Mr Captain Falcon
Dennis Stamp
So I could write anything in here and it'll be posted?
Posts: 4,689
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Post by Mr Captain Falcon on Dec 25, 2007 23:24:13 GMT -5
Ok, this may be a touchy subject, but I want an honest answer. Which year was a worse year for WWE in terms of the media? 1999 or 2007? Think about each.....
While 2007 had the Benoit tragedies, the Donald, and the Wellness Policy, remember what 1999 had.
1999 had the death of Owen Hart, the crucifixion of Steve Austin, and the paralysis of Darren Drozdov.
Ok so the Donald and the crucifixion weren't bad for the media, but both were funny yet ridiculious, but the other events are things that "experts" will forever blame Vince McMahon for. While Owen never wanted to do the stunt that he did, he did it because he knew that he had a family. Does this make Vince evil? And Chris Benoit had severe brain damage and did the awful thing he did. Does this make Vince evil?
I just want your opinions on this slow news day.
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Post by Topher is Human on Dec 25, 2007 23:27:07 GMT -5
Vince did not kill Chris, Chris killed Chris...
Although the media will never, ever see that... so I say 2007
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Post by wolfmoon103100 on Dec 26, 2007 0:23:08 GMT -5
This has been the worst year in wrestling And I been watching wrestling for 25 yrs. Hell, They have congress after them now.
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Post by Dick Foley on Dec 26, 2007 0:26:55 GMT -5
1994. It was the year McMahon was under trial for Steriods. The ratings and attendence took an immediate dive. Hogan left for WCW and they started to gain popularity. This was as close as Vince has come to going out of business. No matter how bad the WWE looks with deaths of Owen, Eddie, or Chris they were not hurt finanically from it. No matter how bad you think WWE is doing now, they are FAR better than they were in 1994.
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bobolebowski
Don Corleone
The Future....Of....THE WORLD!
Posts: 1,508
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Post by bobolebowski on Dec 26, 2007 0:37:27 GMT -5
I said long before that this was the worse year for WWE and wrestling together. But yeah WWE has suffered a lot.
All the wellness violations..
Top stars like Edge, Undertaker, John Cena, Bobby Lashley, Triple H, Shawn Michaels, Rey Mysterio, and others have all be injured at one part of the year or another.
The Chris Benoit Tragedy- need I say more
The flop of ECW earlier in the year, although I must say it is getting way more entertaining since the Smackdown-ECW Talent Exchange.
And also WWEs Roster has lost a lot of top teir names and performers over the past year. Ex: Kurt Angle, Booker T, Big Show, Rob Van Dam, and Chris Benoit for all various reasons. But its hurt the overall value of the roster.
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Post by SassovsHart on Dec 26, 2007 0:40:44 GMT -5
Ok so the Donald and the crucifixion weren't bad for the media I'd go a step further and say that Trump was big positive for WWE, even if a lot of people on the internet didn't like it. They got a ton of media attention and for once it wasn't about something negative. It was simply because of a fun/goofy storyline that got the public talking. People talking about either Mcmahon or Trump getting their head shaved was all over the media. And at least from my personal experience I ran into a lot of non-wrestling fans who decided to pool together with their families/friends to buy Mania to see whose head got shaved. I also heard lots of local radio personalities talk about how they were going to do the same thing. The media and public was viewing WWE as what the E would probably like to be viewed as: Campy, yet entertaining programming that's fun to talk about with your friends and family. I view it as a bright spot for WWE in a horrible year filled with deaths, steroid scandals, injuries, etc.
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Post by Aaron E. Dangerously on Dec 26, 2007 0:45:34 GMT -5
2007 has been the biggest year for the WWE in a long time, both in good ways and bad.
Good: CONSTANTLY topping Yahoo search results. Everybody was looking up WWE, even before the Benoit tragedy. Also: Record-breaking WM buys. It seems like it's been a banner year financially for WWE and word of mouth is really spreading. Which also brings us to the bad.
Bad: So many deaths. A massive drug crackdown. 2007 marks the breaking point for a lot of 80s wrestlers who lived the hard lifestyle. So much damage on the bodies and the minds of wrestlers is finally taking its toll.
It's been a wild ride.
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Post by Dynamite Kid on Dec 26, 2007 6:56:39 GMT -5
I don't think this was as bad of a year for WWE, it was a bad year for wrestling as a whole. Our kids are growing up watching murderers?
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Post by rubber johnny on Dec 26, 2007 7:01:38 GMT -5
1999 was worse
when it comes down to it, owen's death was more vince's fault than anyone elses, and the fact that it happened live in front of a ppv audience makes it the biggest tragedy in wrestling history
the incident with benoit was something brewing for a long time in that messed-up family, i don't know if you can blame mcmahon for that one
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Post by EvenBaldobombHasAJob on Dec 26, 2007 15:16:26 GMT -5
1999 was worse. you can't blame Vince for what Chris Benoit did (though the media would like you to). but when it comes to Owen, Vince is the only one you really CAN blame.
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Post by EvilShadow76 on Dec 26, 2007 15:21:37 GMT -5
Image wise I'd say 2007 has been a total nightmare for Vince McMahon & WWE. They've probably already started counting down the minutes until 2008.
I would too if I were him. The Benoit murders & this whole steroid mess has really given wrestling an even blacker eye than it already had.
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Sephiroth
Wade Wilson
Surviving
Posts: 28,900
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Post by Sephiroth on Dec 26, 2007 15:24:02 GMT -5
Its kind of hard to rank a WORST year for WWE, because there have been some pretty cruel ones out there. But I would say this has been the harshest I can recall.
Obviously, it all started with the Chris Benoit tragedy. It came at a pretty horrendous time, as WWE was still riding high on a lot of that media exposure they had gotten from the whole Battle of the Billionare's storyline. So yeah, that started the ball rolling.
As a result of that whole sad situation, WWE came under intense fire from the media for steroids and drug use. As a result, more than a dozen wrestlers, some of them top notch talent, all vanished for a month or two at a time. ECW's roster was the hardest hit of all, no doubt.
Lest we forget, there were other issues. On Smackdown, for instance, the title seemed to be cursed, because Batista, Edge, Undertaker, and others all succumbed to injuries while holding it. Also on the healing list is the man WWE built up as their single largest superstar, John Cena, who's dropout came little more than midway through the year. And finally, there were several times that the ratings for RAW and ECW both tanked out.
So yeah, this has probably been the worst year I can remember.
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Post by Cyno on Dec 26, 2007 15:26:37 GMT -5
I think 2007 is probably the worst year in WWE history in terms of tragedies and all-around awful events (like the steroids bust, Congress crap, etc.). From a business standpoint, there have been worse years.
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Jack
Team Rocket
Posts: 903
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Post by Jack on Dec 26, 2007 15:31:36 GMT -5
1999 was worse. you can't blame Vince for what Chris Benoit did (though the media would like you to). but when it comes to Owen, Vince is the only one you really CAN blame. If he says "We want you to come in from the ceiling on a harness" and you say "Er....okay boss" if something goes wrong it's hardly his fault
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Post by lildude8218 on Dec 26, 2007 15:45:15 GMT -5
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Mac
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Sigs/Avatars cannot exceed 1MB
Posts: 16,502
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Post by Mac on Dec 26, 2007 15:49:32 GMT -5
1995 was unwatchable even though I watched it and ordered all the PPVs. 1999 has some interesting moments, 2007 has been so paint by the numbers and dull that its closing in on 1995 quick.
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Post by destrucity on Dec 27, 2007 1:16:28 GMT -5
The early '90s were much worse. The kiddie molestation charges and casting couch allegations plus the steroids thing almost destroyed the company and people drove away from the product in droves. There has been no huge backlash against the company for the Benoit thing.
As far as the Congress thing goes, it is much less potentially destructive than when Vince could have gone to jail and the company could have been bankrupted if they were found to be part of a steroid distribution ring.
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Post by Dick Foley on Dec 27, 2007 3:14:31 GMT -5
Plus, in the long run there really isn't much Congress can do. Look at the Mitchell Report. It doesn't mean Roger Clemens or Barry Bonds will not be in baseball anymore. It just lets everyone know they did steroids. Congress cannot say "you broke the law Vince, you can no longer be in business". Plus, just like with the NFL and MLB it is not the company that is providing steriods. The athletes and performers are seeking this out on their own and ultimately they are the ones responcible for what they put into their body. Congress will just have a hearing to see what Vince is doing to stop the use of illegal substances in WWE.
I have come to the conclusion that most of you must have been too young to remember 1994-95 because you would know that those were truely the worst years in WWE's history.
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Post by Raja Lion on Dec 27, 2007 3:52:45 GMT -5
This is a real tough question to answer all considering.
I do not agree about 1999. While Owen Hart's death was a tragic accident, it hardly ruined the year for wrestling on whole. It also had the surge of the Rock and some very good storylines/matches throughout the year. It was very entertaining. Steve Austin's "crucifixation" bad? Storylines that make the mainstream news and are controversial are a good thing! Especially to Vince. Sure, it pissed some people off, but just the fact a storyline is mentioned outside of wrestling is great for business and gets more people interested, be it a good or bad storyline.
1994-95 is a good shout and for the WWE/F, it is probably the worst year. It is literally the closest Vince has been to going out of business as well as being piss poor on all sides of the fence including the actual wrestling itself. The steroids trial, the terrible gimmicks, 1994 was 10x worse from a pure wrestling/creative standpoint than any year I can remember, WCW did not get good right out of the gate either after getting the guys who left WWE. 94-95 = horrible. If you didnt watch or are too young to remember it, you really have no idea. You think Lashley is bad? I do too, but he'd have been welcomed in 1994.
2007 is very similar to 1999 except 1999 far exceeded it in terms of entertainment IMO. It also has parallels with a tragedy, but the Benoit tragedy took place outside of the ring and was committed by a guy who for all intents and purposes was nuts, or at the very least went nuts. A lot of that can be blamed on wrestling and the drugs undoubtedly, but it wasnt like Owen's death at all. On the positive side, WWE is making more money now then they did during Attitude, from all the multimedia tieins/advertising revenue/etc. From a pure wrestling standpoint, TNA is growing, they've got a 2 hour timeslot on a cable network and they're putting on some good matches, and WWE have had their moments in 2007, whereas all the moments in 94/95 were horrible. Both TNA and WWE are suffering from creative weaknesses, but its nowhere near as bad as the early 90s.
The WWE/Vince is at its best creatively when their backs are up against the wall. There is no real competition right now. That is the biggest problem. The death of WCW was bad for wrestling on whole. There will always be tragedies in this business, no matter how big or small. The Benoit hubbub is all but gone, Owen is rarely even mentioned anymore. Tragedies happen, and time heals those wounds.
To say 2007 or 1999 is the worst based on tragedies is a bit folly. They're terrible for image and they're horrible things, but there were bright spots in both of those years. 1994 was just an awful time being a wrestling fan. At least in 2007, you could watch TNA and see some good wrestling if WWE was crap, same as in 1999 there was WCW and ECW, plus IMO WWE was fantastic in 99.
2007 hasnt been great, but its been far from the worst and 1999 had its share of brilliant moments. Helmsley/McMahon era, the Higher Power, the Rock becoming the face that "Maivia" was intended to. The positives are there.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2007 6:34:07 GMT -5
Considering that after Owens death the WWE got hot and put WCW out of business. I would hardly consider that it ruined wrestling.
I remember the media coverage for that lasted about a week. Where as the Benoit situation lasted months.
You can tell that WWE is directionless right now. So many guys injured, ECW flopping, ratings going down etc.
In 5 years if WWE is in huge financial trouble. You'll easily be able to point at Benoit as the beginning of the downfall.
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