-on, more cynical and more angry with every passing year, when they could just as easily throw on some sitcom reruns and get the same audience with better ad rates.

In lieu of that, WWE seriously need to consider airing an equivalent of Dark and/or Elevation, or at least retool Main Event for that purpose. Tape three or four short and sharp enhancement matches over locals before both RAW and SmackDown and bundle them up, either on YouTube or the Network/Peacock. Just having the visual of having your non-main event talents be capable of picking up clean wins would go a long way towards adding stakes and credibility to their matches on RAW or SmackDown. Because at the moment, you just have a lot of people who don't win at all. Liv Morgan, Los Lotharios and Shayna Baszler have all dropped their last four straight. Cedric Alexander, Shelton Benjamin and Shotzi, their last five. Cesaro and The Miz? Their last six. Ricochet? 11 match losing streak, longest in his whole run. Akira Tozawa? 35 STRAIGHT LOSSES, hasn't won a traditionally-structured wrestling match (not these silly 24/7 scrambles) in nearly two years. Fourth-longest losing streak of any talent in the last 17 years.

[Clash, Never a Meter Maid]

Jan 22, 2022 9:22:20 GMT -5 EoE: Well There's Your Problem said:

Jan 22, 2022 8:53:03 GMT -5 Clash, Never a Meter Maid said:

I think the main alternative for WWE is to restructure their shows and stop giving away so many big matches on Raw and Smackdown. AEW already found a way around that issue by using enhancement matches to build towards feuds between midcarders without sacrificing them, and being way more patient with their feud progression between each Dynamite and Rampage. Seth and Big E don’t even need to face each other to get some shine, when they can easily just take out a local scrub and look like killers that way.

Plus they’re able to elevate these midcarders while also keeping their dirty finishes a lot rarer, so when there is a DQ it feels like a bigger deal.

It might be something they'd have to bite the bullet on eventually. I always say "Networks aren't paying hundreds of millions of dollars for a show full of Wrestling Challenge squash matches", but they also aren't paying hundreds of millions of dollars for a steadily declining audience and a level of audience dissatisfaction that is only becoming more rusted-on, more cynical and more angry with every passing year, when they could just as easily throw on some sitcom reruns and get the same audience with better ad rates.

In lieu of that, WWE seriously need to consider airing an equivalent of Dark and/or Elevation, or at least retool Main Event for that purpose. Tape three or four short and sharp enhancement matches over locals before both RAW and SmackDown and bundle them up, either on YouTube or the Network/Peacock. Just having the visual of having your non-main event talents be capable of picking up clean wins would go a long way towards adding stakes and credibility to their matches on RAW or SmackDown. Because at the moment, you just have a lot of people who don't win at all. Liv Morgan, Los Lotharios and Shayna Baszler have all dropped their last four straight. Cedric Alexander, Shelton Benjamin and Shotzi, their last five. Cesaro and The Miz? Their last six. Ricochet? 11 match losing streak, longest in his whole run. Akira Tozawa? 35 STRAIGHT LOSSES, hasn't won a traditionally-structured wrestling match (not these silly 24/7 scrambles) in nearly two years. Fourth-longest losing streak of any talent in the last 17 years.

Main Event absolutely should be their Dark, because that was sort of the purpose of Velocity and Heat before. If WWE’s network partners want plugs, I’d rather they shift them onto a B-show where the marquee midcarders get to wreck local talent and prove they deserve their merch, while the meat of the product and major feuds stay on Raw and SD.

[King (Super) Dragunov]

Nope, WWE is just horrible at what they do.

[robferatu]

I know WWE stans always fall back on, “let it play out”… However, WWE has proven time-and-time again that they don’t deserve the benefit of the doubt.

So, I go by the week-by-week, show-by-show presentation of performers and Big E has not been presented like a legitimate main eventer or someone that is being positioned to win the Royal Rumble.

With that said, I honestly have no idea who is favorite to win the Rumble because no one has been positioned to be a contender to win it and I wouldn’t be surprised if after the Rumble it comes out the the winner was a weekend-or-day-of decision.

So, taking that into consideration Big E is as likely as anyone to win it this year.