How much credit does Roman deserve?

[Perd]

Strictly from a financial/box office sense.

This topic stems from Heyman's promo from last night. Where he ran down all of WWE's financial success, with Roman at the forefront. I’m not going to check any of Heyman's work. For this, I’ll just assume that what he said was mostly true. And if it is, how much credit should Roman recieve?

Would the numbers be the same with anyone at the helm? Or is Roman truly a draw?

I think, like most of these type things, the truth is somewhere in the middle. WWE has strived to make the brand the draw. And I think they’ve largely succeeded. But I do think Roman deserves a decent amount of credit. He headlines almost all the major shows, and the fans show up in droves. And it’s all happening while he’s getting one of the biggest pushes in the history of wrestling.

In short, WWE, itself, is the main draw. But Roman deserves some love for just how successful the company has been, financially.

[häšhtå.gdālėÿ]

I think the same thing would happen no matter was in Roman’s spot. They put this time and effort into someone like Bray Wyatt or Seth Rollins for the last seven straight years, people are still going to show up for them.

He’s definitely not driving substantial amounts of people away that’s for sure.

[Bo Rida]

Miminal. I think anyone at the top just has to keep things ticking over at this point and there's quite a few who could do that.

However there's also many more that would flop (hi Jinder) so there's credit in that respect.

[Cyno]

He isn't a negative, so he has that going for him. But most of WWE's financial success comes from the House of Saud and great television deals. The company doesn't have a singular draw anymore by design.

[Jindrak Mark]

2015-2020 he deserved very little. He might have been on top and main eventing Wrestlemania every year but for all his accomplishments he didn't feel like a megastar and wasn't drawing anything close to like a Austin/Rock/Cena/Batista.

The past year or so since turning heel, especially since crowds returned, he deserves a lot though. He finally feels like the star they've always wanted him to be. His look and entire presentation is elite. He feels like the biggest star in the world. Every other PPV seems to be a huge stadium show with a sea of people in Roman shirts which you know they would have loved to have been the case a few years ago.

Imagine babyface Roman closing the Raw after Wrestlemania with a celebratory promo. The crowd would have been turning on the segment, throwing beachballs and chanting random stuff to amuse themselves. He comes across so badass now though that even the smarkiest of fans over Wrestlemania weekend were giving him massive reactions and practically begging for the "Dallas...acknowledge me" bit last night.

[stoptheclocks]

Apr 5, 2022 13:19:52 GMT -5 Jindrak Mark said:

2015-2020 he deserved very little. He might have been on top and main eventing Wrestlemania every year but for all his accomplishments he didn't feel like a megastar and wasn't drawing anything close to like a Austin/Rock/Cena/Batista.

The past year or so since turning heel, especially since crowds returned, he deserves a lot though. He finally feels like the star they've always wanted him to be. His look and entire presentation is elite. He feels like the biggest star in the world. Every other PPV seems to be a huge stadium show with a sea of people in Roman shirts which you know they would have loved to have been the case a few years ago.

Imagine babyface Roman closing the Raw after Wrestlemania with a celebratory promo. The crowd would have been turning on the segment, throwing beachballs and chanting random stuff to amuse themselves. He comes across so badass now though that even the smarkiest of fans over Wrestlemania weekend were giving him massive reactions and practically begging for the "Dallas...acknowledge me" bit last night.

Isn't a lot of that subjective though? I don't think that business has improved noticeably since he turned heel.

Which either means that he was still very popular inspite of a vocal portion of fans hating him, or that it doesn't actually matter either way to the WWE's bottom line.

I think the answer is the latter, but it's a good basis for a promo.

[nisidhe]

There is no way to measure the impact of one individual superstar on a company's bottom line.

Since 2013, WWE's intent has been to make itself the attraction rather than any individual superstar. On the one hand, it's a smart move in creating resilience in the event you have have another Hulk Hogan manipulating or politicking against the company's best interests. On the other hand, it has come to mean that the talent are basically puppets to the company and that any accolades given them are less "earned" than "bestowed" by the company leadership.

It means, specifically to Roman Reigns, that those numbers and earnings and all that stockholder-call BS Heyman spouted could have been achieved by just about anyone on that roster if Vince willed it. Heyman, whether by design or default, drew attention to the fact that _anyone_ Vince wanted would have been tacked to those numbers and that Roman was utterly irrelevant to the equation.

[Baldobomb-22-OH-MAN!!!]

Roman seems to have settled into the John Cena/Bret Hart level "he isn't creating a boom period but he's sure as hell keeping people from abandoning en masse" roll, which isn't a bad place to be.

[pinja]

His skillset is sufficient for the environment he's in. But he isn't challenged at all. There's no other wrestler in the position to compete with Roman's popularity/spot, and so I have a hard time even measuring his value at all. You could exchange him with a few other people and they'd do virtually the same in terms of program quality and likely viewer reception. Many others would struggle, some may surpass even leaps and bounds, but honestly? I don't know who that'd be. In conclusion: Business wise, Roman seems to be a fitting choice as an interim face of the company or in this fairly new model of a self sustaining business.

[Push R Truth]

I can only say I personally know more people that don't watch because of him than watch because of him. And that's easy because of my house full of people I used to get for PPV's only 3 people still watch any wrestling, period. And all of them dislike Roman and think his push is strangulating the present and future.

So I guess I'm saying I don't know a single person in my everyday life that watches to see Roman.

[stoptheclocks]

I think he is the biggest active star in wrestling though, I'll give him that. Don't think there is a particularly close second either.

[khali]

The extent to which Roman matters is more because of them not pushing anyone to his level. If he were to retire tomorrow, any hit the company would take would be because there’s no one else positioned nearly as strong.

[Chiral]

Apr 5, 2022 13:53:32 GMT -5 Push R Truth said:

I can only say I personally know more people that don't watch because of him than watch because of him. And that's easy because of my house full of people I used to get for PPV's only 3 people still watch any wrestling, period. And all of them dislike Roman and think his push is strangulating the present and future.

So I guess I'm saying I don't know a single person in my everyday life that watches to see Roman.

Some of my friends who fell off of WWE will say when they tune back in for a show like "They're STILL on friggin Roman!?!"

[Final Countdown Jones]

I think proportionally speaking, in terms of his position and what he's bringing in that position in regards to the total success of the company, no top guy has mattered less or deserved less credit for the company's success. Which sincerely isn't a knock on Roman at all, but WWE has engineered itself to not need any one guy and to make its money independent of who is in what position. They're hitting record profits and it's not because of Roman drawing people in or selling merch, it's not because he has major pop culture penetration. It's because they've got fat TV contracts, deals with Saudi princes, and subleted their domestic streaming rights for way more than they were worth. Roman isn't part of any of that. Roman has so little bearing over WWE's fortunes at a time where they are making more money than ever and it's not even close.

[Dub H]

Honestly almost none. if anything his push set back WWE a few years when it would have been easier to push any over act.I feel like a lot of viewers left. Just accept or don't care who is on top

[Mozenrath]

If anyone could do it, Jinder would have been a success. He wasn't, because they can't.

Like you say, I think it is somewhere in the middle.

[Dub H]

Apr 5, 2022 16:12:24 GMT -5 Mozenrath said:

If anyone could do it, Jinder would have been a success. He wasn't, because they can't.

Like you say, I think it is somewhere in the middle.

I feel like extremes cases,anyhone moderately competent,which Jinder aint.

It also took 5 years to it to work, Jinder didnt have that luxury.

[sportatorium]

I'm sure they have their own metrics which point to him being a huge factor in their success. That said, if we look at Mania, they added Austin theoretically to sell more tickets in Texas. Pat McAfee is the one promoting the show and his match with Austin Theory every day on his show. His reach is much longer than anything related to Roman Reigns. In addition, he had Brock, Vince & Randy Orton on to promote Mania & the WWE. Reigns wasn't chosen for whatever reason. None of them kayfabed, so it doesn't have anything to do with him being a heel.

WWE books him very well. They know what levers to push & pull to make him a despicable heel, but one who can win clean if he needs to. They have the belief (and they should) if he's their choice as champion, that people will pay more or tune in more often to see someone chasing him than paying or tuning in the see him defend & retain.

Smackdown ratings overall are modestly higher than Raw, and twice what AEW Dynamite is. Not sure if we give all that to Roman, but the data is there.

[Dub H]

Apr 5, 2022 16:36:56 GMT -5 sportatorium said:

I'm sure they have their own metrics which point to him being a huge factor in their success. That said, if we look at Mania, they added Austin theoretically to sell more tickets in Texas. Pat McAfee is the one promoting the show and his match with Austin Theory every day on his show. His reach is much longer than anything related to Roman Reigns. In addition, he had Brock, Vince & Randy Orton on to promote Mania & the WWE. Reigns wasn't chosen for whatever reason. None of them kayfabed, so it doesn't have anything to do with him being a heel.

WWE books him very well. They know what levers to push & pull to make him a despicable heel, but one who can win clean if he needs to. They have the belief (and they should) if he's their choice as champion, that people will pay more or tune in more often to see someone chasing him than paying or tuning in the see him defend & retain.

Smackdown ratings overall are modestly higher than Raw, and twice what AEW Dynamite is. Not sure if we give all that to Roman, but the data is there.

Smackdown Ratings are mostly due do being on FOX.

Inf act the times Roman took a break,the ratings either didnt change or if I recall, got a small bump.

[Deleted]

He's the best act in the company right now. But his Wrestlemania matches have been largely underwhelming.

His best Mania match was probably the one against Edge and Bryan.