Wow they are really making orton look weak

[saggyboyflair]

Why do they do that. It seems Orton is just better off without the title. He has been made to look like an assclown and a weak champion. He was going great but ever since he has won the title, he doesnt seem AS over and the booking over his character is just pathetic. Is he just another transitional champ until Cena or Trips get the belt back?

[azz0r]

...because he is a transitional champ...

[nerdinitupagain]

There's two type of heel champions... dominating heels (like the Giant or HHH) and cowardly heels who barely escape with the title each time (Flair).

The Flair type makes crowd just really want to see the heel lose the title but he'll get himself DQ'd or cheat to win.. usually the feud where he loses the title the crowd is just begging to have the title taken off him and put on the glorious face.

Just because you're booked weak, doesn't mean your title reign is going poorly. Just look at most of Flair's when he came back to WCW. He'd be champ, but Woman and Elizabeth would hit his opponents with their shoe in front of the ref to get him DQ'd when he was about to lose by pinfall.

[Loki]

I agree about the "coward heel" theory, BUT...

Flair was putting on good (from a psychology/storytelling standpoint) matches. Orton is just there, standing with the belt during promos, staring bored/dazed into the camera. A bit better in the ring, but light-years away from an acceptable level IMO.

JBL and Honky Tonk Man were less talented in the ring, but were great to get under the crowd's skin anyway.

Edge is halfway between Flair and HTM, but still very good in his "I will stoop lower than low to win/keep the belt" role.

Orton isn't all of that. Not entirely his fault, but his "psychotic" look looks more like a puzzled one.

[Mozenrath]

loki said:

I agree about the "coward heel" theory, BUT...

Flair was putting on good (from a psychology/storytelling standpoint) matches. Orton is just there, standing with the belt during promos, staring bored/dazed into the camera. A bit better in the ring, but light-years away from an acceptable level IMO.

JBL and Honky Tonk Man were less talented in the ring, but were great to get under the crowd's skin anyway.

Edge is halfway between Flair and HTM, but still very good in his "I will stoop lower than low to win/keep the belt" role.

Orton isn't all of that. Not entirely his fault, but his "psychotic" look looks more like a puzzled one.

I will concede that he's a victim of higher standards.

Edge will make pretty much anyone look like a bad heel by comparison, short of guys like JBL, Trips and Naitch, who don't need much to get over nowadays.

[Avalanche Alvarez]

saggyboyflair said:

Is he just another transitional champ until Cena or Trips get the belt back?

Yes.
And he'll cheat to keep the belt until one of the aforementioned wrestlers are ready to take it.
Sorry, Randy. Them's the breaks.

[Hakumental]

Orton makes Orton look weak.

[Avalanche Alvarez]

neophyte said:

Orton makes Orton look weak.

You have a point there.

[MCMGM]

loki said:

I agree about the "coward heel" theory, BUT...

Flair was putting on good (from a psychology/storytelling standpoint) matches. Orton is just there, standing with the belt during promos, staring bored/dazed into the camera. A bit better in the ring, but light-years away from an acceptable level IMO.

JBL and Honky Tonk Man were less talented in the ring, but were great to get under the crowd's skin anyway.

Edge is halfway between Flair and HTM, but still very good in his "I will stoop lower than low to win/keep the belt" role.

Orton isn't all of that. Not entirely his fault, but his "psychotic" look looks more like a puzzled one.

I agree on that. JBL is a fantasic heel as far as his character goes. I f***ing HATED him when he was doing the 'Wrestling God' gimmick.

[wrestlecrapcrap]

He only jobbed last night because he will be pinning Jeff at the rumble. Jeff getting the pin though keeps his push going, makes him look like a legit main eventer and gives fans hope he can do it at the PPV.

HBK shouldn't be randomly jobbing on TV, and there is no way Kennedy should have took the pin after the amount of losses he has had recently. Orton pinning Jeff would have lost Jeff alot of momentum from last night's win, but this makes him look like he is on their level.

[Bullhead]

He's weak no matter what they do. I find it all very humorous.

[T.J. "the Crippler" Stevens]

But he doesn't even cheat to win like Flair did. He would need to actually win a match to qualify.

[Tapout]

neophyte said:

Orton makes Orton look weak.

Yes. Randy screwed Randy.

Also, the guy would not work as a dominating Brock Lesnar-esque monster babyface, or a dominating Undertaker-esque monster heel.

[CrazySting]

How has Randy made himself look bad? His in ring performances have been top notch. Since he won he's had great matches with HHH, Jericho and HBK. I agree his promos have been so so but he was never marketed like the rock or Hogan where his mic skills are the number one thing is his repotoire. Really, everyone was expecting good wrestling performances from him and he's delivered that.


I'm not saying he's been a huge hit as champ, but good matches, steady ratings (apart from that first one) and decent heel reactions have made sure he won't be remembered as a huge flop either.

[Loki]

cenamark21 said:

How has Randy made himself look bad? His in ring performances have been top notch. Since he won he's had great matches with HHH, Jericho and HBK. I agree his promos have been so so but he was never marketed like the rock or Hogan where his mic skills are the number one thing is his repotoire. Really, everyone was expecting good wrestling performances from him and he's delivered that.


I'm not saying he's been a huge hit as champ, but good matches, steady ratings (apart from that first one) and decent heel reactions have made sure he won't be remembered as a huge flop either.

You're right about Orton not being bad in the ring, but the problem is his persona and his demeanour during matches and especially promos.

I'm struggling to remember a moment when I though "wow, Orton really looks like he WANT the WWE title so badly!"

Sure, his matches have been steadly good, but the storytelling, not so much. Even during the nice "concussion" angle with HBK, Orton looked more puzzled/apathetic than cold blooded and driven.
Not to mention how plainly he reacted to HBK's and Jericho's verbal assaults... He just stood there...

Orton is not a failure from a business standpoint, but I have problems to remember something memorable HE said or did during his tenure.

[Feargus McReddit]

I always thought that Orton was great during his IC title runs.

If he can bring that persona back, he's good.

[JMA]

I think one of Orton's biggest problems is that he just doesn't feel like an important character.

[Hiroshi Hase]

jma said:

I think one of Orton's biggest problems is that he just doesn't feel like an important character.

I have to agree, it doesn't even feel like he's the WWE Champion at this time honestly.