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Post by Cry Me a Wiggle on Nov 3, 2009 15:43:15 GMT -5
I think part of the problem is that there was some actual merit behind Harry Potter and Pokemon. I didn't like either, but I could see the quality in both.
Twilight is just offensive.
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Krimzon
Crow T. Robot
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Posts: 43,870
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Post by Krimzon on Nov 3, 2009 15:50:53 GMT -5
Yes it will be worse. Now, they have to ruin werewolves along with vampires. Honestly, how is this movie franchise THIS popular? This was my reaction after seeing 27 minutes of Twilight:
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Post by taylorandborland on Nov 3, 2009 16:07:41 GMT -5
I guess my perception might be skewered since I've never read any of the books, seen any of the films or had any of my friends be Twilight die-hards, Okay, I challenge you to check out New Moon by yourself on opening weekend. Then, you come back on here, and tell us how it went.
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Post by YellowJacketY2J on Nov 3, 2009 16:57:33 GMT -5
I guess my perception might be skewered since I've never read any of the books, seen any of the films or had any of my friends be Twilight die-hards, Okay, I challenge you to check out New Moon by yourself on opening weekend. Then, you come back on here, and tell us how it went. The whole point was these films don't interest him, so, instead of watching them and then complaining, he'll just ignore them.
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Post by Kroot bringing Justice on Nov 3, 2009 17:04:38 GMT -5
Okay, I challenge you to check out New Moon by yourself on opening weekend. Then, you come back on here, and tell us how it went. The whole point was these films don't interest him, so, instead of watching them and then complaining, he'll just ignore them. Which is what you people need to freaking do. Gah, Twilight haters are more annoying than people who like it. Yeesh, I had to go off on some jerks for basically making a friend of mine feel like crap for liking Twilight. If you don't like it just f***ing ignore it and move on. Jesus the hate it gets is beyond pathetic.
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4real
Wade Wilson
Posts: 28,709
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Post by 4real on Nov 3, 2009 17:09:59 GMT -5
The whole point was these films don't interest him, so, instead of watching them and then complaining, he'll just ignore them. Which is what you people need to freaking do. Gah, Twilight haters are more annoying than people who like it. Yeesh, I had to go off on some jerks for basically making a friend of mine feel like crap for liking Twilight. If you don't like it just f***ing ignore it and move on. Jesus the hate it gets is beyond pathetic. I've tried many times to hit the nail on the head but I think you just did it sir.
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Post by Jay Carroll on Nov 3, 2009 19:08:57 GMT -5
I will bet anything that those two comments were left by women over 40 years old. After reading the comments on those shirts, you know what's not over 40? My IQ. My brain cells have turned into lemmings and ar jumping off any cliff they can find. It's like Jonestown inside my skull. So there's a bunch of bisexual orgies and eventual Kool-Aid induced suicides going on? Don't think that I'm attacking any of you for having an opinion (I'm not), but for those who couldn't care less about the Twilight franchise, or its fanbase...why pay so much attention to it and focus so much on why you hate it? I guess my perception might be skewered since I've never read any of the books, seen any of the films or had any of my friends be Twilight die-hards, but the backlash to this is very unusually calculated, even by the standards of most fads. People that were sick of Pokemon and Harry Potter when they first debuted didn't rant and rave about their hate as much as those who are tired of Twilight now. It's one thing to not get it, but to get mad at people for loving it? That's very befuddling to me, even if the fanbase is "rabid". There are plenty of things I find sucky/abysmal and don't understand the appeal of, but I choose to ignore them. Unless a girlfriend's dragging you to it, what's the big problem? My problem with it is two-fold: One, unlike most fads that annoy me to tears, this one is mostly propelled by women around my age (and girls my niece's age, more on that later). So I'm forced to have to contend with it, and I don't do so well when I have to put up with something against my will. And the solution isn't to just get new female friends; outside of this most of my female friends are perfectly sane creatures. My second problem is the negative aspects of the story, namely the whole abusive boyfriend bit. I've dealt with a lot of abused women before, and the last thing we need in society is to have females growing up thinking that abuse is fine because "he loves me". Oh, and VAMPIRES DON'T SNORKING GLITTER!
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Allie Kitsune
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Post by Allie Kitsune on Nov 3, 2009 19:14:17 GMT -5
I'm not going to say I have a major "problem" with it, but it _does_ sort of annoy me that the concept or a vampire or a werewolf has basically just become another "fashion accessory" to give to a shallow strawman character in order to desperately try to make a bland plot less so.
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Post by Rorschach on Nov 3, 2009 19:17:41 GMT -5
The whole point was these films don't interest him, so, instead of watching them and then complaining, he'll just ignore them. Which is what you people need to freaking do. Gah, Twilight haters are more annoying than people who like it. Yeesh, I had to go off on some jerks for basically making a friend of mine feel like crap for liking Twilight. If you don't like it just f***ing ignore it and move on. Jesus the hate it gets is beyond pathetic. To be fair, when the damn thing is promoted everywhere you look...it is going to inspire HUGE backlash. And unlike the DARK KNIGHT, which did the same but was able to be defended by it's admirers, there's not a whole lot to defend here. The writing IS subpar, the acting in the movies sucks, and the whole entire plot/storyline is almost offensive. How women are eating this stuff up is beyond me, since the heroine is one of the most offensive, dull, and stupid women to ever hold that role. I've seen soap opera female leads with more sense, courage, and brainpower than Bella Swan. But all of THAT being said...hey, enjoy what you like. I'm not going to run up to anyone wearing the shirts, or buying the books and go off on them. It's their thing. Let em have it. The only way they'll ever get the vitriol out of me is if they confront me with how AWESOME it is...and even THEN, I'm going to take the age of the person into account.
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Post by HMARK Center on Nov 3, 2009 20:40:37 GMT -5
I said this before: I don't like ragging on something simply because it's popular. That's something I used to do when I was 13, and it's a silly and childish way to look at things.
However, I do rag on Twilight. The selfish reason I do that is because I resent how poorly written it is and the fact that kids are being exposed to such poor writing (I consider myself an amateur writer, and found myself feeling pain as I attempted to read it), but the bigger reason has to do with what comes off as an incredible anti-feminist stance the story seems to take.
The female lead is weak, ineffectual, completely reliant on and obsessive about a borderline-abusive and absolutely-controlling boyfriend figure (one she basically says "I was eternally, forever, 100%, no compromising, so-help-me-God, completely in love with him" after about, I don't know, a week), and, from all I've read from the point where I gave up attempting to read it myself, she never, ever grows as a character or begins to learn how to stand up for herself.
Maybe, as a guy, I should mind my own gender-business, but it kind of weirds me out to see so many women enthralled with a story that comes across like this. This would, to me, seem like men embracing a book/movie/whatever that portrays it's lead men as ignorant, smelly, and just flat-out stupid, without ever trying to show the character grow, all the while saying with a straight face "Yes, you're supposed to relate with this character and find him likable." It's insanity.
So, yes, I find myself ragging on this popular trend, because I think it supports very backwards, very creepy gender roles. I think it comes off as promoting a mindset that's really unhealthy for young girls (and adult ones, too), and I know that, were I a father, having checked these stories out myself, I wouldn't really want my daughter reading them.
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Post by Mehe is F'n hardcore. on Nov 3, 2009 20:44:23 GMT -5
I think Bella's a weak character to start with, and the more I read it, the more I think this. I'm personally stuck in my own romantic hellhole right now, but I REALIZE this. She doesn't. She has the most annoying inferiority complex I have ever seen in my life. If she were real, I'd want to stand her before a mirror and repeat Stuart's mantra about a bajillion times until she believed it.
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Post by Allison Reynolds on Nov 3, 2009 20:45:21 GMT -5
I am going to throw this out there, but I liked the book New Moon. (well aside from the beginning part)
It was a huge improvement over the first book, MUCH better than Twilight, in terms of a story line. Twilight wasn't very interesting at all until the ending. And then Eclipse was a good story too.
Now the last book Breaking Dawn, now that was horrible. I borrowed it from the library and skimmed thorugh it, and read the premise/summary, and I couldn't get myself to finish it.
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Post by Rorschach on Nov 3, 2009 20:48:54 GMT -5
HMark said:
"Maybe, as a guy, I should mind my own gender-business, but it kind of weirds me out to see so many women enthralled with a story that comes across like this. This would, to me, seem like men embracing a book/movie/whatever that portrays it's lead men as ignorant, smelly, and just flat-out stupid, without ever trying to show the character grow, all the while saying with a straight face "Yes, you're supposed to relate with this character and find him likable." It's insanity."
Ummm.....Larry the Cable Guy? Homer Simpson? ;D
We men have MORE than enough stupid, dumb, smelly, and boorish characters to embrace, LOL!
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Allie Kitsune
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Post by Allie Kitsune on Nov 3, 2009 20:53:33 GMT -5
This would, to me, seem like men embracing a book/movie/whatever that portrays it's lead men as ignorant, smelly, and just flat-out stupid, without ever trying to show the character grow, all the while saying with a straight face "Yes, you're supposed to relate with this character and find him likable." It's insanity. That said, that seems to BE the common attitude to take towards males. And we have enough males accepting it as fact now that THEY DO NOT WANT TO BE MALE. Sometimes I get the feeling we have an ever-growing, higher and higher number of such rejecting masculinity and desiring (and actively attempting) to become female. So I'd say more males have accepted the "All men are ignorant/stupid/(whatever other negative attribute you wish to apply)" opinion than ever before. I guess that doesn't have a whole lot to do with Twilight, but just that maybe it's not all that surprising that people will accept something that portrays their own gender in a perceived negative light.
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Post by HMARK Center on Nov 3, 2009 21:35:07 GMT -5
HMark said: "Maybe, as a guy, I should mind my own gender-business, but it kind of weirds me out to see so many women enthralled with a story that comes across like this. This would, to me, seem like men embracing a book/movie/whatever that portrays it's lead men as ignorant, smelly, and just flat-out stupid, without ever trying to show the character grow, all the while saying with a straight face "Yes, you're supposed to relate with this character and find him likable." It's insanity." Ummm.....Larry the Cable Guy? Homer Simpson? ;D We men have MORE than enough stupid, dumb, smelly, and boorish characters to embrace, LOL! Hah, well, of course, but let's not forget this about Homer: while the Simpsons was still a quality show, even though Homer was depicted as an oaf, he was still capable of learning to accept something new in his life, and was always, deep down, shown to be completely and totally loving of his family (even if he had to throttle Bart a few times ). At the end of the day, Homer was a character who, while stupid, could grow as a person and had very likable aspects about him. Sadly, the image of men as buffoons who don't accept any changes in life, who eat and drink all day and hate to read, who "luck" into marriages with way-too-hot-for-them wives, is one that gets eaten up more than ever now, it seems. But I still don't see THAT many men actively embracing male characters who exhibit all of the most negative qualities listed there.
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Bedlam LadyD
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Post by Bedlam LadyD on Nov 3, 2009 21:57:55 GMT -5
...Bram Stoker + Rolling = In His Grave
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Jay Peas 42
El Dandy
Totally flips out ALL the time.
Is looking forward to a Nation of Domination Kwannza Special.
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Post by Jay Peas 42 on Nov 3, 2009 22:22:14 GMT -5
...Bram Stoker + Rolling = In His Grave Yeah, Vampires, not Incubus. What I want to know is, who is more at fault for this, Rice or Whedon?
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Post by Mehe is F'n hardcore. on Nov 3, 2009 23:14:29 GMT -5
Twilight has inspired my NANOWRIMO project for this year: Outdo HER.
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AriadosMan
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Your friendly neighborhood superhero
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Post by AriadosMan on Nov 3, 2009 23:26:23 GMT -5
Hah, well, of course, but let's not forget this about Homer: while the Simpsons was still a quality show, even though Homer was depicted as an oaf, he was still capable of learning to accept something new in his life, and was always, deep down, shown to be completely and totally loving of his family (even if he had to throttle Bart a few times ). At the end of the day, Homer was a character who, while stupid, could grow as a person and had very likable aspects about him. Sadly, the image of men as buffoons who don't accept any changes in life, who eat and drink all day and hate to read, who "luck" into marriages with way-too-hot-for-them wives, is one that gets eaten up more than ever now, it seems. But I still don't see THAT many men actively embracing male characters who exhibit all of the most negative qualities listed there. That era was really strongest in the 90s, when you had Homer, Tim the Toolman, and Al Bundy on the TV at the same time. It seems to be finally ending after the ugliness of reality TV exposed both men AND women to the absolute gutter. Meyer is a horrible writer, but she's relying on concepts established in plenty of bad romance novels. Her badness isn't exactly unique.
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Post by Mr. Emoticon Man, TF Fan on Nov 3, 2009 23:38:56 GMT -5
All of the negativity aimed at this series has actually made me sorta interested in seeing it... so maybe I will, if my brother ends up having to take his fiance.
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