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Post by foreveryoung on Dec 29, 2009 13:27:58 GMT -5
And what would you do to fix these problems if you were booking/writing?
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Steveweiser
Dalek
Mickie Mickie You're So Fine... Hey Mickie!
THE GRAPS
Posts: 50,249
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Post by Steveweiser on Dec 29, 2009 13:29:22 GMT -5
1: Fire Hornswoggle 2: ? 3: Profit
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2009 13:30:25 GMT -5
1: Fire Hornswoggle 2: ? 3: Profit ...amazing. ;D
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Post by lildude8218 on Dec 29, 2009 13:31:18 GMT -5
Ignore the internet fans because they'll never be satisfied with anything
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Magician under the moonlight
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Always Beaten To The Punchline. Always.
A magician and a thief. That's Badass
Posts: 15,727
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Post by Magician under the moonlight on Dec 29, 2009 13:31:22 GMT -5
1: Fire Hornswoggle 2: ? 3: Profit I so love that South Park reference?
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2009 13:38:44 GMT -5
"Eventually, you do plan to have wrestling on your wrestling program, right?" Seriously though, all the nitpicking BS aside. We can argue all day long about who we do and don't like and who is and isn't worth the TV time, but the utter lack of wrestling on a wrestling program is the first thing that needs to be fixed.
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Post by Slingshot Suplay on Dec 29, 2009 13:40:59 GMT -5
2 hour show... 16 minutes of wrestling. That's my problem with RAW. Add a little more action, Add the TV title, to give guys like Carlito, Masters, Haas, Santino, Bourne and other lower card wrestlers direction. Have the Women's title go between raw and Smackdown and get rid of the diva's title.
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Toates Madhackrviper
King Koopa
Is owed an Admin life-debt.
This avatar is so far out of date I might as well stick with it forever now.
Posts: 10,723
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Post by Toates Madhackrviper on Dec 29, 2009 13:45:00 GMT -5
Horn - effing - swoggle
The only problem is, if I were booking I wouldn't change a thing about him. Because I can't deny, the fans pop for the swoggle. I just can't stand any skit he's in, and Little People's court made me ashamed to be a wrestling fan.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2009 13:47:22 GMT -5
Horn - effing - swoggle The only problem is, if I were booking I wouldn't change a thing about him. Because I can't deny, the fans pop for the swoggle. I just can't stand any skit he's in, and Little People's court made me ashamed to be a wrestling fan. To be serious, I think that the best thing to do with Hornswoggle may be to make him like Streaker Kendrick; no, I don't mean to have him streak, but to simply run out, do his thing and disappear, only to reappear later in the episode (or in his case, on the next episode) to do something else that's completely ludicrous. It gives the people the Hornswoggle they want without being overkill or taking too much time away from the actual plots and matches of a given show.
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Post by wrestlecrapcrap on Dec 29, 2009 14:00:18 GMT -5
The problems come when they have feuds that the fanbase is tired of. When they are doing something that hasn't been overdone, Raw hits more often than not for me. If you take shows like the Slammies and the Christmas episode as bits of fun, rather than serious episodes in the grand scheme of things, then they are far more tolerable.
I think HHH/Orton overstayed it's welcome this year, even though it started off well. That's a case of buzz in the feud dying out, and considering Cena was facing Big Show at the time, another feud that had been far overdone, it was dark times for Raw - but the problem was there was no-one else ready to step up.
Orton seems to go from being a strong heel one week to a coward the next. Sometimes he's a guy who Legacy massively respect, and has taught them an awful lot, and sometimes he's a coward who won't stay on fight. I can't understand why they let Sheamus stand tall through his own means with Cena, but rarely did they let Orton. I say this because when Orton was shown to be strong - in around the 2 weeks either side of the Royal Rumble, Raw was fantastic. When Orton goes psycho, like RKOing Dusty or generally playing mind-games with Legacy, Raw is intriguing. It's like they are too afraid that Orton will be cheered that they don't let him be who he can be often enough, and maybe his feuds suffer a bit for it. I know he kicked HHH out of action, but as soon as HHH comes back he's back to being a coward, or needing Legacy to do his work for him. If they just just let him get one up on HHH once or twice I would have sat up and took notice, and probably not have tired of the feud so early.
The Guest Host era has seen Cena/Orton be the main feud, and to be honest with the fanbase I don't think they tired of this as much as the IWC did. The feud wasn't ideally booked for me, they seemed to make Orton too much of a coward which I personally didn't like, but the audience didn't seem to mind. Now they've got Kofi and Sheamus feuding with main eventers, HHH not in the title scene, a mid-card that for the most part has a ton of potential and is getting over themselves with the audience. Raw is looking good for 2010.
Went off a bit on Orton there, it's just I thought Raw suffered mainly when they put the focus on HHH/Batista/Cena, and stripped away what made Orton entertaining, when he was such an interesting character, as opposed to older and more predictable.
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Post by mauled on Dec 29, 2009 14:37:27 GMT -5
I think a major factor is Hunter. The guy cannot stop burying potential new stars (or old ones for that matter) it was the same when was on Smackdown for that brief period. Somone needs to tell him that most wrestlers are more remembered for matches they have lost than won.
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Post by laughytaffy on Dec 29, 2009 15:16:00 GMT -5
1) Cutting to commercials during the damn matches 2) Hornswoggle 3) Guest hosts. Most of them are just bad 4) Hornswoggle 5) Hornswoggle
WWE should bring back JBL and make him the permanent RAW GM. Yeah yeah I can dream.
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Post by xxshoyuweeniexx on Dec 29, 2009 15:21:57 GMT -5
It's Triple H. I don't know why, but its always Triple H's fault.
That fiend caused Global Warming, shot JFK with a magic bullet, and ruined the ending Star Wars for me.
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Post by Crazy Diamond on Dec 29, 2009 15:23:30 GMT -5
I actually watched Raw with my younger sister yesterday and here's what I noticed from her reactions.
* "They talk too much" * "These endings don't make any sense" * "Why would you have Kofi wrestle once to challenge Miz and then have him wrestle again? Just have him wrestle for the belt the first time!" * "This guy looks like an idiot" ~ her reaction to John Cena * She laughed hard when Hornswoggle was about to Pedigree Chavo and not in a good way but in a "WTF?!" way. * "Why are the matches so short? What's the point in having fake fights if no fight lasts longer than three minutes?"
She essentially said all of that and she's in the target audience WWE is gearing their product to. The only thing she cared about was Sheamus attacking Cena as he was getting interviewed and that cracked her up because of Sheamus saying "Shut up!" Then she saw the match and was like "Who gives a ****?"
If it hadn't been for Timbaland and the Bret Hart announcement (wanted to see what Vince would do), I wouldn't have watched this episode. I hope TNA paid attention to this and figures out what they need to do come Jan. 4 because they've got a wide opening right now.
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Dave at the Movies
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
VINTAGE D-DAY DAVE! Always cranking dat thing.
Posts: 18,224
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Post by Dave at the Movies on Dec 29, 2009 15:28:00 GMT -5
End DX, get rid of Hornswoggle, and stop doing the stupid guest RAW host thing.
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AriadosMan
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Your friendly neighborhood superhero
Posts: 15,620
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Post by AriadosMan on Dec 29, 2009 15:29:43 GMT -5
Less talky segments. Make your champ look strong, regardless of face/heel status. Less stupid skits.
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SEAN CARLESS
Hank Scorpio
More of a B+ player, actually
I'm Necessary Evil.
Posts: 5,770
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Post by SEAN CARLESS on Dec 29, 2009 15:33:59 GMT -5
The biggest problem with RAW is the formulaic creative layout which is predicated on pure laziness. Every month they have a PPV, so the objective *should* be building intrigue for every single program on that show. That's the point of wrestling TV. Comedy doesn’t draw money. Relying exclusively on skits don’t pay the bills. And that means coming up with teases and confrontations that build to people actually wanting to pay for these matches. As it is, they have a busted, tired, lame formula where they interject the same parade on comical characters with interchangeable guest hosts and then wonder why it almost always falls flat. There's no progress. There's no character advancement. If you're going to insist on using Hornswoggle, at least do new zany things with him. Kramer was funny on Seinfeld, and he had shtick, but they changed up his wackiness every week to keep it entertaining. WWE doesn't seem to know how to do this. WWE doesn’t know how to take shtick and keep it interesting or create new situations. It’s always the same situations. Week after week after week.
Take Ron Simmons "damn" gimmick. Used sparingly for true "wtf" moments, it's funny. But in WWE land, instead of waiting for these true organic moments that arise on occasion, they instead wrote contrived unrealistic scenarios designed to shoe-horn the gimmick into the show whether it fit or not. That's RAW in a nutshell. Shoe-horned repetition of same exact gags, matches and concepts (like the handicap match) in lieu of making the show unique and "can't miss" by adding a true element of surprise. You can stop watching RAW for 5 months, plunk yourself down, and really have missed nothing. In a world where there are a zillion things on at the same time, that's terrible TV.
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Post by Apricots And A Pear Tree on Dec 29, 2009 15:34:00 GMT -5
"There are no problems with RAW"
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Post by Metalheadbanger Man on Dec 29, 2009 15:34:08 GMT -5
- Matches that go longer than 5 minutes, in lieu of silly skits involving C-list celebrities.
Fresh feuds. Mix things up a little bit.
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Post by Rorschach on Dec 29, 2009 15:42:29 GMT -5
I cannot disagree with a single thing that's been said thus far. And I think that's the biggest problem around these parts. It's not that a lot of us have a hard on for hating RAW....it's the fact that RAW has been so damn bad lately, with blatant problems that we just can't overlook and turn the other cheek on. EVERYTHING that's been said so far in this thread is correct, and how the WWE goes on thinking that nothing is wrong with the product just astounds me.
Sooner or later, like Domino's Pizza did, WWE is going to have to face the music and admit that they have problems, that things suck and that they HAVE to fix things.
As it stands right now, whoever it is that's booking things is booking the WWE right into oblivion, just like other territories did before them. They're running with a pat hand for far too long, they're booking ONE guy to be a monster above all other competitors (HHH) and they're not building new stars at ALL, regardless of what people might try and claim about Kofi and Miz and Morrison, ect. They gave those guys a mini push, but it appears to have fizzled badly. I'm not thinking that Kofi's going to take the WWE title ANYTIME soon, and for the WWE, that's a bad move right now.
Look, the best thing right now would be for the current champ to retain, for Cena to do something with HBK or Hunter, and for Kofi, or MVP, or even Mark Henry to challenge Sheamus. Get some ENTIRELY new blood into the Title picture. Do something truly shocking, and make it last.
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