Sting in the Ultimate Warrior's original spot.

[Kevin Hamilton]

Just got to thinking about this today: imagine if instead of the Warrior, WWF had his old tag partner Sting instead. Outside of musculature, Sting was better in every way from the mic to in ring. I think if they'd have booked him the exact same way as Warrior as far as dominance goes he'd have been just as over. Mania 6 could have legitimately been a passing of the torch moment, as the versatility in what you could do with Sting & the type of opponents he faced would have probably been much better and he's less likely to have flaked out like Warrior did as well.

It'd be interesting to see an alternate timeline where that took place.

[tirtefaa]

I don't think it would have mattered.

Sting had the advantage of working with someone like Ric Flair to hone his craft.

I doubt Steve Borden was going to learn much from working with guys like Hercules and Dino Bravo in WWF.

And while he would eventually find his charisma, Sting was not on the same level as Warrior was back when Warrior started in WWF. Also Warrior had a more impressive body, which is what Vince admired most at the time.

Honestly, I don't see Sting rising past the midcard much like Ricky Steamboat was.

[A Platypus Rave]

Apr 14, 2023 19:23:55 GMT -5 Kevin Hamilton said:

Just got to thinking about this today: imagine if instead of the Warrior, WWF had his old tag partner Sting instead. Outside of musculature, Sting was better in every way from the mic to in ring. I think if they'd have booked him the exact same way as Warrior as far as dominance goes he'd have been just as over. Mania 6 could have legitimately been a passing of the torch moment, as the versatility in what you could do with Sting & the type of opponents he faced would have probably been much better and he's less likely to have flaked out like Warrior did as well.

It'd be interesting to see an alternate timeline where that took place.

Sting's biggest problem would probably just in general be... "That doesn't work for me Brother" and Hogan trying to sandbag the new guy.

[Red Mage Riot]

Apr 14, 2023 19:40:48 GMT -5 tirtefaa said:

I don't think it would have mattered.

Sting had the advantage of working with someone like Ric Flair to hone his craft.

I doubt Steve Borden was going to learn much from working with guys like Hercules and Dino Bravo in WWF.

And while he would eventually find his charisma, Sting was not on the same level as Warrior was back when Warrior started in WWF. Also Warrior had a more impressive body, which is what Vince admired most at the time.

Honestly, I don't see Sting rising past the midcard much like Ricky Steamboat was.

Yup, this is the big thing. Sting got as good as he did because of who he was working with. Don't get me wrong, he had natural, undeniable talent, but sharpening that knife against guys like Flair and Windham put him even higher than he would have been naturally. Though, if he follows a 1:1 career path that Warrior got, that means we get the Sting/Rick Rude feud a few years earlier than we did in real life, when Rude was still mostly healthy, and that was undeniably a big "level up" for Sting. He also gets guys like Savage and Perfect to feud with in their primes, so...maybe it's not quite that black and white....

[Milkman Norm]

People seem to be leaving out the Sting in WWF 87-90 part of the equation. Assuming Sting is the one to beat Honky, has the program with Rude & then goes to WrestleMania and beats Hogan I don't know what would have happened. But I certainly don't think this hypothetically is completely outlandish.

[tafkaga]

Yes, Sting is overall better than Warrior. More versatility, longevity, better worker, got better over time, etc. That doesn't mean Warrior was just a lesser Sting. Warrior exceeded Sting in certain areas that were key to his success in the WWF. His look was a 10. Sting's was more like an 8. Warrior's promos were a 10. Sting's promos in the 80's were a 5 or 6 at best. And I don't want to hear revisionist BS about Warrior's promos being awful, incoherent, etc. His promos were 100% on point for his character and part of the presentation that came far closer than anyone else to eclipsing Hulkamania in the 80's.

[Red Mage Riot]

Apr 14, 2023 23:48:08 GMT -5 tafkaga said:

Yes, Sting is overall better than Warrior. More versatility, longevity, better worker, got better over time, etc. That doesn't mean Warrior was just a lesser Sting. Warrior exceeded Sting in certain areas that were key to his success in the WWF. His look was a 10. Sting's was more like an 8. Warrior's promos were a 10. Sting's promos in the 80's were a 5 or 6 at best. And I don't want to hear revisionist BS about Warrior's promos being awful, incoherent, etc. His promos were 100% on point for his character and part of the presentation that came far closer than anyone else to eclipsing Hulkamania in the 80's.

They....really were awful, though. They were incoherent nonsense. Like, Hulk liked a ramble, too, but he would at least mostly stay on point. I think Warrior's promos, in retrospect, get by on the fact that a lot of people who talk about them were kids when they were watching him. He was truly garbage on the mic. Energy expended does not equal competence.

[ThankGodForSidJustice]

It is really amazing how both really lucked out where they both ended up. Sting being the better athlete and worker who also had a better attitude and was more willing to learn was better off in the NWA instead of WWF where he would've been blocked by Hogan. Warrior could get over big time in the colorful cartoony WWF with his physique, charisma, and larger then life appeal.

If they end up in the opposite companies no way either become the huge stars they both ended up becoming. Sting would've still did done well in WWF but likely more in an upper midcard spot. Highly unlikely he become "The Franchise" like he was in the WWF with Hogan being there. Warrior I don't think would've lasted even a year in NWA.

[evilone]

Apr 15, 2023 3:15:56 GMT -5 ThankGodForSidJustice said:

It is really amazing how both really lucked out where they both ended up. Sting being the better athlete and worker who also had a better attitude and was more willing to learn was better off in the NWA instead of WWF where he would've been blocked by Hogan. Warrior could get over big time in the colorful cartoony WWF with his physique, charisma, and larger then life appeal.

If they end up in the opposite companies no way either become the huge stars they both ended up becoming. Sting would've still did done well in WWF but likely more in an upper midcard spot. Highly unlikely he become "The Franchise" like he was in the WWF with Hogan being there. Warrior I don't think would've lasted even a year in NWA.

I don't think it's quite simple as that. They both adjusted to their environment. Warrior knew he was in WWF because of his body, intensity and later lunacy of the character so he had to work on these things as well as Sting who had to work on his wrestling in-ring ability to breakthrough in NWA/WCW. They were both super talented and super aware of their working environment and what people expect from them. And obviously they were both good at doing business cause getting at the top of the crop in any wrestling promotion requires entrepreneur basic skills. Yeah, that sounds funny to us who do other things in life but most of the athletes have no time at all to develop other skills as most of their day is spent on training and improvement. If their roles were reversed I think they would at least be within of 75% of what they have achieved in the real world.

[ThankGodForSidJustice]

Apr 15, 2023 4:03:15 GMT -5 evilone said:

Apr 15, 2023 3:15:56 GMT -5 ThankGodForSidJustice said:

It is really amazing how both really lucked out where they both ended up. Sting being the better athlete and worker who also had a better attitude and was more willing to learn was better off in the NWA instead of WWF where he would've been blocked by Hogan. Warrior could get over big time in the colorful cartoony WWF with his physique, charisma, and larger then life appeal.

If they end up in the opposite companies no way either become the huge stars they both ended up becoming. Sting would've still did done well in WWF but likely more in an upper midcard spot. Highly unlikely he become "The Franchise" like he was in the WWF with Hogan being there. Warrior I don't think would've lasted even a year in NWA.

I don't think it's quite simple as that. They both adjusted to their environment. Warrior knew he was in WWF because of his body, intensity and later lunacy of the character so he had to work on these things as well as Sting who had to work on his wrestling in-ring ability to breakthrough in NWA/WCW. They were both super talented and super aware of their working environment and what people expect from them. And obviously they were both good at doing business cause getting at the top of the crop in any wrestling promotion requires entrepreneur basic skills. Yeah, that sounds funny to us who do other things in life but most of the athletes have no time at all to develop other skills as most of their day is spent on training and improvement. If their roles were reversed I think they would at least be within of 75% of what they have achieved in the real world.

I think you aren't really taking into account the personalities and temperaments of each guy. More so with Warrior. Warrior by most accounts was a very headstrong guy and he wasn't going to get coddled in NWA like he was in WWF. In NWA even the WWF type guys like Sting and Luger were also at the same time really good athletes and could adjust to that style and mentality better. Warrior really wasn't and was more just a comic book character come to life. I don't see him making the effort to up his in ring game to the extent that Sting did and them not being contempt with it as much as WWF was. As a result Warrior isn't pushed and he says screw it and quits.

Sting I think would've done very well in WWF but I don't see him getting the push Warrior got as Warrior had the better physique and was more larger then life despite Sting not lacking in either of those areas either. Like for instance I don't see Sting going over Hogan at a Wrestlemania like Warrior did. Likely he is probably steady #2 face from 89 through 91, below Hogan and a little above guys like Jake, Beefcake, and Boss Man. With Warrior in 90-91 it was more like he was on the same level on Hogan with them being 1A and 1B. However I do see Sting ending up becoming "The Guy" after Hogan leaves in 92 instead of having to reluctantly go with Bret who likely never gets his run on top and possibly goes to WCW much sooner. Sting would've been a better top guy then Bret as while not as good in the ring he was still pretty good while having more charisma and coming off more like a top guy. However at the same time he probably doesn't draw much better as business in general was really down in the mid 90's no matter who was on top.

["Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay]

Sting could absolutely have had Warrior's run, and might even have done a better job

Warrior absolutely could not have had Sting's run, though

[tafkaga]

Apr 15, 2023 0:11:03 GMT -5 Red Mage Riot said:

Apr 14, 2023 23:48:08 GMT -5 tafkaga said:

Yes, Sting is overall better than Warrior. More versatility, longevity, better worker, got better over time, etc. That doesn't mean Warrior was just a lesser Sting. Warrior exceeded Sting in certain areas that were key to his success in the WWF. His look was a 10. Sting's was more like an 8. Warrior's promos were a 10. Sting's promos in the 80's were a 5 or 6 at best. And I don't want to hear revisionist BS about Warrior's promos being awful, incoherent, etc. His promos were 100% on point for his character and part of the presentation that came far closer than anyone else to eclipsing Hulkamania in the 80's.

They....really were awful, though. They were incoherent nonsense. Like, Hulk liked a ramble, too, but he would at least mostly stay on point. I think Warrior's promos, in retrospect, get by on the fact that a lot of people who talk about them were kids when they were watching him. He was truly garbage on the mic. Energy expended does not equal competence.

I have to disagree about his promos. They were definitely 'out there', just like his character, but not rambling nonsense. He put 110% into making sure that character was presented in exact accordance with his vision, so to think that he just gave half ass rambling promos is completely against character. I have no doubt that he scripted them and carefully chose every word. I certainly cannot blame someone for not liking his promos, the same way a lot of people didn't like his character, but I don't think that either one of those things are garbage.

[Citizen Snips Has Left]

I think a key to Warrior’s appeal was even in the cartoonish world of late 80’s WWF, he was a ridiculously outlandish figure. Like, he was beyond how crazy a wrestler should be. Sting had some fire/intensity but not enough to compete with what the high octane babyfaces in WWF at the time were. bringing to the table.

I’d see Sting at like a Beefcake/Snake Roberts/Hacksaw Duggan tier, despite being “better” than Warrior.

[Jumpin' Jesse Walsh]

We wouldn't have gotten an anti-smoking PSA from Sting where he has like a billion cigarettes in his mouth and crushes a billion more with his bare hands. That's all I know.

[Cranjis McBasketball]

Sting may have been WCW's Hulk Hogan, but that doesn't make them equals. Sting was 100% Ringo to Hogan's rest of the Beatles.

[Deleted]

One thing’s for certain, WCW doesn’t live as long.

[karl100589]

The ideal time to bring Sting in would’ve been in place of Luger. Imagine in 1993; Hogan has been beaten, Yokozuna has defeated everyone on the USS Intrepid, and this guy steps off the helicopter to slam him.

[ThankGodForSidJustice]

Apr 15, 2023 20:29:43 GMT -5 Jumpin' Jesse Walsh said:

We wouldn't have gotten an anti-smoking PSA from Sting where he has like a billion cigarettes in his mouth and crushes a billion more with his bare hands. That's all I know.

But would Warrior have palled around with Robocop?

[malloc]

Apr 15, 2023 0:11:03 GMT -5 Red Mage Riot said:

Apr 14, 2023 23:48:08 GMT -5 tafkaga said:

Yes, Sting is overall better than Warrior. More versatility, longevity, better worker, got better over time, etc. That doesn't mean Warrior was just a lesser Sting. Warrior exceeded Sting in certain areas that were key to his success in the WWF. His look was a 10. Sting's was more like an 8. Warrior's promos were a 10. Sting's promos in the 80's were a 5 or 6 at best. And I don't want to hear revisionist BS about Warrior's promos being awful, incoherent, etc. His promos were 100% on point for his character and part of the presentation that came far closer than anyone else to eclipsing Hulkamania in the 80's.

They....really were awful, though. They were incoherent nonsense. Like, Hulk liked a ramble, too, but he would at least mostly stay on point. I think Warrior's promos, in retrospect, get by on the fact that a lot of people who talk about them were kids when they were watching him. He was truly garbage on the mic. Energy expended does not equal competence.

Yes, but in context of the era warrior's promos work, yes most of us were kids at the time but that's who it was being marketed to. It was the late 80s early 90s. It was like He-man and Connan smashed together and come to life. In the 90s it was kids who bought action figures (oddly those same kids are still buying action figures but those kids are now in their late 30s - early 40s).

[This Player Hating Mothman]

Apr 14, 2023 20:17:07 GMT -5 Red Mage Riot said:

Apr 14, 2023 19:40:48 GMT -5 tirtefaa said:

I don't think it would have mattered.

Sting had the advantage of working with someone like Ric Flair to hone his craft.

I doubt Steve Borden was going to learn much from working with guys like Hercules and Dino Bravo in WWF.

And while he would eventually find his charisma, Sting was not on the same level as Warrior was back when Warrior started in WWF. Also Warrior had a more impressive body, which is what Vince admired most at the time.

Honestly, I don't see Sting rising past the midcard much like Ricky Steamboat was.

Yup, this is the big thing. Sting got as good as he did because of who he was working with. Don't get me wrong, he had natural, undeniable talent, but sharpening that knife against guys like Flair and Windham put him even higher than he would have been naturally. Though, if he follows a 1:1 career path that Warrior got, that means we get the Sting/Rick Rude feud a few years earlier than we did in real life, when Rude was still mostly healthy, and that was undeniably a big "level up" for Sting. He also gets guys like Savage and Perfect to feud with in their primes, so...maybe it's not quite that black and white....

It speaks to a radical difference in the approach to building stars that's honestly still kind of felt today in WWE. Warrior was all push. They put him with some talented guys, but he wasn't necessarily going out there with the idea of "Work this program, learn what you're doing, get better", but with the idea of "Go out there, win, look good, the rest comes naturally". Flair was a project, and building him up was about a lot more than just winning matches, which stands as a significant portion of why Ultimate Warrior is this guy who was a big star for a few years in the late '80s and early '90s, Sting is this storied talent who's lasted through era after era in some form or another and built himself up a storied body of work and a legend as one of the top guys of the business instead of just one of the guys who was champ for some time.