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Post by sungod2020 on Apr 27, 2022 19:26:45 GMT -5
He would've 100% overdosed if he was around Hall, X Pac and Nash. Triple H was the responsible one. He kept him in check. Vince looking over him aswell, probably. I think he would've died around 1999/2000, as morbid as it sounds. Why would you estimate around that time when bigger drug users such as Scott Hall and Jake Roberts have lived way past that, with the latter still alive today? |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 27, 2022 19:32:20 GMT -5
He would've 100% overdosed if he was around Hall, X Pac and Nash. Triple H was the responsible one. He kept him in check. Vince looking over him aswell, probably. I think he would've died around 1999/2000, as morbid as it sounds. Why would you estimate around that time when bigger drug users such as Scott Hall and Jake Roberts have lived way past that, with the latter still alive today? A good point but wasn't Hall's problem mostly alcohol? HBK was pilled up to the eyeballs and out of control. It would've been 100 times worse in WCW. |
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Post by THE FVNKER on Apr 27, 2022 19:49:29 GMT -5
I really don't see Hogan burying Shawn, not by a long shot.
Hogan needed Hall and Nash very badly during that heel turn. Hogan saw how much the two were going to shake things up, and latched on to it to remain 'cool'. Don't see Hogan playing those types of games with them.
Shawn would have certainly came in with basically the same contract as Hogan, maybe less pay but definitely just as much creative power. Hogan never would've gotten the chance, and if Hogan tried to pull any political shit about it.. The Kliq goes back to WWF with open arms. You know how bad ass of an angle it would've been for Vince and Shawn to work Eric into like a year long deal, just to have Shawn 'rescue' Hall and Nash and bring them back with him? We'd still be talking about it to this day.
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Post by The Thread Barbi on Apr 28, 2022 2:21:35 GMT -5
If not Bret, who else could it have been without Shawn being there? Nobody else on the roster(except for The Undertaker who was feuding with Kane) had main event credibility at the time. I figure with Austin defeating Bret Hart at Wrestlemania XIV it would be allow Austin to finally get a proper victory over The Hitman and can be seen as the passing of the torch. How Mike Tyson would fit in there is another story. Maybe he can be a neutral outside enforcer to make sure The Hart Foundation(who would be staying with him since there was no screwjob) dosen't interfere. After that, Bret Hart can take a hiatus while the timeline picks up as it did before(feud with Vince and his Corporate lackies). I'm sure they could've find a way and still end up drawing. Oh yeah I'm sure they could've made it work. It's Bret Hart - any match with Bret Hart could work. But I think the way it happened in real life was the perfect vehicle to launch Austin and the WWF back into the mainstream. I don't think it would've flopped necessarily with Bret Hart, but Shawn Michaels with DX was the best possible opponent(s) for that scenario and the perfect way to involve Tyson. For casual/new fans, DX were just so easily hateable and their immature nature was a perfect contrast to the no-nonsense ass kicker that was Stone Cold Steve Austin. And it allowed Mike Tyson to lean into his heel persona, which was probably at it's peak in 1998. For wrestling fans, Austin and Shawn was a pretty fresh matchup. They fought at the prior King of the Ring in thrown together match that didn't mean anything a week later, but that's it on TV. Lots had happened in the 9 months since. It felt brand new. I know at the time, I was dying to see that match. I just don't see the package working as well as it did with Bret Hart or anyone else in place of Shawn. Also, I think Tyson's face turn at the end only works with Shawn Michaels. Again, Tyson was not a beloved guy in 1998, but even casuals saw him next to this dancing prick and was like "All right Mike, knock this clown out". I don't think you get that with Bret. Also, Shawn leaving the next night allowed them to fully plunge themselves into a new generation of stars - no pun intended. In this scenario, Bret likely isn't going anywhere, so what do you do after Mania? Do you keep doing Bret and the Hart Foundation vs Austin? They had worked a lot by then. And the rest of the Hart Foundation was beyond stale at that point. Even with Owen's gimmick change in the real timeline, that cooled off really fast (thought admittedly he was done no favors by the booking). I don't know. I don't doubt they could've found a good story to tell with Bret vs Steve again, but I don't think it meshes as well with Tyson, and because of that I don't think they do 750,000 buys and set their business on fire without Shawn and then without a summer of Foley, Kane and Taker working with Austin. The WWF really fell ass backwards into the perfect situation. Owen Hart accompanying Bret in this scenario and playing the little spoilt brat he did so well, eventually taking the punch from Tyson, could've worked well. I don't doubt the storyteller in Bret would have forseen the value of having his face off TV for a while to let Austin organically grow - after all - he had pitched time off when he lost the IC title to Bulldog so the audience missed him but Vince vetoed it as he wanted the WWF Championship on Bret. Let Austin have his feuds with Foley and Undertaker, and then Bret comes back in a losing effort as McMahon's corporate pick. Eventually he takes a supporting role to the Rock in the corporation and helps Rock win his first championship. |
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Post by The Dark Order Inferno on Apr 28, 2022 6:26:58 GMT -5
I really don't see Hogan burying Shawn, not by a long shot. Hogan needed Hall and Nash very badly during that heel turn. Hogan saw how much the two were going to shake things up, and latched on to it to remain 'cool'. Don't see Hogan playing those types of games with them. Shawn would have certainly came in with basically the same contract as Hogan, maybe less pay but definitely just as much creative power. Hogan never would've gotten the chance, and if Hogan tried to pull any political shit about it.. The Kliq goes back to WWF with open arms. You know how bad ass of an angle it would've been for Vince and Shawn to work Eric into like a year long deal, just to have Shawn 'rescue' Hall and Nash and bring them back with him? We'd still be talking about it to this day. You wouldn't see Hogan burying people he could make big money feuding against, but that's exactly what he did. He effed with Hall and Nash too, Hall being kept out of the Wolfpac so Hogan could have a guy to make him seem cooler whether they wanted to or not, and Hogan wanting the belt back from Nash leading to the fingerpoke of doom. Hall, Nash, Bret, Sting, Flair, Goldberg, DDP, Savage and so on, none of them had creative control, so there's zero chance Shawn waltzes in with that deal. He would have found himself with his booking ran through the Hulk filter, same as everyone else as Hogan had the clause, which he got because he was a proven draw in a way Shawn never was, and he had Bischoff's ear as they were buddies outside of events while Bischoff had a pretty low opinion of Shawn. |
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Post by sungod2020 on Apr 28, 2022 7:19:12 GMT -5
Why would you estimate around that time when bigger drug users such as Scott Hall and Jake Roberts have lived way past that, with the latter still alive today? HBK was pilled up to the eyeballs and out of control. It would've been 100 times worse in WCW. Possibly as it was brought up in storyline. I thought Shawn started doing painkillers after that casket bump he took at the Royal Rumble, up until that point, he was someone who uses other drugs recreationally like at a party over the weekends but not enough to effect his overall performance. Someone correct me if I'm wrong though. Without the casket bump, and in WCW, would he become MORE of a recreational user to the point that he was in Scott Hall condition pre-DDP yoga, if not dead before DDP(or anything or anyone) can save him? |
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Post by Milkman Norm on Apr 28, 2022 10:38:14 GMT -5
In February of 1997 following a mediocre world title run & a knee injury that has sidelined him Shawn Michaels is given his release by WWF. He spends the next four months getting in mental and physical shape before debuting in WCW at The Great American Bash.
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Post by sdoyle7798 on Apr 29, 2022 13:11:09 GMT -5
To the people saying he wouldn't have been as protected in WCW, didn't Hall and Nash have a lot of pull there?
I know Hogan had teh ultimate pull, but it's not like he woulda been SOL.
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Post by CubsFan71 on Apr 29, 2022 13:32:12 GMT -5
If HHH decides to jump ship with him, he COULD have helped him stay somewhat clean. Of course, it wasnt just the kliq guys who were indulging themselves, Jericho admits in his first book that many of the wrestlers on the Disney tapings were having matches while hung over from partying the night before. By his 3rd book, Jericho admits HBK was telling him to slow it down... Imagine being so out of control with your drinking back then that Shawn f***ing Michales tells you to slow down |
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Post by The Thread Barbi on Apr 29, 2022 16:18:03 GMT -5
In February of 1997 following a mediocre world title run & a knee injury that has sidelined him Shawn Michaels is given his release by WWF. He spends the next four months getting in mental and physical shape before debuting in WCW at The Great American Bash. As "The American Rocker" Michael Hickenbottom |
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Post by Milkman Norm on Apr 29, 2022 17:52:55 GMT -5
In February of 1997 following a mediocre world title run & a knee injury that has sidelined him Shawn Michaels is given his release by WWF. He spends the next four months getting in mental and physical shape before debuting in WCW at The Great American Bash. As "The American Rocker" Michael Hickenbottom I get the joke but did WWF trademark the name? He had used Sean or Shawn Michaels in at least Mid South & the AWA before he came to New York. |
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