Would Dr Death REALLY Have Worked in the Attitude Era?

[jason1980s]

Aug 25, 2022 12:14:07 GMT -5 sungod2020 said:

I said it in another thread and I'll say it here. He was the Attitude Era's Outback Jack. Brought in to be a big deal only to be immediately forgotten about. The difference between him and Jack though was they realized how embarrassing he(Jack) was in the ring, and i'm saying this as someone who dosen't pay attention to wrestling ability. You can tell he hasn't gotten any training.

I've also used the Outback Jack comparison on various boards. Jack got an LJN figure in the same year he debuted on TV. Most figures didn't come out until a year or so later from a debut. They also had trading cards made of him along side almost everyone, if not everyone who was a Hall of Famer.

I knew of Dr. Death from magazines but didn't know he was in WWF until BFA. He had a Comic Images trading card produced but it was from a dark match with Scorpio. I can't remember if those cards came out after of before BFA. And in typical Jakks DGAF fashion they didn't even produce him in the right gear, they repainted a Mark Henry outfit. His toy clogged shelves for months and months. I'm sure fans could still find it well into the Jakks Classic era even if just one left. Maybe even now there's a random one in a toy store.

The problem wasn't just that Dr. Death couldn't translate to a WWF ring in 1998, it was also WWF doing no promotion for him. You had a lot of guys in BFA who may have been losing every match but fans still knew them. Dr. Death was just put in a match and fans were expected to care. They should have had JR do interviews like Foley the previous year whether backstage or in ring. Him losing BFA was sad on a few fronts with his injury and also the destruction of a long time friendship with JR that really didn't heal until Dr. Death himself was very ill.

[Ozman]

I gotta call bullshit about Dr Death being a main event caliber talent in the attitude era. He probably was scheduled to win Brawl For All, and nothing more. It’s hard for me to imagine Steve Williams in main event attitude era matches against Austin, Rock, HHH, etc.

[1 Free Moon-Down with Burger]

No. No f***ing way. Not with guys like Triple H, Foley and The Rock in the wings. Nobody would’ve bought Dr Death as a world beater. No matter how much they crowed about him beating up drunk fans in the 80s

[A Platypus Rave]

like maybe they could build up a month or two feud with Steve/Steve... but I don't see this multimillion dollar feud between them.

What the audiences wanted in the Attitude era was not what Dr. Death was selling.

[tirtefaa]

Maybe if they gave him an actual doctor gimmick..

Opponent: "What are you a doctor of?"

Williams: "Proctology!"

*snaps on rubber glove*

[Bob Schlapowitz]

Somewhere out there, there is a Walmart that still has 6 Dr. Death figures warming a peg.

[Non Banjoble Tokens]

Was he even a real Doctor?

[Viking Hall]

Wrestling was still a series or vacuums back then rather than the fluid universe it's become now, and certain wrestlers just belonged in certain vacuums. Steve Williams was one of those guys, he was born to be this monster Gaijin in Japan, wrecking people and not having to do much else, but in North America in the late nineties where they were catering for the MTV, Jerry Springer, Howard Stern fuelled generation, that was never going to stick.

[Citizen Snips Has Left]

He made a couple appearances in ECW in 1996 against Taz and the Eliminators that confirm the “Dr Death should not have been in the American main event scene in the Attitude Era” theory.

[1 Free Moon-Down with Burger]

I’m sorry I gotta come back in here because it’s a pet peeve of mine for years. So so so tired of old timer southern guys like Cornette and JR putting over Dr Death for being a “legit tough guy”

No one cared. Absolutely no one gave a shit in the attitude era that this old guy that’s shaped like a mini fridge beat up a bunch of drunk marks after shows in the 80s. They always come off as the nerd little brother saying their big brother can beat up anybody because they saw him win a few rounds of Mortal Kombat at the mall.

[Sephiroth]

Not a chance. His track record as a legit tough guy who could soak up abuse was impressive, but he always had the charisma of a plank. And by the time he showed up in the WWF he was already well past his prime years. He might have had some place as the muscle half of a tag team with a partner who could talk, but he was never going to live up to JR’s experience rations of him.

[thirteen3]

He was kinda over with my little cousin and me.

As he had his action figure and when we played wrestling with our toys, we'd to story lines, matches and we'd kinda sing the wrestlers themes as we "walked" them down the tron set one of us had. For Dr. Death, for his theme, one of us would just shout "DR DEEEAAATH!" and make fart noises. We just made him into a stupid fat guy character.

Felt like sharing that.

[hassanchop]

Aug 25, 2022 23:00:53 GMT -5 tirtefaa said:

Maybe if they gave him an actual doctor gimmick..

Opponent: "What are you a doctor of?"

Williams: "Proctology!"

*snaps on rubber glove*

Aug 25, 2022 23:58:45 GMT -5 Non Banjoble Tokens said:

Was he even a real Doctor?

He's as much of a doctor as Dr. Dre. Though a rapper gimmick for him would be worse.

[fortknox]

Aug 26, 2022 10:36:29 GMT -5 1 Free Moon-Down with Burger said:

I’m sorry I gotta come back in here because it’s a pet peeve of mine for years. So so so tired of old timer southern guys like Cornette and JR putting over Dr Death for being a “legit tough guy”

No one cared. Absolutely no one gave a shit in the attitude era that this old guy that’s shaped like a mini fridge beat up a bunch of drunk marks after shows in the 80s. They always come off as the nerd little brother saying their big brother can beat up anybody because they saw him win a few rounds of Mortal Kombat at the mall.

Here's my thing, if Cornette and JR thought the Brawl For All was such a bad idea why didn't they try to talk Dr. Death out of doing it?

I think when it was 1st brought up they loved the idea because, it would show how badass and tough Dr. Death is. But, they changed their tune when Bart Gunn knocked his ass out. And took their anger out on Gunn and did f*** all with him, when it was said the winner would have a program with Steve Austin.

I've said it before and I'll say it again if Doc had won the thing JR and Cornette would have thought it was the greatest thing ever.

Also, they talk about how tough and badass Doc is but, make excuses for him losing because, he pulled his hamstring. Here's my thing, with them talking up Doc being the biggest badass ever, it shouldn't matter if he pulled his hamstring or if his opponent pulled out a .357 magumn and shot him 5 times. He should be tough enough to shrug it off and win the fight.

[Deleted]

No. Nobody wanted that.

Jeff Jarrett, Owen Hart, Val Venis, Ken Shamrock, Bossman, Al Snow, Marc Mero, or Billy Gunn all could have been placed into some sort of corporate challenger role vs. Austin in 98/99 and it would have been fine and I could actually believe any of those guys getting a short world title run due to some McMahon BS. Would have it been pretty? No. Would have it changed wrestling history for the worse? Maybe.

A broken down Dr. Death? They keep talking about him like he was Lesnar before Lesnar. The guy was a Steiner Brother's drunk uncle at best.

[jason1980s]

Aug 26, 2022 12:04:05 GMT -5 @uppitynerd said:

A broken down Dr. Death? They keep talking about him like he was Lesnar before Lesnar. The guy was a Steiner Brother's drunk uncle at best.

And the fact that he allowed the BFA loss (embarrassment) to dictate a majority of the final years of his JR friendship really looks poorly on him, IMO. He could have been a man about it, realized he either wasn't the bad A he thought he was or maybe just chalked things up to Bart getting lucky. But he used the embarrassment to shun his friend, who was THE only one championing him for a high profile and high dollar run in WWF. I get the Oklahoma character was like a WWF creation from Ed doing it backstage but Steve went to WCW knowing it would be done simply to embarrass Jim for a disability. Whatever money he did make from WWF was all from JR truly loving him not just as an athlete but like a brother and no way would he have ever gotten a toy if he was in WCW.

[Mozenrath]

Aug 26, 2022 11:27:07 GMT -5 fortknox said:

Aug 26, 2022 10:36:29 GMT -5 1 Free Moon-Down with Burger said:

I’m sorry I gotta come back in here because it’s a pet peeve of mine for years. So so so tired of old timer southern guys like Cornette and JR putting over Dr Death for being a “legit tough guy”

No one cared. Absolutely no one gave a shit in the attitude era that this old guy that’s shaped like a mini fridge beat up a bunch of drunk marks after shows in the 80s. They always come off as the nerd little brother saying their big brother can beat up anybody because they saw him win a few rounds of Mortal Kombat at the mall.

Here's my thing, if Cornette and JR thought the Brawl For All was such a bad idea why didn't they try to talk Dr. Death out of doing it?

I think when it was 1st brought up they loved the idea because, it would show how badass and tough Dr. Death is. But, they changed their tune when Bart Gunn knocked his ass out. And took their anger out on Gunn and did f*** all with him, when it was said the winner would have a program with Steve Austin.

I've said it before and I'll say it again if Doc had won the thing JR and Cornette would have thought it was the greatest thing ever.

Also, they talk about how tough and badass Doc is but, make excuses for him losing because, he pulled his hamstring. Here's my thing, with them talking up Doc being the biggest badass ever, it shouldn't matter if he pulled his hamstring or if his opponent pulled out a .357 magumn and shot him 5 times. He should be tough enough to shrug it off and win the fight.

This is honestly going too far the other way.

I think the reason they didn't try to talk him out of it was this was probably the only chance he was getting in at all, like they knew he was older and that his look was really dated. Like, the two are stubborn, obviously, and partial, but they weren't stupid, and they knew that this was well before anyone gave much of a shit about legends in wrestling. That shift wouldn't come until later. I don't think either one of them wanted to admit that Williams just wasn't going to fit in. He wasn't like Vader, who was also pretty busted when he got to the WWF, where at least he had a big look.

I do still think you could have maybe paired him with someone flashier as a tag team or something, but even then, it'd have largely been because the tag division at the time was pretty weak.

[XIII]

Didn’t help that they pulled Dan Severn out when they realized that he could actually kick ass. lol

[nickcave]

Guys like him, Steve Blackman and Dan Severn would get over great in an environment like NXT or AEW today but were basically midcard fodder at best in Attitude era WWF. For some reason growing up though where I wasn't allowed to watch until like 2003 but could still play the video games I always assumed he was like a big deal because he was in the WWF Attitude game and his theme music and name "Dr. Death" were cool lol

[Kevin Hamilton]

Maybe healthy with a good Heyman style mouthpiece.

There are so many factors that would have to be there to make him viable though