Could Cena have been as big as Stone cold or the rock

[ChitownKnight]

Had he not been neutered?

[Toilet Paper Roll]

I'd make the argument he is/was.

[fw91]

Jul 20, 2022 20:57:08 GMT -5 Toilet Paper Roll said:

I'd make the argument he is/was.

Yeah Cena's era wasn't as hot as Austin/Rock, but dude was the guy for a decade plus. Triple the amount of time Austin and Rock had at their peaks. And he is a mainstream star now.

[Mozenrath]

It's complicated, really. It'd be like when someone says Austin wasn't as big as Bruno because of his top years being like at most 4, versus Bruno's longevity, or Hogan's longevity, but obviously, those top years were huge.

Then you have Rock, who was obviously a financial success but his big thing is crossover stardom, transcending wrestling.

So, how do you rate a guy who was a top star for a long time, warts and all, but who also has transcended into pop culture? People who dismiss Cena really are putting the burden on them to try to argue he wasn't a big star. Like, on what metric can you really say he was anything short of The Guy in wrestling for his peak?

[Jumpin' Jesse Walsh]

He was neutered?

I thought Bob Barker only recommended that for cats.

[Cranjis McBasketball]

If he didn’t drive the audience away??? I suppose.

[Deleted]

IF wrestling was as white hot as it was at the peek of the AE....maybe but that is just one part in a huge hypothetical because it wasn't just the fact wrestling or Austin and Rock were as hot as they were but their cultural influence something Cena never even came close to despite WWE's constant pushing and pushing for him to reach those heights.

[bob]

*waits for Clash to come in and say absolutely*

[tirtefaa]

Jul 20, 2022 21:12:50 GMT -5 Jumpin' Jesse Walsh said:

He was neutered?

I thought Bob Barker only recommended that for cats.

[GodzillaIsMyMonster]

He is. Anyone who claims "he drove the audience away" is just wrong.

Id even argue he's bigger than Austin.

[jivesoulbrah]

Jul 20, 2022 21:40:57 GMT -5 GodzillaIsMyMonster said:

He is. Anyone who claims "he drove the audience away" is just wrong.

Id even argue he's bigger than Austin.

Yeah I’d argue he’s more mainstream than Austin.

[Fade]

In his own way he was big in carrying the company at a weak point and helping it back to selling out stadiums. Also, a huge contributing factor in the PG/family friendly thing, which they certainly did reap the benefits of for years to come (until now maybe?)

Could he have been as loved as Austin or even The Rock by the widespread audience? Probably not, tbh.

[fw91]

Jul 20, 2022 21:14:23 GMT -5 Cranjis McBasketball said:

If he didn’t drive the audience away??? I suppose.

what makes this true? viewership numbers after attitude era? He wasn't the guy until 2005 which was a few years afterwards.

[Mozenrath]

Jul 20, 2022 21:14:23 GMT -5 Cranjis McBasketball said:

If he didn’t drive the audience away??? I suppose.

He definitely alienated some fans, but even when he was taken out of the focus, a lot of them didn't come back, and a lot of the people who were real into Cena didn't take to his successors much, so it's hard to really quantify with him. I guess a lot of the issues with Cena were also just general shifts in the company itself from the mid-2000s onwards.

[mcmahonfan85]

Jul 20, 2022 21:46:05 GMT -5 jivesoulbrah said:

Jul 20, 2022 21:40:57 GMT -5 GodzillaIsMyMonster said:

He is. Anyone who claims "he drove the audience away" is just wrong.

Id even argue he's bigger than Austin.

Yeah I’d argue he’s more mainstream than Austin.

no. he may be bigger than Austin today because Austin's profile has greatly cooled off with him doing wrestling podcasts and direct-to-dvd movies, but if you compare Cena at his peak in wrestling with Austin at his peak in wrestling, it doesn't even come close

[tirtefaa]

Jul 20, 2022 22:46:39 GMT -5 mcmahonfan85 said:

Jul 20, 2022 21:46:05 GMT -5 jivesoulbrah said:

Yeah I’d argue he’s more mainstream than Austin.

no. he may be bigger than Austin today because Austin's profile has greatly cooled off with him doing wrestling podcasts and direct-to-dvd movies, but if you compare Cena at his peak in wrestling with Austin at his peak in wrestling, it doesn't even come close

Yeah, it's not even close.

Austin WAS the WWF during this time. People who were watching WWF were watching BECAUSE of Austin. He was universally adored in just about every place he went. And this was at the height of wrestling popularity in the 90's. Rock was fortunate to come along around this time too and provide a wider appeal of a character. Everyone else was a supporting role.

In 2005, most people over the age of 18 were watching WWE for WWE. Cena was the most popular guy, obviously drawing both support and dissent. His cross-over appeal was benefited from the amount of time he spent on top and how he was treated as the top guy; all roads lead to Cena eventually. Honestly, I think there were two fanbases for Cena; younger fans who wanted to see him win, and older fans who paid to see him lose, but I still feel that in the fallout of the Monday Night Wars and the monopoly that WWE became, the brand was the draw.

Now did Cena sell more shirts, win more titles, main event more PPVs and generate more revenue for the company? Yeah, probably... I'm not going to go through the numbers, but assumingly so, being on top for a decade versus Austin who was only around for a little less than 5 years, with 2000 being a very profitable year without him, due to the Rock. It's not an even trade off, but Austin helped resurrect the company after several very bad years for WWF. Cena on the other hand became a stable main eventer that could be trusted to maintain a steady following after several others before him didn't work out.

Lastly, in an even playing field where both guys co-existed, would Cena be as big as either? Nope, at least not in the model they presented him as. Cena is a very talented guy who I felt was toned down too much for the majority of his main event run, thus if he had to exist in that role...then at very best he's on the level of Attitude Era Taker, and that's only if the fans accepted him.

[Clash, Never a Meter Maid]

Jul 20, 2022 21:26:20 GMT -5 bob said:

*waits for Clash to come in and say absolutely*

Leave me out of this. I don't feel like debunking the stupid "Cena destroyed wrestling and everyone hated him and never watched again" bullshit anymore. I'm tired. If that's what people want to think, whatever.

[Cranjis McBasketball]

Jul 20, 2022 22:30:49 GMT -5 fw91 said:

Jul 20, 2022 21:14:23 GMT -5 Cranjis McBasketball said:

If he didn’t drive the audience away??? I suppose.

what makes this true? viewership numbers after attitude era? He wasn't the guy until 2005 which was a few years afterwards.

Yeah, Attitude Era numbers were bigger than Cena Era numbers. Yes, it was a boom and a pop culture thing, but they held some of that audience, which keeps shrinking and shrinking. People were on board with Cena, until he and by his own admission, took away every single thing a person above the age of 10 would like about him.

Cena is an amazing human, he's better than me, but he's in no way in the league of the Rock or Stone Cold, as far as a draw for WWE is concerned.

[Starshine]

Cena came up in an era where WWE was determined not to let any one talent eclipse the star power of the brand. Regardless of personal opinions of his character, he would never have been given a chance to become bigger than he was.

[ChitownKnight]

Jul 20, 2022 23:35:54 GMT -5 Clash, Never a Meter Maid said:

Jul 20, 2022 21:26:20 GMT -5 bob said:

*waits for Clash to come in and say absolutely*

Leave me out of this. I don't feel like debunking the stupid "Cena destroyed wrestling and everyone hated him and never watched again" bullshit anymore. I'm tired. If that's what people want to think, whatever.

Not saying that he destroyed wrestling. I love Cena. But the dude was more entertaining during his 03-06 run and with Peacemaker than the bulk of his main event run. I’m saying character wise he could of been bigger, especially if he went heel