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Post by Citizen Snips Has Left on Nov 4, 2022 16:32:26 GMT -5
By his own admission, Mick Foley was completely broken down in 1999. He basically had enough in the tank for one great final program (which he envisioned with Austin or Rock, but ended up finally cementing Triple H as the main event heel of his dreams)
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Post by Can you afford to pay me, Gah on Nov 4, 2022 17:47:34 GMT -5
Goldust easily during the Attitude era. Strictly the Goldust character, or Dustin Runnels in general? 'cause bah gawd, Runnels would get a lot worse. Goldust yo yoed. IMO. A lot was the man behind the paint was dealing with personal issues like he had most of of his prime years (in age). Like 97 most of the year he was doing well, by the fall he went down hill. 98 the TAFKAG he got really out of shape and wasn't so good. Later in 98 when he reborn Goldust after his Dustin Runnels stuff. He was doing good against, in better shape until he left in 99. Than WCW happened which he was just Dustin but WCW as a whole was so bad. 02 WWE was doing great still, he cameback in great shape and had a good run until he left in 04ish. Than he went off the wagon was terrible and had that run in TNA. Than had more bounces backs again.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2022 18:08:41 GMT -5
JR is also crazy if he thought an over-the-hill Dr. Death was going to get anywhere in attitude era WWF as well.
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Post by ANuclearError on Nov 4, 2022 18:13:56 GMT -5
A lot of the New Japan dads ended up in this kinda spot. Their peak years were wasted on Inoki-ism and they found themselves replaced by Okada, Tanahashi and Nakamura when NJPW started to get attention, subsequently finding themselves in the lower card mentoring the Young Lions.
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The Blue Nova
Don Corleone
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Post by The Blue Nova on Nov 4, 2022 18:38:06 GMT -5
alot of the Territory guys who came to WWF. Bushwhackers Duggan
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The Blue Nova
Don Corleone
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Post by The Blue Nova on Nov 4, 2022 18:43:08 GMT -5
JR is also crazy if he thought an over-the-hill Dr. Death was going to get anywhere in attitude era WWF as well. Right I like Doctor Death but he was past his prime by this point. and he already been around for like 16 years at that point
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Cranjis McBasketball
Crow T. Robot
Knew what the hell that thing was supposed to be
Peace Love and Nothing But
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Nov 4, 2022 18:47:15 GMT -5
A lot can be just down to booking, but Vader was one of THE monsters of the early-mid 90s, then as the Attitude era got hot, he turned into just another guy, even in midcard matches, he wasn't wrecking people, Kane demolished him. It seemed to get in his head, the performances weren't what they were. I'll argue that even before the Attitude Era got underway, he was already done. His initial booking was just fine though. He debuted at the 1996 Royal Rumble and had a dominant performance eliminating Jake Roberts, Doug Gilbert, one of the Squat team guys, and Savio Vega before Shawn Michaels eliminated him when him and Yokozuna were fighting on the ropes, with the element of surprise, it protected him on some level. Even after that, he went back into the ring and assaulted those that were in until then WWF president Gorilla Monsoon came in and demanded he leave the ring. The next night, he assaulted the beloved president. He also injured Yokozuna, and because he was so fat, he needed to be carried out not on a stretcher, but a forklift, so he even got to BURY the once dominant WWF champion. He also was able to get a pinfall on then WWF champion Shawn Michaels in a six man tag at In Your House:International Incident, so things did look promising for the Rocky Mountain Monster. Then he lost his WWF championship match at Summerslam and THAT'S when things went downhill for him. Even then, it was still salvageable as he did get to pin The Undertaker clean as a sheet and made it to the final four at the 1997 Royal Rumble and even was featured in the main event of the next PPV. At that point, he gradually slid down the card. After failing to win the tag team titles with Mankind, he turned face, feuded with Goldust(where he did win at the 1998 Royal Rumble, before getting tossed out by The Bizarre One in the main match), and THAT'S when he got really buried. He started a feud with Kane where he got owned at every turned, lost his mask at Over The Edge, cried about how worthless he was and called himself a big fat piece of shit, and then was jobbed out the door to newcomers such as Edge, Mark Henry, and Bradshaw. Calling him just another guy would be putting it generously, he was a flat out JTTS in his final year with the company, but the beginning of the end started a year and a half earlier. Vader should tore Shawn’s head off by the ponytail and punted it into the 7th row. Instead, they had a competitive match, Vader forgot a spot, Shawn threw a tantrum in the ring and Vader was done.
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Captain Stud Muffin (BLM)
FANatic
You can either sink, swim, or be the captain....Long live the cheif
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Nov 5, 2022 12:13:46 GMT -5
His 2019 wasn't good (mostly by his own choice), but he had a great 2020 and an excellent 2021 that saw him hold world championships in multiple companies, put on several great matches, and end up #1 on the PWI 500. 2022 is a punt between his injury and the fallout from Muffingate. I think his work in 2016/2017/2018 has a mystique around it a bit because that was the period I think introduced him to much of his new fandom (and NJPW along with him). And his title run in NJPW wasn't all that good. That year leading up to his title run was some of his best work. I think the first Okada/Omega match is slightly overrated but their Dominion match is all time great
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Post by dynamitekidd on Nov 5, 2022 12:41:50 GMT -5
Pillman when the attitude era was just taking off. He could still work the mic for sure and was in the middle of Hart Foundation vs Stone Cold but was far removed from Flyin Brian in the ring. Pretty sure he couldn’t even really use the one foot anymore.
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EZ: Brainy Bae
King Koopa
I be like SHEESH
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Post by EZ: Brainy Bae on Nov 5, 2022 12:51:16 GMT -5
He had great promos but in-ring Flair was forgettable when WCW was hottest. His style never lended itself to short matches and given the things he's talked about going through at the time it it shows how distracted he was. As old as he was his work from 2003-onwards holds up way better.
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tafkaga
Samurai Cop
the Dogfather
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Post by tafkaga on Nov 5, 2022 14:13:28 GMT -5
A lot can be just down to booking, but Vader was one of THE monsters of the early-mid 90s, then as the Attitude era got hot, he turned into just another guy, even in midcard matches, he wasn't wrecking people, Kane demolished him. It seemed to get in his head, the performances weren't what they were. I'll argue that even before the Attitude Era got underway, he was already done. His initial booking was just fine though. He debuted at the 1996 Royal Rumble and had a dominant performance eliminating Jake Roberts, Doug Gilbert, one of the Squat team guys, and Savio Vega before Shawn Michaels eliminated him when him and Yokozuna were fighting on the ropes, with the element of surprise, it protected him on some level. Even after that, he went back into the ring and assaulted those that were in until then WWF president Gorilla Monsoon came in and demanded he leave the ring. The next night, he assaulted the beloved president. He also injured Yokozuna, and because he was so fat, he needed to be carried out not on a stretcher, but a forklift, so he even got to BURY the once dominant WWF champion. He also was able to get a pinfall on then WWF champion Shawn Michaels in a six man tag at In Your House:International Incident, so things did look promising for the Rocky Mountain Monster. Then he lost his WWF championship match at Summerslam and THAT'S when things went downhill for him. Even then, it was still salvageable as he did get to pin The Undertaker clean as a sheet and made it to the final four at the 1997 Royal Rumble and even was featured in the main event of the next PPV. At that point, he gradually slid down the card. After failing to win the tag team titles with Mankind, he turned face, feuded with Goldust(where he did win at the 1998 Royal Rumble, before getting tossed out by The Bizarre One in the main match), and THAT'S when he got really buried. He started a feud with Kane where he got owned at every turned, lost his mask at Over The Edge, cried about how worthless he was and called himself a big fat piece of shit, and then was jobbed out the door to newcomers such as Edge, Mark Henry, and Bradshaw. Calling him just another guy would be putting it generously, he was a flat out JTTS in his final year with the company, but the beginning of the end started a year and a half earlier. The problem with Vader in the WWF is that they booked him as the traditional cowardly bully. He started out strong, but that character always starts strong until he runs into the babyface who he can't bully, and then gets exposed. Vader in WCW was never booked to look cowardly or weak. His matches with Hogan did him a great disservice, but that was mostly on Hogan. After the feud with Hogan ended, he went right back on the path of destruction until he got cut from the company.
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