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Post by Alice Syndrome on Jan 12, 2023 19:11:28 GMT -5
One I have noticed is back in the 80s Brody was loved by all that knew who he was. Now decades later more of the backstage stuff he pulled is known. Plus it is easier to see his matches and his rep had been tarnished a bit. Jerry Lawler-Went from being the MAN in Memphis to now a few generations of fans just know him as "that old dude being pervy on RAW commentary from 20 years ago". Well all the other stuff Lawler got up to outside the ring hasn't helped. Eddie Gilbert-Like Brody was LOVED by all that had seen him wrestle. Now since his death more and more stories about him being a PITA behind the scenes has changed how people see Eddie. Mistico-Lucha Fans and Meltz praised him like the next big thing. Then his run in WWE as Sin Cara was a bust and now people that haven't seen his Mexico work wonder what all the hype was about. Mistico was genuinely really good, but trying to put him with a bunch of non-luchadores who only speak English was like if someone made Pavaroti the singer for Sepultura.
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Ultimo Gallos
Grimlock
Dreams SUCK!Nightmares live FOREVER!
Posts: 14,477
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Post by Ultimo Gallos on Jan 12, 2023 19:58:07 GMT -5
I know on Mistico. Was still watching CMLL and AAA back then. And he was good at the lucha style. But he couldn't translate that to working any other style. Which is a skill only some luchadores can do.
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Post by DSR on Jan 12, 2023 20:07:31 GMT -5
One I have noticed is back in the 80s Brody was loved by all that knew who he was. Now decades later more of the backstage stuff he pulled is known. Plus it is easier to see his matches and his rep had been tarnished a bit. Jerry Lawler-Went from being the MAN in Memphis to now a few generations of fans just know him as "that old dude being pervy on RAW commentary from 20 years ago". Well all the other stuff Lawler got up to outside the ring hasn't helped. Eddie Gilbert-Like Brody was LOVED by all that had seen him wrestle. Now since his death more and more stories about him being a PITA behind the scenes has changed how people see Eddie. Mistico-Lucha Fans and Meltz praised him like the next big thing. Then his run in WWE as Sin Cara was a bust and now people that haven't seen his Mexico work wonder what all the hype was about. Mistico was genuinely really good, but trying to put him with a bunch of non-luchadores who only speak English was like if someone made Pavaroti the singer for Sepultura.
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Post by kingoftheindies on Jan 12, 2023 21:05:12 GMT -5
One I have noticed is back in the 80s Brody was loved by all that knew who he was. Now decades later more of the backstage stuff he pulled is known. Plus it is easier to see his matches and his rep had been tarnished a bit. Jerry Lawler-Went from being the MAN in Memphis to now a few generations of fans just know him as "that old dude being pervy on RAW commentary from 20 years ago". Well all the other stuff Lawler got up to outside the ring hasn't helped. Eddie Gilbert-Like Brody was LOVED by all that had seen him wrestle. Now since his death more and more stories about him being a PITA behind the scenes has changed how people see Eddie. Mistico-Lucha Fans and Meltz praised him like the next big thing. Then his run in WWE as Sin Cara was a bust and now people that haven't seen his Mexico work wonder what all the hype was about. Mistico was genuinely really good, but trying to put him with a bunch of non-luchadores who only speak English was like if someone made Pavaroti the singer for Sepultura. Doesn't help that Mistico had a huge attitude and ego issue
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armbar
Samurai Cop
I'm the real waffel113.
Posts: 2,274
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Post by armbar on Jan 13, 2023 1:52:43 GMT -5
I feel like the obsession with work rate among internet fans has softened over the years. In the middle 2000s, it seemed like every match that wasn’t an Angle vs Benoit work rate classic was called trash. Lots of the talk about classic WWF or post Crockett WCW was about how crappy the work was. Good luck ever trying to make an appreciation post about a hoss like Sid or Kevin Nash. It seems that there is a much broader appreciation of different wrestling styles these days. Weirdly enough I seem to recall there always being a cult following for Sid, even in the "work rate above all" times.
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Bo Rida
Fry's dog Seymour
Pulled one over on everyone. Got away with it, this time.
Posts: 23,589
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Post by Bo Rida on Jan 13, 2023 6:35:58 GMT -5
I feel like the obsession with work rate among internet fans has softened over the years. In the middle 2000s, it seemed like every match that wasn’t an Angle vs Benoit work rate classic was called trash. Lots of the talk about classic WWF or post Crockett WCW was about how crappy the work was. Good luck ever trying to make an appreciation post about a hoss like Sid or Kevin Nash. It seems that there is a much broader appreciation of different wrestling styles these days. This is true but conversely the amount of joyless people that hate any sort of comedy or gimmicks seems to grow every year.
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Post by sungod2020 on Jan 13, 2023 18:30:54 GMT -5
Before her death The Fabulous Moolah was considered a pioneer in women's wrestling. After her death allegations of her pimping and stealing her trainees money have become so prevalent, there was even public outrage involved for naming the battle royal at Wrestlemania XXXIV in her honor. Snickers(the WWE's sponsor) even threatened to pull away unless they changed the name of it.
Also, Jimmy "Superfly" Snuka has been getting borderline-Benoit treatment by the WWE since his 2015 arrest for the death of his girlfriend 32 years earlier. Nothing came out of it(the arrest that is) though. Before then, he was considered a legend for his high-flying offense, even inspired Mick Foley to become a wrestler, and this was after the incident, but it wasn't public knowledge(at least outside Allentown, PA) back then. I wonder how Foley feels about him now.
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malloc
Mephisto
asian cookbook
Posts: 748
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Post by malloc on Jan 14, 2023 4:48:25 GMT -5
Well, the fans used to go crazy for bikini contests and lingerie pillow fights. Now the general consensus seems to be "That was all sexist and I'm glad it's gone" I wonder how one of those segments would go down today. Would the crowd still pop? Would the women get even MORE over due to the sex appeal? It will never happen but I'm curious. I've always thought its been a missed opportunity not to use them in wwe as they must still be in the rulebooks. Like a lower tier woman flukes a battle royal to win a title shot under their chosen stipulation, they're completely mismatched in wrestling so chose something like a bra and panties match. Could have also worked with a heel authority figure at one point but not such a good idea these days. Didn't they do a lingerie match in TNA once when they had the more talented women wrestlers and the lingerie covered up more than the girls normal ring gear?
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malloc
Mephisto
asian cookbook
Posts: 748
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Post by malloc on Jan 14, 2023 4:50:39 GMT -5
I feel like the obsession with work rate among internet fans has softened over the years. In the middle 2000s, it seemed like every match that wasn’t an Angle vs Benoit work rate classic was called trash. Lots of the talk about classic WWF or post Crockett WCW was about how crappy the work was. Good luck ever trying to make an appreciation post about a hoss like Sid or Kevin Nash. It seems that there is a much broader appreciation of different wrestling styles these days. Weirdly enough I seem to recall there always being a cult following for Sid, even in the "work rate above all" times. Guy just had charisma and aura, even if he goofed from time to time, that probably made him more loveable.
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Post by Jedi-El of Tomorrow on Jan 14, 2023 7:16:44 GMT -5
Lance Storm was the most underrated guy in WCW and WWE, turned grumpy old man on the internet and a meme, but seems to be back to hell of a talent and trainer again. One of the biggest shifts with Storm is that his weak chair shots in ECW (once seen as as source of criticism for how they looked) are now seen as him actually smart about not hurting other people especially given how much concussions have destroyed wrestler's lives in the last 25 years. And Hogan. Both got shit for their chair shots that wouldn't pop bubble wrap, but with what we know now, they were ahead of the curve with chair shots. Weirdly enough I seem to recall there always being a cult following for Sid, even in the "work rate above all" times. Guy just had charisma and aura, even if he goofed from time to time, that probably made him more loveable. Yeah, Sid just had some bonkers strange charisma. People loved him no matter what he did.
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CMWaters
Ozymandius
Rolled a Seven, Beat the Ads.
Bald and busy
Posts: 63,091
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Post by CMWaters on Jan 14, 2023 7:50:50 GMT -5
Vince McMahon is/was a genius. He definitely had the foresight and acumen to meld wrestling with MTV/cable/PPV and for that he should be lauded, but he has only ever been a good Booker when he has a veritable all star team on camera and behind the scenes to do the heavy lifting, A ruthless and thus great businessman…a not so great booker…. And a terrible human overall. See, I would definitely argue that at one point Vince was a better booker. Something definitely happened after WWF won the Monday Night Wars. Maybe it was the steep decline in ratings or the move to the USA network,.but around 2005 or so, that's when he remained steadfast that he was right and everyone else was wrong. No matter how much evidence proved otherwise, he stayed the course and made deliberate excuses to maintain that lazy direction. I think part of that could be attributed to losing Rock to Hollywood and Lesnar to football (however brief that was). Two guys Vince built "from scratch" (going by his mindset here) gone, so he had to make sure things were more under his control so no one could get that far again. That and the lack of competition to a big enough level (even if TNA thought they were going to be) made him complacent in ideas. I do also have to wonder if losing the fight with the World Wildlife Fund hurt his mentality as well. He was proud getting out of jail time with the 90s steroid trial so he might have felt somewhat invincible then as far as legal ramifications, so losing that lawsuit (his fault in the first place) and thus having to rebrand what he had spent over a decade building up to a global force may have hit him harder than we know.
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Post by Gravedigger's Biscuits on Jan 14, 2023 8:00:36 GMT -5
Opinions on a lot of commentators have shifted over time.
Tony Schiavone, Michael Cole, Tazz, Don West (RIP) all got a lot of criticism back in the day, but are much more respected and beloved these days.
Meanwhile guys like Jim Ross, Joey Styles, Matt Striker and Corey Graves were seen as ideal commentators at one point but come in for a lot more stick in recent times.
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CMWaters
Ozymandius
Rolled a Seven, Beat the Ads.
Bald and busy
Posts: 63,091
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Post by CMWaters on Jan 14, 2023 8:02:32 GMT -5
Opinions on a lot of commentators have shifted over time. Tony Schiavone, Michael Cole, Tazz, Don West (RIP) all got a lot of criticism back in the day, but are much more respected and beloved these days. Meanwhile guys like Jim Ross, Joey Styles, Matt Striker and Corey Graves were seen as ideal commentators at one point but come in for a lot more stick in recent times. I remember JBL got this second point a lot quicker. Online, people liked his first run for the most part as a commentator, but after his return to the ring and then back to the desk, he got more annoying for people. That's not even getting to opinions on him in ring.
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Post by David-Arquette was in WCW 2000 on Jan 14, 2023 11:02:41 GMT -5
ECW and Hardcore Wrestling. In which way now? I think a lot of the love for ECW has faded over time due to more knowledge of the backstage workings, Paul being Paul, and that style being such a detriment to the body. However, I am seeing more and more companies incorporating 'hardcore' and 'deathmatches' into the cards. Be it small indies, GCW,Impact or AEW.. there's been a big resurgence in the hardcore style.
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Post by "Evil Brood" Jackson Vanik on Jan 14, 2023 11:15:43 GMT -5
ECW and Hardcore Wrestling. In which way now? I think a lot of the love for ECW has faded over time due to more knowledge of the backstage workings, Paul being Paul, and that style being such a detriment to the body. However, I am seeing more and more companies incorporating 'hardcore' and 'deathmatches' into the cards. Be it small indies, GCW,Impact or AEW.. there's been a big resurgence in the hardcore style. For me, ECW often valorized things like talent working through injuries and looked down upon guys leaving as "selling out" and I think fans these days are more understanding of the business and how hard it is on the talent and thus are more likely to support them doing what's best for them and their health.
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BorneAgain
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 20,301
Member is Online
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Post by BorneAgain on Jan 14, 2023 11:19:47 GMT -5
I think the rebellious spirit and groundbreaking nature of ECW are still appreciated, but the hell guys put themselves through, the escalation of bumps, and the proudly anti-PC elements have all aged a bit poorly in the years since. The strong loyalty to Paul and the company itself is also seen more skeptically, with the near cult like devotion Heyman created being looked at a lot more skeptically these days.
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XIII
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 18,570
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Post by XIII on Jan 14, 2023 12:11:27 GMT -5
Stephanie McMahon from untalented and unlikable nepotism feature to an at least liked backstage and as a decent character when she was just out there being goofy.
Conversely Shane was once thought of as the heir apparent with a mind for the business and a good character, now everyone just sees him as a maniac. lol
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malloc
Mephisto
asian cookbook
Posts: 748
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Post by malloc on Jan 14, 2023 14:15:38 GMT -5
One of the biggest shifts with Storm is that his weak chair shots in ECW (once seen as as source of criticism for how they looked) are now seen as him actually smart about not hurting other people especially given how much concussions have destroyed wrestler's lives in the last 25 years. And Hogan. Both got shit for their chair shots that wouldn't pop bubble wrap, but with what we know now, they were ahead of the curve with chair shots. Guy just had charisma and aura, even if he goofed from time to time, that probably made him more loveable. Yeah, Sid just had some bonkers strange charisma. People loved him no matter what he did. Guessing a lot of sympathy too after the leg break.
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Post by Can you afford to pay me, Gah on Jan 14, 2023 14:32:59 GMT -5
Opinions on a lot of commentators have shifted over time. Tony Schiavone, Michael Cole, Tazz, Don West (RIP) all got a lot of criticism back in the day, but are much more respected and beloved these days. Meanwhile guys like Jim Ross, Joey Styles, Matt Striker and Corey Graves were seen as ideal commentators at one point but come in for a lot more stick in recent times. I remember JBL got this second point a lot quicker. Online, people liked his first run for the most part as a commentator, but after his return to the ring and then back to the desk, he got more annoying for people. That's not even getting to opinions on him in ring. I remember the whole JBL thing. People loved him when he and Cole did Smackdown after his first retirement. Than the whole Lawler thing happened. Fans wanted him back and he was brought back. He was not the same guy and became annoying and bad. Where everyone like he can go no.
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Post by OGBoardPoster2005 on Jan 15, 2023 18:18:12 GMT -5
I remember a lot of posts about Conrad Thompson around 2016/17 were generally positive and about the kind of loving and empathetic person he is and how he saved Flair's life being a sober companion.
Now he's an overhyped, creepy douche to most
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