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Post by Baixo Astral on Dec 18, 2007 7:38:08 GMT -5
If a wrestler loses a career match in Georgia, will they be allowed to ever work there again?
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"Magic" Mark Hurr
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Here, have some chili dogs
Now featuring half the brain that you do.
Posts: 16,538
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Post by "Magic" Mark Hurr on Dec 18, 2007 7:44:01 GMT -5
this whole thing is bullshit at it's finest.
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Post by Dr. Bunsen Honeydew on Dec 18, 2007 8:04:55 GMT -5
Not good. It doesn't look like either side will budge. The E will probably lose a lot of $$ for not holding shows in Georgia. That can't be good for the company. WWE will not lose ANY money. They will just have those shows elewhere. Its the venues that WWE runs that are out of money.
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General Zod
Samurai Cop
KNEEL!
KNEEL BEFORE ZOD!!
Posts: 2,163
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Post by General Zod on Dec 18, 2007 8:29:58 GMT -5
You can hem and haw about wrestling not being "real" all you like, but at the end of the day, you must see it (not as a logical entitiy that makes sense to you) as an athletic event. Predetermined, pulled punches, or not. Two men are still entering the ring to "compete". That is, in a nutshell, the very essence of pro wrestling. And if it barks like a dog, and runs like a dog, and looks like a dog... Incorrect in every way possible. It is so FAR from an athletic event that it's ignorant to even try to justify it as one. By definition an athletic event is a player or group of players opposing one another in an event they are trying to WIN. Pro Wrestling ... Yeah, no one is trying to win. Sure it might look as such since one guy eventually will get a pin, but neither of them are actually trying to beat the other. THEY ARE PERFORMING! It's a BIG difference. "Two men are still entering the ring to "compete". That is, in a nutshell, the very essence of pro wrestling." No they are not, it's not a competition. It's a performance, a WORK ... a rouse if you will. It's called smoking mirrors. You think you are seeing one thing, when in actuality something totally different is happening. It is not even close to being two guys in the ring competing. It's two guys in a ring WORKING TOGETHER TO PUT ON A SHOW. That is, in a nutshell, the very essence of pro wrestling.By the way, these rules are ignorant. I read of these a while back and just literally fell out of my chair laughing. You can tell the person who wrote these either A.) Doesn't want wrestling in Georgia or B.) Is a mark. Are you kidding? No double team moves in a tag match? That one alone had me rolling. Just ignorant. No Indy fed will ever run Georgia, $10,000 is more then ANY (I REPEAT) ANY Indy makes off of gate, let alone pre-sale. There'd be no one capable of putting up that kind of money in advance. I appreciate your opinion, but just because you think I'm wrong doesn't mean I am. When I watch Monday Night RAW on USA, and Jim Ross goes out of his way to use the word "compete" to describe what Ric Flair wants to do with the rest of his career, it's increasingly difficult for any of you to make an opposing point of view. True, it's "entertainment". I never said otherwise. But real or preformed, two men are still in the middle of the ring, competing. Jim Ross himself admits it. Vince McMahon has said it on many occasions himself. So has half the roster. Someone else said it earlier in this thread, but it bears repeating: It seems like a lot of pro wrestling's legacy and future is predicated on whichever perception is convienient for the debate at hand. It's real/not real, preformance, art/competition. Bullspit. Call it for what it is. The entire industry - McMahon-land, TNA, The Indies, Japan, Mexico, Europe, and anyone else who runs business under the guise of professional wrestling - has one interest in mind: Making money. And they make that money by providing you, the fans, what you want to see - competition between guys who take matters into their own hands. If you want entertainment, go to a movie. This is wrestling. And while yes, wrestling is supposed to be entertaining as well, I must admit to having different reasons for wanting to go to a movie than buying a ticket to go see a match. As long as the WWE (and all of pr wrestling) continues to use ring sports guidelines to conduct their business and showcase their in-ring product, they will be privy to any and/or all state athletic commissions who have rules regarding such issues. As I said before, I suspect this is going to get worse before it gets better. I'd expect to see even more states follow suit.
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Post by Red 'n' Black Reggie on Dec 18, 2007 11:38:55 GMT -5
You can hem and haw about wrestling not being "real" all you like, but at the end of the day, you must see it (not as a logical entitiy that makes sense to you) as an athletic event. Predetermined, pulled punches, or not. Two men are still entering the ring to "compete". That is, in a nutshell, the very essence of pro wrestling. And if it barks like a dog, and runs like a dog, and looks like a dog... Incorrect in every way possible. It is so FAR from an athletic event that it's ignorant to even try to justify it as one. By definition an athletic event is a player or group of players opposing one another in an event they are trying to WIN. Pro Wrestling ... Yeah, no one is trying to win. Sure it might look as such since one guy eventually will get a pin, but neither of them are actually trying to beat the other. THEY ARE PERFORMING! It's a BIG difference. "Two men are still entering the ring to "compete". That is, in a nutshell, the very essence of pro wrestling." No they are not, it's not a competition. It's a performance, a WORK ... a rouse if you will. It's called smoking mirrors. You think you are seeing one thing, when in actuality something totally different is happening. It is not even close to being two guys in the ring competing. It's two guys in a ring WORKING TOGETHER TO PUT ON A SHOW. That is, in a nutshell, the very essence of pro wrestling.By the way, these rules are ignorant. I read of these a while back and just literally fell out of my chair laughing. You can tell the person who wrote these either A.) Doesn't want wrestling in Georgia or B.) Is a mark. Are you kidding? No double team moves in a tag match? That one alone had me rolling. Just ignorant. No Indy fed will ever run Georgia, $10,000 is more then ANY (I REPEAT) ANY Indy makes off of gate, let alone pre-sale. There'd be no one capable of putting up that kind of money in advance. exactly. calling wrestling real is like calling the last fight of "rocky" real.
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Erik Majorwitz
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
I don't have a PS3.
Longest Crapper- Laying it across the table
Posts: 18,051
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Post by Erik Majorwitz on Dec 18, 2007 11:51:12 GMT -5
Wrestling isn't real?
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randomranter
Dennis Stamp
When you grow up....... YOU'RE GONNA BE WROOOOOONG!!!!
Posts: 4,804
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Post by randomranter on Dec 18, 2007 11:58:47 GMT -5
It is according to the state of Georgia.
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azz0r
Dennis Stamp
Ex 4 month ruling Wrestlecrap PPV Prediction Champion
Posts: 3,696
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Post by azz0r on Dec 18, 2007 12:17:23 GMT -5
Okay so I can understand alot of these rules and theyre somewhat fair but highly strict and ridiculous, but this I don't understand.
-------- Breaking a. A wrestler: i. Shall break a hold when instructed by the referee; ii. Failing to break upon instruction by the referee, the offending contestant shall be given a count of ten (10) to release the hold; and iii. Failing to release the hold after the count of ten (10), the offending contestant shall be disqualified and the opponent shall be awarded the match by the referee. ----------
Match rules are a completely different kettle of fish, as the move is "fake" what right do they have to intefere with the rules?
Charging 5% of income and having railing heights ; bearable...but no blading and a required amount of clothing : MORONIC.
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Post by nerdinitupagain on Dec 18, 2007 12:25:16 GMT -5
Eh.. mixed opinions on all of this.
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Post by plushtar on Dec 18, 2007 12:50:06 GMT -5
If a wrestler loses a career match in Georgia, will they be allowed to ever work there again? Great way for the WWE to leave. They should have a battle royale where anyone elminated cannont enter Georgia again. And even the winner will somehow fall over the top rope.
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default
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Blames Everything On Snitsky. Yes, Even THAT.
Posts: 17,056
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Post by default on Dec 18, 2007 12:52:17 GMT -5
IT'S STILL REAL TO ME, DAMMIT!
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Post by SassovsHart on Dec 18, 2007 15:12:38 GMT -5
Pwinsider is saying now that the end result of today's hearings was that the commission decided to take an extra 60 days to meet with local promoters to try and figure out a way to institute some new rules without destroying the Indy scene down there.
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Post by Red Impact on Dec 18, 2007 15:59:41 GMT -5
I appreciate your opinion, but just because you think I'm wrong doesn't mean I am. When I watch Monday Night RAW on USA, and Jim Ross goes out of his way to use the word "compete" to describe what Ric Flair wants to do with the rest of his career, it's increasingly difficult for any of you to make an opposing point of view. True, it's "entertainment". I never said otherwise. But real or preformed, two men are still in the middle of the ring, competing. Jim Ross himself admits it. Vince McMahon has said it on many occasions himself. So has half the roster. Someone else said it earlier in this thread, but it bears repeating: It seems like a lot of pro wrestling's legacy and future is predicated on whichever perception is convienient for the debate at hand. It's real/not real, preformance, art/competition. Bullspit. Call it for what it is. The entire industry - McMahon-land, TNA, The Indies, Japan, Mexico, Europe, and anyone else who runs business under the guise of professional wrestling - has one interest in mind: Making money. And they make that money by providing you, the fans, what you want to see - competition between guys who take matters into their own hands. If you want entertainment, go to a movie. This is wrestling. And while yes, wrestling is supposed to be entertaining as well, I must admit to having different reasons for wanting to go to a movie than buying a ticket to go see a match. As long as the WWE (and all of pr wrestling) continues to use ring sports guidelines to conduct their business and showcase their in-ring product, they will be privy to any and/or all state athletic commissions who have rules regarding such issues. As I said before, I suspect this is going to get worse before it gets better. I'd expect to see even more states follow suit. Of course Jim Ross tries to pass it off as real, that's his job. If they treated it as a performance, rather than real combat, then they'd basically be undermining all of their matches, gimmicks, angles and, more importantly, titles. But calling a performance real doesn't make it so. They do it because they think those they're marketing to deem it a necessity to. Criss Angel can call his tricks real magic, that doesn't mean the spirits are causing him to levitate. The very essence of real competition is that the outcome and action is, more or less, uncertain. That's not the case n wrestling. They can call it professional wrestling ro sports entertainment all they want, but it holds far more in common with a circus than with any real sport. Most people realize that and don't try to put the same restrictions on it as real sports.
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Post by CJ Denton is Egon on Dec 18, 2007 16:33:40 GMT -5
Pwinsider is saying now that the end result of today's hearings was that the commission decided to take an extra 60 days to meet with local promoters to try and figure out a way to institute some new rules without destroying the Indy scene down there. thats like saying "we are trying to find a way to shoot someone in the head with a shotgun, and not kill them"
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Chainsaw
T
A very BAD man.
It is what it is
Posts: 90,480
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Post by Chainsaw on Dec 18, 2007 16:37:03 GMT -5
I'm pretty sure they made those rules specifically to keep the WWE out of Georgia.
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Post by jordenisgood on Dec 18, 2007 17:03:33 GMT -5
Incorrect in every way possible. It is so FAR from an athletic event that it's ignorant to even try to justify it as one. By definition an athletic event is a player or group of players opposing one another in an event they are trying to WIN. Pro Wrestling ... Yeah, no one is trying to win. Sure it might look as such since one guy eventually will get a pin, but neither of them are actually trying to beat the other. THEY ARE PERFORMING! It's a BIG difference. "Two men are still entering the ring to "compete". That is, in a nutshell, the very essence of pro wrestling." No they are not, it's not a competition. It's a performance, a WORK ... a rouse if you will. It's called smoking mirrors. You think you are seeing one thing, when in actuality something totally different is happening. It is not even close to being two guys in the ring competing. It's two guys in a ring WORKING TOGETHER TO PUT ON A SHOW. That is, in a nutshell, the very essence of pro wrestling.By the way, these rules are ignorant. I read of these a while back and just literally fell out of my chair laughing. You can tell the person who wrote these either A.) Doesn't want wrestling in Georgia or B.) Is a mark. Are you kidding? No double team moves in a tag match? That one alone had me rolling. Just ignorant. No Indy fed will ever run Georgia, $10,000 is more then ANY (I REPEAT) ANY Indy makes off of gate, let alone pre-sale. There'd be no one capable of putting up that kind of money in advance. I appreciate your opinion, but just because you think I'm wrong doesn't mean I am. When I watch Monday Night RAW on USA, and Jim Ross goes out of his way to use the word "compete" to describe what Ric Flair wants to do with the rest of his career, it's increasingly difficult for any of you to make an opposing point of view. True, it's "entertainment". I never said otherwise. But real or preformed, two men are still in the middle of the ring, competing. Jim Ross himself admits it. Vince McMahon has said it on many occasions himself. So has half the roster. Someone else said it earlier in this thread, but it bears repeating: It seems like a lot of pro wrestling's legacy and future is predicated on whichever perception is convienient for the debate at hand. It's real/not real, preformance, art/competition. Bullspit. Call it for what it is. The entire industry - McMahon-land, TNA, The Indies, Japan, Mexico, Europe, and anyone else who runs business under the guise of professional wrestling - has one interest in mind: Making money. And they make that money by providing you, the fans, what you want to see - competition between guys who take matters into their own hands. If you want entertainment, go to a movie. This is wrestling. And while yes, wrestling is supposed to be entertaining as well, I must admit to having different reasons for wanting to go to a movie than buying a ticket to go see a match. As long as the WWE (and all of pr wrestling) continues to use ring sports guidelines to conduct their business and showcase their in-ring product, they will be privy to any and/or all state athletic commissions who have rules regarding such issues. As I said before, I suspect this is going to get worse before it gets better. I'd expect to see even more states follow suit. They call it competition because they are trying to create the illusion not only to your eyes (By watching) but your ears to by having everyone refer to it as competition. It's "SMOKING MIRRORS" as I said. It's not competition. It's not real. It's fake. Get over it.
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Dec 18, 2007 17:43:54 GMT -5
But why do we call it fake, though?
People get injured, don't they? People have ended up in wheelchairs because of what happened in the ring, haven't they?
To call something fake is to say nothing they do is real. A copy of a painting is fake because it's just a copy. It was not made by the artist who did it but by someone who wanted a poster or a picture or something else.
If there is one thing I can take away is that what those guys do in the ring, they're literally beating the crap out of each other just to see if I cheer and react.
To call it 'Fake' would be an insult to everyone who's ever been injured or performed.
I'm sorry if this is off topic, but we fans know how it is like watching wrestling for a few years or many years, so why do we keep the same bullcrap media perception?
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Post by Red Impact on Dec 18, 2007 17:49:24 GMT -5
But why do we call it fake, though? People get injured, don't they? People have ended up in wheelchairs because of what happened in the ring, haven't they? To call something fake is to say nothing they do is real. A copy of a painting is fake because it's just a copy. It was not made by the artist who did it but by someone who wanted a poster or a picture or something else. If there is one thing I can take away is that what those guys do in the ring, they're literally beating the crap out of each other just to see if I cheer and react. To call it 'Fake' would be an insult to everyone who's ever been injured or performed. I'm sorry if this is off topic, but we fans know how it is like watching wrestling for a few years or many years, so why do we keep the same bullcrap media perception? It's fake competition. They're not really competing for anything. To be a competition, it must be real. It's not, so people treat it as it is, fake. It's not an insult to call it such, it's reality. It's no more of an insult to call the Onion a fake newspaper. They're not really reporting on news, so it's not really a newspaper. That doesn't mean you can't find what they do funny, but just because you do doesn't make it a legit source. It's a performance, all staged. These rules would be like trying to dictate what the director of a play could have happen on stage.
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Dec 18, 2007 17:58:47 GMT -5
But why do we call it fake, though? People get injured, don't they? People have ended up in wheelchairs because of what happened in the ring, haven't they? To call something fake is to say nothing they do is real. A copy of a painting is fake because it's just a copy. It was not made by the artist who did it but by someone who wanted a poster or a picture or something else. If there is one thing I can take away is that what those guys do in the ring, they're literally beating the crap out of each other just to see if I cheer and react. To call it 'Fake' would be an insult to everyone who's ever been injured or performed. I'm sorry if this is off topic, but we fans know how it is like watching wrestling for a few years or many years, so why do we keep the same bullcrap media perception? It's fake competition. They're not really competing for anything. To be a competition, it must be real. It's not, so people treat it as it is, fake. It's not an insult to call it such, it's reality. It's no more of an insult to call the Onion a fake newspaper. They're not really reporting on news, so it's not really a newspaper. That doesn't mean you can't find what they do funny, but just because you do doesn't make it a legit source. It's a performance, all staged. These rules would be like trying to dictate what the director of a play could have happen on stage. I never said it was competition. I just said why we have to glamourise everything as 'fake'. It would be like acting. I just watched Natalie Portman in V for Vendetta showing emotion towards something she shouldn't have shown emotion to. Because it's all 'fake'. She's performing in front of a man in a mask voiced by Hugh Jackman and the room she is in is a studio in London or wherever it was filmed. But you have to get yourself in the right state of mind to be able to cry on queue. You have to be able to let down emotions, let down feelings, all just to have the perfect picture to show to the audience. If you said to her 'What you are doing is all fake', I'd think she'd be insulted. All she is doing is Films are not real. Wrestling is not real. The people who do it, who perform, who put their lives on the line are real. The risks they take can sometimes be very very real and I think this year, we've all seen what shape they can take. My question is not 'Why is Wrestling not a real sport?', all I'm asking is 'Why must we shun down what people do and what sacrifices they take all because what they do is not actually real to start off with?'
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Steveweiser
Dalek
Mickie Mickie You're So Fine... Hey Mickie!
THE GRAPS
Posts: 50,249
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Post by Steveweiser on Dec 18, 2007 18:05:14 GMT -5
WWE and the BBC have a lot in common, what with fake competitions and all.
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