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Post by Aceorton on Jan 22, 2023 19:09:22 GMT -5
The first two years, sure, I get it. Bravo had been a big player in Montreal and was still capable of decent matches. They tried shaking up the Dream Team, and then they tried him as the solo strongman who hates the U.S. But from probably WrestleMania 5 on, I don't see the upside.
Someone try to make sense of it for me. What did Bravo have that Vince loved enough to keep him around into mid-1991?
He was super-strong, but his physique wasn't amazing, and he got squishier the longer he was around. His moveset was pretty ordinary. People hated him, but it was a go-away heat, not a "love to boo this guy" heat. His feuds never felt important, and half the time he didn't really have one. His promos were nothing to speak of. He never was in any serious title programs. When Earthquake arrived, he became Scrappy Doo, letting Earthquake do all the damage while he just coasted.
Was it that he was tight with Pat Patterson? Was there some deal where Vince kept him around for years because he helped get the WWF more traction in Quebec?
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Post by jason1980s on Jan 22, 2023 19:20:44 GMT -5
Back then guys lasted that long or even longer no matter how talented they were or if they were over. Jim Powers lasted like 8, Roma lasted 6, Hercules 6, Barbarian and Warlord almost 4, Haku was around 5 or 6, Bushwhackers close to 8. Unless a guy wanted to leave on their own or was fired for protocol reasons most just stayed a while. Bravo staying as long as he did was normal for the time period. They did have guys that came and went, mostly on their own but if they were a decent hand Vince kept them on until the bitter end.
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Post by Aceorton on Jan 22, 2023 19:28:53 GMT -5
Back then guys lasted that long or even longer no matter how talented they were or if they were over. Jim Powers lasted like 8, Roma lasted 6, Hercules 6, Barbarian and Warlord almost 4, Haku was around 5 or 6, Bushwhackers close to 8. Unless a guy wanted to leave on their own or was fired for protocol reasons most just stayed a while. Bravo staying as long as he did was normal for the time period. They did have guys that came and went, mostly on their own but if they were a decent hand Vince kept them on until the bitter end. I guess it especially jumps out with Bravo because all of the other guys you mentioned above had at least something that made them watchable or appealed to a certain segment of fans, whether it was solid ring work, imposing stature, a funny gimmick or whatnot. And also, it should be noted, Bravo did not lose often until the very end. There was a weird protection there where they didn't want him jobbing the way someone like Herc or the Bushwhackers routinely did. |
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Cranjis McBasketball
Crow T. Robot
Knew what the hell that thing was supposed to be
Peace Love and Nothing But
Posts: 41,952
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Jan 22, 2023 20:01:43 GMT -5
The first two years, sure, I get it. Bravo had been a big player in Montreal and was still capable of decent matches. They tried shaking up the Dream Team, and then they tried him as the solo strongman who hates the U.S. But from probably WrestleMania 5 on, I don't see the upside. Someone try to make sense of it for me. What did Bravo have that Vince loved enough to keep him around into mid-1991? He was super-strong, but his physique wasn't amazing, and he got squishier the longer he was around. His moveset was pretty ordinary. People hated him, but it was a go-away heat, not a "love to boo this guy" heat. His feuds never felt important, and half the time he didn't really have one. His promos were nothing to speak of. He never was in any serious title programs. When Earthquake arrived, he became Scrappy Doo, letting Earthquake do all the damage while he just coasted. Was it that he was tight with Pat Patterson? Was there some deal where Vince kept him around for years because he helped get the WWF more traction in Quebec? Unsure of the time line and where Vince was running at the time, but if he was running French Canada at that time, he 100% needed Bravo. Bret, early Earthquake and Rick Martel wouldn’t cut it. Running Quebec is how Jacques Rougeau has a pin fall win over nWo Hogan. |
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XIII
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Posts: 18,570
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Post by XIII on Jan 22, 2023 20:10:35 GMT -5
My main man Dino Bravo was in bed with the French Canaidain mafia. Vince likely needed him to run Montreal.
Dude was terrible at just about everything, but his overall garbageness have made him a cult favorite of mine. Dino was sooo bad. LMAO.
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Post by Baldobomb-22-OH-MAN!!! on Jan 22, 2023 20:29:04 GMT -5
Being a good hand in the ring who has a lot of connections in the business can take you very far.
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CMWaters
Ozymandius
Rolled a Seven, Beat the Ads.
Bald and busy
Posts: 63,091 
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Post by CMWaters on Jan 22, 2023 20:37:43 GMT -5
Reading up, thing about Bravo is the one we're used to from the post-WrestleMania era is not who he was originally. For one thing, he bulked up a lot, see these pictures of his earlier days:   Also, he apparently worked in those days a more technical style compared to the strongman style he got once his hair was bleached, so he was working against what he originally trained with. And he could kinda be considered with the company more than 5 years as he was a tag champ with Dominic DeNucci (Mick Foley's trainer) in 1978. |
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Post by jason1980s on Jan 22, 2023 22:14:28 GMT -5
I guess it especially jumps out with Bravo because all of the other guys you mentioned above had at least something that made them watchable or appealed to a certain segment of fans, whether it was solid ring work, imposing stature, a funny gimmick or whatnot. And also, it should be noted, Bravo did not lose often until the very end. There was a weird protection there where they didn't want him jobbing the way someone like Herc or the Bushwhackers routinely did.[/quote] I'd like to think Dino was a little bit better than Powers and Roma. I feel like Dino probably lost a lot from maybe late 89 to early 90 until early 91 but we really don't see it because it was untelevised matches. Dino was probably on par with Hercules, Barbarian and Warlord. I don't feel like Dino had more favor with Vince over anyone else. Vince should have released a lot of guys in the late 80s to early 90s but he seemed to be channeling his father in keeping so many dead weight guys on. |
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Squirrel Master
Hank Scorpio
"Then the Squirrel Master came out of left field and told me I'm his bitch!"
Posts: 6,648
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Post by Squirrel Master on Jan 22, 2023 22:16:22 GMT -5
My main man Dino Bravo was in bed with the French Canadian mafia. Vince likely needed him to run Montreal. This, and he likely knew where all the drugs could be found. |
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Post by Hit Girl on Jan 22, 2023 23:41:02 GMT -5
He was entertaining when with Quake and Jimmy Hart. He had legit heel heat with them, and his strongman gimmick was a riot.
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tafkaga
Samurai Cop
the Dogfather
Posts: 2,124
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Post by tafkaga on Jan 23, 2023 0:05:35 GMT -5
Bravo was a fun character. There was nothing about him that stood out to me as particularly terrible when I was a youngster. He was far more watchable to me than Honky tonk Man or the Bushwackers.
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Post by ThankGodForSidJustice on Jan 23, 2023 6:08:31 GMT -5
Connections and his Anti America strongman gimmick made him a decent opponent for both Hogan and Warrior in both house show and television capacities. Also while I wouldn't say he was great or anything I don't think he's nowhere near as bad of worker as most seem to think. Every retro review podcasts act like he's one of the worst wrestlers ever and I don't think he was that bad. Like for instance I wouldn't say he's any worse or any better then say Hercules who doesn't get crapped on nearly as much. I thought for a big power dude he was serviceable enough.
I do think it was odd how protected he was. It's like they would always keep him strong but yet they would never really elevate him either.
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Post by ThankGodForSidJustice on Jan 23, 2023 6:18:05 GMT -5
I guess it especially jumps out with Bravo because all of the other guys you mentioned above had at least something that made them watchable or appealed to a certain segment of fans, whether it was solid ring work, imposing stature, a funny gimmick or whatnot. And also, it should be noted, Bravo did not lose often until the very end. There was a weird protection there where they didn't want him jobbing the way someone like Herc or the Bushwhackers routinely did. I'd like to think Dino was a little bit better than Powers and Roma. I feel like Dino probably lost a lot from maybe late 89 to early 90 until early 91 but we really don't see it because it was untelevised matches. Dino was probably on par with Hercules, Barbarian and Warlord. I don't feel like Dino had more favor with Vince over anyone else. Vince should have released a lot of guys in the late 80s to early 90s but he seemed to be channeling his father in keeping so many dead weight guys on.[/quote] I would say he was definitely above Hercules. Case in point they were programmed with each other coming out of Wrestlemania V and Bravo was going over Herc pretty much every night on the house show circuit. Bravo was very protected in 88-89 even on house shows. He dominated feuds with Ken Patera and Hercules in which he was winning all of the house show matches and went about 50/50 in his feud with Duggan where they were trading wins which isn't bad at all considering Duggan was more over and also was usually given pretty strong protection by the bookers. In 90 he finally started jobbing a lot more but even then it was mainly to Hogan and Warrior who everyone lost to and on top of that it also meant he was working higher on the card even if in the case of Hogan it was tag matches with Bravo tagging with Earthquake against Hulk and Tugobat. He also was losing most of his singles matches with Tugboat around the horn. However Tugboat was still new and I think someone they had high hopes for at that point although he really didn't get over as much as they thought he would and they quickly gave up on him. Since you mentioned them Warlord and Barbarian were two other guys who were low key booked real strong. They debuted in summer of 88 and I'm pretty sure the first televised pinfall both took was at the 1990 Survivor Series. Barbarian to Hogan in the final fall of the Hulkamaniacs vs. Natural Disasters match and then Warlord shockingly in the opening seconds to Tito in the Grand Finale. In 91 then both started getting pinned a decent bit a little less then a year into both of their solo runs. Their entire run as the Powers of Pain though they were never pinned. Only DQ's, count outs, or six man losses where Fuji teamed with them and got pinned. Even at the 1989 Survivor Series where they were in the same match with Hogan where you would think for sure they would job, they got disqualified and were unscathed. |
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Post by "Playboy" Don Douglas on Jan 23, 2023 7:37:39 GMT -5
I was surprised to learn that Rick Martel tried to save his job by pitching a tag team where Rick would carry the load in the ring. It probably could have been more than they were doing with either guy at the time, though it wasn’t too long after that Rick was working a PPV with HBK, so I guess they had better things in mind for him.
Dino’s death is still one of the more shocking things in wrestling in my opinion. All of the deaths that aren’t natural causes (especially at an advanced age) are tragic in some sense, and even in Brody’s case, if he had been stabbed by a fan it would be no less tragic but certainly less surprising. Brody being stabbed by the booker and Dino being executed by a criminal enterprise are two of the more “what the f***” deaths in wrestling.
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Post by James Fabiano on Jan 23, 2023 9:23:22 GMT -5
I was surprised to learn that Rick Martel tried to save his job by pitching a tag team where Rick would carry the load in the ring. The Can-Can Connection? (their matches could be brought to you by ShopRite) |
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Post by DiBiase is Good on Jan 23, 2023 9:31:35 GMT -5
The thing that surprised me was his random appearance at a UK WWF show in April 92. I thought he was long gone from the company, yet he shows up on a televised event (in the UK anyway) tagging with Colonel Mustafa against LOD. He’d stopped bleaching his hair as well so it was weird to see him with brown hair.
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msc
Dennis Stamp
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Post by msc on Jan 23, 2023 9:35:22 GMT -5
He had connections.
Also, I need to stand up for Haku and The Barbarian here. They had presence, and they weren't slouches in ring. Haku pretty much carried the Colossal Connection due to Andre's health, and he wasn't just standing in the ring having those classics with the Rockers. Barbarian, the better half of the Powers of Pain is a bit damning with faint praise, so I'll add that he got into a pretty damn good run of form in 1990-91, having some pretty good chemistry with Bossman, Bret Hart and others. They were much better than Dino Bravo at any point in his WWF run.
And while Warlords way down that list for me, he did manage to put together some shockingly good matches with Bulldog. Though I think that's more evidence for "Davey Boy was a hell of a talent when sober and uninjured" rather than "Warlord's really underrated you lot".
Oh incidentally, when Haku jumped back to WWF as WCW Hardcore Champion, he gave the belt to Barbarian to return to WCW with, only to find out that Barbarian had left WCW months earlier and nobody had noticed!
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Post by chronocross on Jan 23, 2023 9:40:20 GMT -5
He was okay as a midcard guy, though I don't know what possessed WWE to put that bench press segment on the first Royal Rumble. At least if you had another babyface out there like Muraco or Patera it can start a feud but that thing went on waaaayy too long.
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Post by Hulkshi Tanahashi on Jan 23, 2023 10:37:54 GMT -5
He had connections. Also, I need to stand up for Haku and The Barbarian here. They had presence, and they weren't slouches in ring. Haku pretty much carried the Colossal Connection due to Andre's health, and he wasn't just standing in the ring having those classics with the Rockers. Barbarian, the better half of the Powers of Pain is a bit damning with faint praise, so I'll add that he got into a pretty damn good run of form in 1990-91, having some pretty good chemistry with Bossman, Bret Hart and others. They were much better than Dino Bravo at any point in his WWF run. And while Warlords way down that list for me, he did manage to put together some shockingly good matches with Bulldog. Though I think that's more evidence for "Davey Boy was a hell of a talent when sober and uninjured" rather than "Warlord's really underrated you lot". Oh incidentally, when Haku jumped back to WWF as WCW Hardcore Champion, he gave the belt to Barbarian to return to WCW with, only to find out that Barbarian had left WCW months earlier and nobody had noticed!This is one of the most WCW things I’ve ever heard. |
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Post by "Playboy" Don Douglas on Jan 23, 2023 10:38:52 GMT -5
I was surprised to learn that Rick Martel tried to save his job by pitching a tag team where Rick would carry the load in the ring. The Can-Can Connection? (their matches could be brought to you by ShopRite) Now I’m picturing Martel and Bravo as cancan dancers. |
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